2012 Cam / Lifter swap questions

[gtx6970]

Hello Gents , New here so bear with me.

I have a 2012 ram and have come to the conclusion ( unfortunately ) I need to replace cam / lifters.
Ive been told so far to delete the MDS completely, remove the solenoids and install delete plugs in the block, says it allows more oil to lube the lifters / cam lobes ? True ?

Also told its a good idea to upgrade to a 6.4 cam. helps on towing, That said I only have the trailer behind it maybe 3 times a year tops, Worth it ? Anything else required if I do said cam swap ?

I am a former 25 years as a Dodge dealer tech but was gone from the dealership game right about the time this generation truck came out. So have never done this procedeure before. But Im more than capable to do so. Not that I want to either trust me. But Paying someone else 4 or 5 K to do it isnt in my mindset either.

Also, It appears the Mopar brand lifters are on back order, Is there another quality option ? Be it if I keep the MDS or delete it is still undecided

Empty I can get into low 20s for fuel mileage,,,IF I keep my foot out of it and at a reasonable MPH

With the trailer behind it , be it empty or loaded doesnt seem to make much difference in MPGs

Wondering if deleting the MDS how much will it change that?

 

[Bigskyroadglide]

Nice looking truck. @Wild one will be along soon to give advice on avoiding the 6.4 cam and the benefits/drawbaccks of MDS delete.

Great forum for this type of issue.

 

[Wild one]

Hello Gents , New here so bear with me.

I have a 2012 ram and have come to the conclusion ( unfortunately ) I need to replace cam / lifters.
Ive been told so far to delete the MDS completely, remove the solenoids and install delete plugs in the block, says it allows more oil to lube the lifters / cam lobes ? True ?

Also told its a good idea to upgrade to a 6.4 cam. helps on towing, That said I only have the trailer behind it maybe 3 times a year tops, Worth it ? Anything else required if I do said cam swap ?

I am a former 25 years as a Dodge dealer tech but was gone from the dealership game right about the time this generation truck came out. So have never done this procedeure before. But Im more than capable to do so. Not that I want to either trust me. But Paying someone else 4 or 5 K to do it isnt in my mindset either.

Also, It appears the Mopar brand lifters are on back order, Is there another quality option ? Be it if I keep the MDS or delete it is still undecided

Empty I can get into low 20s for fuel mileage,,,IF I keep my foot out of it and at a reasonable MPH

With the trailer behind it , be it empty or loaded doesnt seem to make much difference in MPGs

Wondering if deleting the MDS how much will it change that?

View attachment 551880

Don't do a 6.4 cam,there's lots better cams then it.Check out MMX,i think Byron has the OEM lifters in stock and includes them with alot of his cam kits,another outfit to check out is FRP/Flying Ryan Performance as i think their cam kits also come with OEM lifters. The only other lifters with a decent rep are the Johnson lifters with axle oiling,but they require a high volume oil pump to offset the internal oil leak they create.Other then OEM and Johnson lifters,nobody else makes a lifter that's worth $h!t,and that includes Comp Cams lifters.
Hunt up phone numbers to both,and phone them,i still believe in talking to a person,not a keyboard

5.7L HEMI Performance Camshafts - MMX Modern Muscle Xtreme

5.7L HEMI Performance Camshafts

www.modernmusclextreme.com

Hemi Cam Kits

Texas-Based Mopar Parts House

frptuning.com

 

[DILLIGAF]

What he said !

 

[Daw14]

Don't do a 6.4 cam,there's lots better cams then it.Check out MMX,i think Byron has the OEM lifters in stock and includes them with alot of his cam kits,another outfit to check out is FRP/Flying Ryan Performance as i think their cam kits also come with OEM lifters. The only other lifters with a decent rep are the Johnson lifters with axle oiling,but they require a high volume oil pump to offset the internal oil leak they create.Other then OEM and Johnson lifters,nobody else makes a lifter that's worth $h!t,and that includes Comp Cams lifters.
Hunt up phone numbers to both,and phone them,i still believe in talking to a person,not a keyboard

5.7L HEMI Performance Camshafts - MMX Modern Muscle Xtreme

5.7L HEMI Performance Camshafts

www.modernmusclextreme.com

Hemi Cam Kits

Texas-Based Mopar Parts House

frptuning.com

Absolutely sound advice , this is the way.

 

[Wild one]

Hello Gents , New here so bear with me.

I have a 2012 ram and have come to the conclusion ( unfortunately ) I need to replace cam / lifters.
Ive been told so far to delete the MDS completely, remove the solenoids and install delete plugs in the block, says it allows more oil to lube the lifters / cam lobes ? True ?

