2500HD 5.7 transmission overheating?

[napkinthief]

The decision is do I upgrade VB/SP and hope my clutches are good, or do I go allin on a new tranny. Each guy has to make this decision themselves. So now you are thinking the first, which I probably would do if it was me as well. If you want to know about the transmission upgrade past the VB/SP let me know I can post that as well. The rfe transmission upgrade blows the cost up a lot, even over a new oem transmission. It could go as high as 10 g's when an oem transmision I believe can be had 2400, that those are just for the unit, not labor.

even if i purchase an upgraded valvebody and there is an issue with the clutches, i can swap the valve body to the replacement trans?

im also seeing used trans for cheappp....200 bucks even. at that point, i would consider doing a full rebuild on a spare trans, then swapping out. itll keep my downtime to literally the day i decide to swap the trans. that way i can order whatever is worn..

 

[Burla]

If you want to know about that, you should ask sun coast or other custom transmission outfits if they will send a rebuilt transmission w/o the valve body solenoid pack. I have no idea about this answer, or if you will get proper credit for these items. That is part of what makes it a tough decision. If you have a same year and same drive train (2wd versus 4wd) ram trans as your truck for 200 and you want to rebuild it, sounds like a plan for sure.

 

[napkinthief]

Sorry. Are any years interchangable or just 2010?

 

[Burla]

They are all interchangeable, but only 2009/2010 is the 545. Research check balls if you want something different. Research enders thread on VB, it's all in that thread.

 

[Dtrannyman]

They are a decent trans. Not bullit proof but comparing to a lot of others, they were much much better. Few ever came in to my shop. And if I did get a call, I’d let the customer know that no one needs them - therefore they are CHEAP to buy. I’ve seen two odd weaknesses. One, the filter splits on the side and causes a slip when cold, in drive. It pulls in air at the split. The other is the accumulator plate screws will break and cause the accumulator springs and pistons to push out do you forces upon them. Again, I rarely got a call. I did old Rams and Silverados constantly! The RFE was much better

 

[napkinthief]

So i suctioned out the fluid dropped the pab still made a mess.

New fluid and filters in. The old fluid was burnt but not much stuff in the pan. Magnet had some fine dust debris assuming clutch plates wear material.

So... no more slipping in 4th. The rough shift seemed to disappear for a bit. Temps didnt go over 190 and i pushed it a bit up hills in 2nd 3rd and 4th.

Im going to drive it a bit more and see what happens.

 

[TheEnder]

So i suctioned out the fluid dropped the pab still made a mess.

New fluid and filters in. The old fluid was burnt but not much stuff in the pan. Magnet had some fine dust debris assuming clutch plates wear material.

So... no more slipping in 4th. The rough shift seemed to disappear for a bit. Temps didnt go over 190 and i pushed it a bit up hills in 2nd 3rd and 4th.

Im going to drive it a bit more and see what happens.

What fluid did you use? I’m using the o’reillys ATF+4 fluid and it LOVES to make the trans run hot, which is why i can’t wait to replace it with redline c+.


Sent from RAM

 

[Burla]

Temps still shouldn't be 190 in the rfe, the hottest mine gets even on a hot day towing is 146, and I do realize most probably run hotter, but I don't like that temp because it likely means it can get even hotter where problems happen.

 

[TheEnder]

Temps still shouldn't be 190 in the rfe, the hottest mine gets even on a hot day towing is 146, and I do realize most probably run hotter, but I don't like that temp because it likely means it can get even hotter where problems happen.

They shouldn’t be 190 in any situations, mine runs pretty hot from what i’ve seen in most RFEs, (150-170 in normal conditions), but sitting and idling in drive makes it get as high as 183. But my condenser is caked up from living in the country, so that explains that. Having a RFE get over 190 and into the 200s is a recipe for disaster.


Sent from RAM

 

[TheEnder]

Just wanted to leave this here, FLUID QUALITY MATTERS. If you get ****** cheap fluid and actually use it for hard applications, it’ll run worse, not dissipate heat like it’s supposed to, and cause a situation like this. Mopar ATF+4 is “the best” you can get without stepping up to c+, and the cheap 20$ store brand ATF is probably the worst you can buy.


Sent from RAM

 

[Burla]

Redline c+ may or may not let you run cooler, but because it is ester base the oil doesn't break down in heat, and if you read below the chart you see what happens is a failure in the oil, which just isn't gonna happen with c+. Even though I believe this chart may be for PCMO, the same applies for transmission use, it is the temp range that matters not the applications...

Redline c+ is base oils from the second and 5th line, and most other transmissions oils at4 come from line 1. Which is why the zf transmission doesn't use base oil from line one, because they operate in that 190f range and hotter, so they need the same base oil as redline gives. Redline even goes further in heat protection then zf8 pao base, as they are pao plus esters.

