Bolt Ons VS Blower

[2010 Infantry Vet]

Ok, I have been following a lot of bolt on parts for the 5.7 on our rams that are popular.
Pedal commander $300.
Long tubes $1,500.
Cold air intake $300.
Trinity T2 $630.
Unlocked pcm $600.
Moes 87mm TB $380.
Total $3,710.

Pro charger supercharger kit $5,750.

Used 40,000 mile 6.4 hemi $5,000.

So question is...why would you spend all of that money on bolt ons that produce a small amount of power, when you can have a supercharger for another $2,000?

For another $1290. you can have a low mileage 6.4

 

[chrisp2493]

Because it’s not that simple. Lots of time and effort go into a boosted truck. Lots of other upgrades that go along with it, fuel system upgrades, tuning, and that’s all if you are capable of doing all that yourself. Most people aren’t and would have to pay a shop to do the installs and that would almost double the cost. And most of those mods you mentioned are complimentary to the supercharger, like the tuner, longtubes, throttle body and such. So all that cost gets added to the supercharger. Most of the basic bolt on mods don’t make enough power to worry about the transmission handling it. Not so much with a supercharger. Follow any other the guys running boost and every one will be complaining about the transmissions. Then you see you can only run 6-8lbs of boost, then you start looking into building a forged engine. So now you kinda see it will easily start running over 15 grand in the end on top of having the truck down for however long it’s gonna take to do it all. I’ve been building my truck for over a year now, and it’s been almost a full time commitment.

 

[Bldrinker]

Why not buy something that’s faster to begin with?

 

[Gary's Hemi]

With a blower you have to start worrying about the trans and have to stay w/in lower boost #'s for the block. W/ bolt ons you can still have a fun truck fairly cheap. My reg cab is running mid 12's w/ basic bolt ons w/ stock manifolds on 22" street tires.

IMO I would skip the tb, get the Diablo I3 and do JBA headers. Thats over $1000 saved.

The tb will give you better throttle response but not much for wot. I have had both a tb & Peddle Commander(both throttle response mods) and the PC is the better buy.

The Trinity has some neato features but the I3 more than gets the job done for less money.

I have had everything from $300 headers to $1500 headers. From having both the extra money spent isnt worth it. Get JBA's and save the rest for something else.

A few guys are superchargerd. 1 went an 11.85 a few weeks ago w/ a whipple, lt's, tune, dss driveshaft and drag radials/track wheels in a 2017 R/T w/ a base supercharger tune BUT he also killed the 8 speed trans FAST....w/in 3 weeks of having the whipple.

Its all in what you want and what your pocket book allows.

 

[Gary's Hemi]

The 6.4 is a pretty straight forward swap from the guys that have done it. I'd love to run across 1 locally & do the swap

 

[2010 Infantry Vet]

The 6.4 is a pretty straight forward swap from the guys that have done it. I'd love to run across 1 locally & do the swap

That is why i started this thread. To get everyones perspective and input. Im sure a lot of guys on here are not comfortable removing and installing a motor, but its really not hard. Especially if you are swapping in a complete used motor. The old days of timing and jetting a carb are over. Plug and play the new computer, and get a custom dyno tune...too easy. You can even rent an engine puller.
When my bone stock motor kicks the bucket (currently has 120,000 miles) i will be swapping in a stock 6.4L or a forged 6.4 and add a kenne belle blower that fits the 6.4 over time. Kenne bell only makes blowers for the 6.4 not the 5.7. They are the best blowers on the market.
One thing I would like to know is, if the 6.4 tranny needs to be swapped in with the motor, and HP/TQ numbers it is safe for.

6.4L challenger motor makes 485 FWHP, 475 FWTQ verses the 5.7 390 FWHP, 410 FWTQ.

 

[chrisp2493]

I think the challengers use a NAG 1 transmission, I looked into that swap and it seemed very expensive and not many people had completed it in a truck. I think there might be a different kind of “holding capability” difference between the truck and cars due to the extra weight you are dealing with

 

[Wild one]

I think the challengers use a NAG 1 transmission, I looked into that swap and it seemed very expensive and not many people had completed it in a truck. I think there might be a different kind of “holding capability” difference between the truck and cars due to the extra weight you are dealing with

The newer 2014+ SRT 8 6.4 Challengers/Chargers use the same 8HP70 as our trucks do.