Also told its a good idea to upgrade to a 6.4 cam. helps on towing, That said I only have the trailer behind it maybe 3 times a year tops, Worth it ? Anything else required if I do said cam swap ?

I am a former 25 years as a Dodge dealer tech but was gone from the dealership game right about the time this generation truck came out. So have never done this procedeure before. But Im more than capable to do so. Not that I want to either trust me. But Paying someone else 4 or 5 K to do it isnt in my mindset either.

Also, It appears the Mopar brand lifters are on back order, Is there another quality option ? Be it if I keep the MDS or delete it is still undecided

Empty I can get into low 20s for fuel mileage,,,IF I keep my foot out of it and at a reasonable MPH

With the trailer behind it , be it empty or loaded doesnt seem to make much difference in MPGs

Wondering if deleting the MDS how much will it change that?

View attachment 551880

Dave Webber of MMX just posted this on facebook an hour ago,if you want lifters

Hellcat HEMI Lifters by MOPAR

Hellcat HEMI Lifters by MOPAR-Set of 16

www.modernmusclextreme.com

 

[gtx6970]

Also,
What are the chances it hurt bearings in the lower end?

Everything Im finding . seems A LOT of people simply do the cam lifer swap and go on.
I wll be doing an oil pump change while I have it opened up

 

[DILLIGAF]

Just check you VVT solenoid for debris and send it.

Here is a base tune for you https://drive.google.com/file/d/19KxMykUhS2TexG6yNWqBVwomqFeuxcpB/view?usp=drive_link

 

[gtx6970]

Thanks all so far.

I will be in parts order mode the next few days and will take all the advise in so far.
Its not a hot rod or race truck by any means. So Im not looking for a huge / squeeze every last HP out of it by any means ( or hurt fuel mileage if I can help it )
Just maybe a little more umph for when I have the trailer behind it IF I can gain a little while its apart.
My biggest concern is I only want to do this one time. As I intend to keep the truck for the long term
Right now, I'm trying to find someone local who can disable the MDS and make an idle speed adjustment.

PS, I will be replacing the VVT solenoid while its apart

 

[DILLIGAF]

You an do that yourself with HP tuners in your driveway You literally just type in what idle RPM you want

 

[gtx6970]

Just check you VVT solenoid for debris and send it.

Here is a base tune for you https://drive.google.com/file/d/19KxMykUhS2TexG6yNWqBVwomqFeuxcpB/view?usp=drive_link

I cant see that via the link

 

[gtx6970]

PS, Im looking at this kit, in a stage 3 cam
Plus adding a melling high volume . more pressure oil pump

Im on a little bit of a budget and I need to get my truck back in service.
So am thinking do the cam swap . MDS delete and live with the ck engine light on for a bit

Then later have the PCMs MDS disabled

Thoughts

AMS Racing Low Lift Performance Non MDS Camshaft Kit for 2009+ Dodge 5.7L Hemi | eBay

MDS Solenoid Plugs. -AMS Racing Head Bolt Set. AMS Racing "Butch Camsidy" Outlaw Cam for 2009+ Chrysler Dodge Jeep 5.7L Hemi. AMS Racing "Jesse Cams" Outlaw Cam for 2009+ Chrysler Dodge Jeep 5.7L Hemi.

www.ebay.com

 

[Wild one]

Thanks all so far.

I will be in parts order mode the next few days and will take all the advise in so far.
Its not a hot rod or race truck by any means. So Im not looking for a huge / squeeze every last HP out of it by any means ( or hurt fuel mileage if I can help it )
Just maybe a little more umph for when I have the trailer behind it IF I can gain a little while its apart.
My biggest concern is I only want to do this one time. As I intend to keep the truck for the long term
Right now, I'm trying to find someone local who can disable the MDS and make an idle speed adjustment.

PS, I will be replacing the VVT solenoid while its apart

If you change to a HV pump,install the stock bypass spring out of your oriiginal pump. If you want,you could install a washer under the spring to bump up the bypass pressure slightly.
Honestly if you bump the idle rpm to 750 rpm,you'll have basically the same oil pressure as the hv volume pump creates at 600 rpm,and the hv pump isn't really an upgrade at that point.

 

[gtx6970]

If you change to a HV pump,install the stock bypass spring out of your oriiginal pump. If you want,you could install a washer under the spring to bump up the bypass pressure slightly.
Honestly if you bump the idle rpm to 750 rpm,you'll have basically the same oil pressure as the hv volume pump creates at 600 rpm,and the hv pump isn't really an upgrade at that point.

Thanks for the info. So . If I understand this correctly. Do the cam swap / MDS delete pkg. Once the hurt from this passes.