 

[TheEnder]

Redline c+ may or may not let you run cooler, but because it is ester base the oil doesn't break down in heat, and if you read below the chart you see what happens is a failure in the oil, which just isn't gonna happen with c+. Even though I believe this chart may be for PCMO, the same applies for transmission use, it is the temp range that matters not the applications...

Redline c+ is base oils from the second and 5th line, and most other transmissions oils at4 come from line 1. Which is why the zf transmission doesn't use base oil from line one, because they operate in that 190f range and hotter, so they need the same base oil as redline gives. Redline even goes further in heat protection then xf pao base, as they are pao plus esters.

Thank you for the chart, it helps out. I have a folder on my computer i use for all of this stuff, haha. And yes, that explains why ZF8 oil is green instead of red like how it is normally.


Sent from RAM

 

[TheEnder]

im gonna get to it in a bit, i really appreciate your help guys..


just one question. i notice replacement valve body come in a lot of varieties. i saw some posts saying certain ones will cause issues or throw CEL. where should i be shopping for one?

I didn’t see this until now, so i’m sorry if you already purchased and are just getting this now. But...

There are differences in these valve bodies, for one, the number of check balls and that’s about it, aside from the separator plate that goes in between the bottom plate and top plate of the valve body itself.

For instance, install a gray solenoid pack (designed for 5 check ball valve bodies) onto a 7 check ball valve body and you’re not going to have any gears above 1st, and when the transmission attempts to shift into 2nd you’re going to be met with a VERY harsh shift and it’s gonna act like the second gear clutches are burnt out and it’s gonna slip like it’s in neutral.

But, here’s a work around for that. If your truck has a gray solenoid pack, and you accidentally purchased a 7 check ball valve body, you can drop a white solenoid pack on it and everything will work fine, but you’re gonna need a relearn. I’ll drop images of how to tell in a bit, but for starters, what’s the color of your solenoid pack? You can check this by removing the connector on the left side of the trans and just looking at the connector.

Edit: I know crap tons about this trans as i’ve torn one down before and have spent the past year doing research on them...


Sent from RAM

 

[napkinthief]

OK so as it sits right now..

i replaced filters and fluid with no name brand atf+4. the old fluid was burnt.

immediately after replacing, i didnt notice any change.

after further researching, i purchased alfaobd, and i did the transmission pcm reset.

immediately after reset, just slowly going around the block, the truck felt completely different (more power, very responsive pedal). i put about 2 miles on it around town (<25mph). then i did a 30 min highway cruise, from 30mph to about 85mph slowly accelerating and decelerating. in my head, this was helping the new fluid get to the clutch plates (not sure if its true or not)

the harsh shift seems to be completely gone. i didnt notice any slipping in any gear, and highway cruise temps are way down.

Temperatures, interestingly enough. seems to get up to about 145 within 15 min of driving normally. itll sit there for a while fluctuating between 145ish to 160. it seems stop n go red lights, where id use 1>2>3 then stop is when it pushes the temps up to the 180 point.

i could try swapping to the mopar fluid, i just used what i could get late that day

 

[napkinthief]

I didn’t see this until now, so i’m sorry if you already purchased and are just getting this now. But...

There are differences in these valve bodies, for one, the number of check balls and that’s about it, aside from the separator plate that goes in between the bottom plate and top plate of the valve body itself.

For instance, install a gray solenoid pack (designed for 5 check ball valve bodies) onto a 7 check ball valve body and you’re not going to have any gears above 1st, and when the transmission attempts to shift into 2nd you’re going to be met with a VERY harsh shift and it’s gonna act like the second gear clutches are burnt out and it’s gonna slip like it’s in neutral.

But, here’s a work around for that. If your truck has a gray solenoid pack, and you accidentally purchased a 7 check ball valve body, you can drop a white solenoid pack on it and everything will work fine, but you’re gonna need a relearn. I’ll drop images of how to tell in a bit, but for starters, what’s the color of your solenoid pack? You can check this by removing the connector on the left side of the trans and just looking at the connector.

Edit: I know crap tons about this trans as i’ve torn one down before and have spent the past year doing research on them...


Sent from RAM

i havent purchased anything yet. just part store fluid and filters to see if it helped at all. and it is helping.. im still on the fence to get a trans and rebuild then swap over. i want to, it just seems only a 09-10 ram 2500 4x4 trans is compatible. would be much cheaper if i can use say a 2005 ram 4x4 2500 545rfe, and just swap my valve body/xfercase etc over. i asked around locally and its looking like 2200-2400 for a rebuild trans. at that point id just buy an oem trans and swap it myself. still dont know what to do, i may even jus resell the truck and find something more reliable, as this truck seems to need a ton of more work even

 

[TheEnder]

OK so as it sits right now..

i replaced filters and fluid with no name brand atf+4. the old fluid was burnt.

immediately after replacing, i didnt notice any change.

after further researching, i purchased alfaobd, and i did the transmission pcm reset.

immediately after reset, just slowly going around the block, the truck felt completely different (more power, very responsive pedal). i put about 2 miles on it around town (<25mph). then i did a 30 min highway cruise, from 30mph to about 85mph slowly accelerating and decelerating. in my head, this was helping the new fluid get to the clutch plates (not sure if its true or not)

the harsh shift seems to be completely gone. i didnt notice any slipping in any gear, and highway cruise temps are way down.