Then I can do the ECM reprogram MDS delete / idle speed change etc via a reprogramer of some sort at a later date , And the only issue is I will have a ck engine light on until then.?

Sounds like I could take the pump apart and clean it up. if not scored . Just reuse it.?

Recently I thought the noise was a cracked flexplate, so had it changed , obviously didnt fix anything. So that was $1000 pissed away.

Having recently retired and sinking $2500 into this right now is not an easy pill to swallow. $1500 is bad enough. But I really dont want to have to do this again in a few years.


Again, thanks for all the info and guidance so far . Its very much appreciated

 

[DILLIGAF]

It wont run without a tune

 

[Wild one]

Thanks for the info. So . If I understand this correctly. Do the cam swap / MDS delete pkg. Once the hurt from this passes.

Then I can do the ECM reprogram MDS delete / idle speed change etc via a reprogramer of some sort at a later date , And the only issue is I will have a ck engine light on until then.?

Sounds like I could take the pump apart and clean it up. if not scored . Just reuse it.?

Recently I thought the noise was a cracked flexplate, so had it changed , obviously didnt fix anything. So that was $1000 pissed away.

Having recently retired and sinking $2500 into this right now is not an easy pill to swallow. $1500 is bad enough. But I really dont want to have to do this again in a few years.


Again, thanks for all the info and guidance so far . Its very much appreciated

As Dilligaf stated you're going to need a tune,unless you go with something like one of MMX's NTR / No Tune Required cams.Apparently those will run with-out a tune,but even MMX says they'll work better with a tune

5.7 VVT HEMI NO TUNE REQUIRED NSR MDS Performance NA Camshaft by MMX

5.7 VVT HEMI Performance Camshaft Kit - NA No Tune Required Non MDS by MMX

www.modernmusclextreme.com

5.7L HEMI Performance Camshafts - MMX Modern Muscle Xtreme

5.7L HEMI Performance Camshafts

www.modernmusclextreme.com

 

[gtx6970]

Even if I go with this one .
The ck engine light will still be on, due to the MDS system will be disabled , correct ?

5.7 VVT HEMI NO TUNE REQUIRED NSR MDS Performance NA Camshaft by MMX

5.7 VVT HEMI Performance Camshaft Kit - NA No Tune Required Non MDS by MMX

www.modernmusclextreme.com

5.7 VVT HEMI NO TUNE REQUIRED NSR MDS Performance NA Camshaft by MMX

5.7 VVT HEMI Performance Camshaft Kit - NA No Tune Required Non MDS by MMX

www.modernmusclextreme.com

 

[Wild one]

Even if I go with this one .
The ck engine light will still be on, due to the MDS system will be disabled , correct ?

5.7 VVT HEMI NO TUNE REQUIRED NSR MDS Performance NA Camshaft by MMX

5.7 VVT HEMI Performance Camshaft Kit - NA No Tune Required Non MDS by MMX

www.modernmusclextreme.com

5.7 VVT HEMI NO TUNE REQUIRED NSR MDS Performance NA Camshaft by MMX

5.7 VVT HEMI Performance Camshaft Kit - NA No Tune Required Non MDS by MMX

www.modernmusclextreme.com

Yes,but at least you'll be able to drive it for a few weeks till you can tune it,or have somebody disable the mds for you.I'm no fan of Diablo,but if all you wanted to do is disable MDS and maybe up the speed limiter,you can do that with a Diablo handheld tuner

 

[gtx6970]

This one for example comes with a tuner

Ive talked to a AMS rep and all the tech support staff is out , sounds like due to storm aftermath

But, looks like $1525 plus tax for everything including Mopar brand lifters
But he says this kit comes with a tuner to turn the MDS off and makes some minor tweaks so to speak , A Tow tune, Perf tune , tire change speedometer calibrations etc etc

But said tuner is Vin matched to the truck once used , which I dont have an issue with

And like you guys mentioned if I was to upgrade to anything but stock 5.7 non MDS cam, an outside source custom tune is required , as well as valve springs recommended.

 

[gtx6970]

MDS Delete Install Kit and Tuning Package for 2009-2014 Dodge Ram 5.7L Hemi Engines

Kit Contents Note: This kit will not work for 2500 trucks. (1) Non-MDS Camshaft (Stock Specs)Your Choice of Lifters ("No Thanks, I have my own" Choice = No Lifters)(1) Complete Head Gasket Set(1) Timing Cover Gasket Set(1) Complete Head Bolt Set(4) MDS Solenoid Plugs(1) Diablosport Predator 2...

www.amsracing.net