Temperatures, interestingly enough. seems to get up to about 145 within 15 min of driving normally. itll sit there for a while fluctuating between 145ish to 160. it seems stop n go red lights, where id use 1>2>3 then stop is when it pushes the temps up to the 180 point.

i could try swapping to the mopar fluid, i just used what i could get late that day

180 is Chrysler’s “operating temp” for the 68RFE so you’re fine, albeit thats warmer than most tend to run. What’s the outside temp when it’s hitting 180?


Sent from RAM

 

[RaptorHD]

Curious, Does your truck have this on the transmission lines? I know the 68RFE does,,,but if you have one I would bet this is your issue!
https://www.xtremediesel.com/xdp-tr...RilPxtphX0cabjFipPGeyvbz_sQR0ZLhoCnRwQAvD_BwE

 

[Burla]

It's a 2010, I don't think he has that rotten vegetation on his truck. But the OP should check for this garbage for sure, you never know.

 

[napkinthief]

Just throwing back an update here. Added another 350 miles or so.

There is no more slipping in any gear. There is an occasional hard upshift/downshift. Also sometimes on uphill, it seems trans is in too high of a gear. Even flooring the pedal wont make it downshift. If i approach the hill with rpms up and pedal down over 30% or so, it goes up the hill fine. If i slowly try to increase speed it doesnt want to shift. If i stop and go again it goes through 1st and shifts up the hill fine.

Im probably going to drive it another 500 or so then replace fluid again to the dealer mopar jug.

 

[RaptorHD]

Pressure Sensor??
If he has no thermal bypass, I would suspect that sucker!

here is cut and paste...

Common Problems with the 545RFE
Delayed and/or harsh 3-4 or 4-5 shifts
Problem – Owners may experience an unusually delayed or harsh 3-4 or 4-5 gear change, where the transmission doesn’t seem to want to go into that particular gear.
Solution – This issue is related to valve body problems where the material used to make one of the checkballs has broken down to the point that fluid is able to get past and engage the underdrive clutch during those shifts. An upgraded #2 checkball will be needed to solve the issue.

Solenoid Pack: With no transmission bands, the electronically controlled 545RFE relies on a solenoid switch pack to direct fluid to the correct clutch pack for gear engagement. If the solenoid pack goes bad, you’ll experience no gear engagement, engine stalling, ‘limp mode’, or failure to engage overdrive.

Slipping and Delayed Gear Engagement: The transmission pump has a little valve mechanism inside it, which controls the fluid pressure being transferred from the torque converter. If it goes bad, you’ll have delayed gear engagement, transmission/torque converter overheating, stalling, slipping, and reduced fuel economy.

Another common problem is overheating. This happens when the moving parts inside the transmission are creating more friction heat than the ATF can remove. The most common cause of this condition is towing heavy loads, driving in stop/go traffic, or on mountain roads where the transmission has to shift a lot.

Updates to Remanufactured 545RFE Transmissions

• Fully remanufactured valve body includes updated solenoid switch valves for improved shifting, lubrication, and performance.
• Fully remanufactured torque converter is tested for leaks, lockup, concentricity, and balance. Upgrades exceed OE requirements and eliminate the possibility of front seal leaks, premature bushing wear, and vibration.
• Completely remanufactured pump, complete with updated TCC limit valve and TCC accumulator to ensure proper TCC control and cooler flow, provides consistent internal pressures, eliminating slippage and delayed engagement.
• New line pressure sensor maintains consistent shift quality.
• Secured accumulator cover bolts prevent loss of 3rd or 4th gear.
• Fully remanufactured solenoid packs are tested separately from the transmission before dyno testing to verify shift quality and pressure control.
• All-new custom-spec bushings improve internal fluid flow control and pressures.
• Bushings and machined surfaces polished to a mirror-like OE finish of 16 RA or less.
• Complete system correction and recalibration kit installed to address several OE flaws. Modifications include updates to servos, the PR system, and valve body accumulators.
• Heavy-duty recalibration kit installed to reduce slippage and increase durability.
• Complete road simulation using a dynamometer testing program called C.A.R.S. (Computer Aided Road Simulation). Every transmission is cold and hot tested before shipment.