 

[chrisp2493]

The newer 2014+ SRT 8 6.4 Challengers/Chargers use the same 8HP70 as our trucks do.

Ahh I see. When I was looking at the nags I was looking for the older ones

 

[2010 Infantry Vet]

That is why i started this thread. To get everyones perspective and input. Im sure a lot of guys on here are not comfortable removing and installing a motor, but its really not hard. Especially if you are swapping in a complete used motor. The old days of timing and jetting a carb are over. Plug and play the new computer, and get a custom dyno tune...too easy. You can even rent an engine puller.
When my bone stock motor kicks the bucket (currently has 120,000 miles) i will be swapping in a stock 6.4L or a forged 6.4 and add a kenne belle blower that fits the 6.4 over time. Kenne bell only makes blowers for the 6.4 not the 5.7. They are the best blowers on the market.
One thing I would like to know is, if the 6.4 tranny needs to be swapped eith the motor. Stock A5 6.4 challenger tranny can handle 525RWHP before it starts slipping

6.4L challenger motor makes 485 FWHP, 475 FWTQ verses the 5.7 390 FWHP, 410 FWTQ.

.

 

[boomstick]

to add to this. if you buy a new whipple its about 7000 dollars if you go procharger a full kit is about 6700. a 6.4 apache swap is about 8500. full bolt on 5.7 can be done for about 2500. the whipple and procharger will give you close to or just above 500 to the wheels pending on other mods. the 6.4 apache will give you about 450 to the wheels and the full bolt on 5.7 im guessing will give you about 385 to the wheels. the 8 speed will hold most of the time to any of these scenarios. i myself will most likely be putting my procharger back on my 6.4 apache at 5 psi which should put me around 575 to the wheels which will be a little over what the 8 speed is rated for

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[2010 Infantry Vet]

Ahh I see. When I was looking at the nags I was looking for the older ones

So the older challengers used the A5

The newer 2014+ SRT 8 6.4 Challengers/Chargers use the same 8HP70 as our trucks do.

From what i have gathered, the A5 tranny is the one to get. But what model was it made in?

 

[2010 Infantry Vet]

to add to this. if you buy a new whipple its about 7000 dollars if you go procharger a full kit is about 6700. a 6.4 apache swap is about 8500. full bolt on 5.7 can be done for about 2500. the whipple and procharger will give you close to or just above 500 to the wheels pending on other mods. the 6.4 apache will give you about 450 to the wheels and the full bolt on 5.7 im guessing will give you about 385 to the wheels. the 8 speed will hold most of the time to any of these scenarios. i myself will most likely be putting my procharger back on my 6.4 apache at 5 psi which should put me around 575 to the wheels which will be a little over what the 8 speed is rated for

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I would need to see some dyno numbers to support the 385RWHP claim from bolt ons. Those numbers seem a lot high. Stock 5.7 ram 1500 makes 300 RWHP.
Used 6.4 challenger motor can be had for $5K if you do the swap yourself. Sounds like a nice plan you have for your 6.4 sir. Kudos on being smart and not pushing the boost past what the tranny can hold.

 

[boomstick]

stock is around 330 to the wheels .i may be high but its close id say it's within 20 of that atleast. tune 35hp, headers 20 to 25, vararam, fan delete, underdrive pulley, thermostat might get you 10 more but these havent been checked on a dyno so its hard to say but the point i was making is that its very expensive to go fast/make power and 500 to the wheels is power but its not that impressive any more with what manufacturer's are producing nowdays. my next vehicle will stay stock because there will always be somebody faster and a year after you put all that time and money in a vehicle your behind again.

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[theviking]

A few guys are superchargerd. 1 went an 11.85 a few weeks ago w/ a whipple, lt's, tune, dss driveshaft and drag radials/track wheels in a 2017 R/T w/ a base supercharger tune BUT he also killed the 8 speed trans FAST....w/in 3 weeks of having the whipple.

Its all in what you want and what your pocket book allows.

That's the first I've heard of the 8 speed grenading quickly. I thought they held up pretty well under abuse.

 

[2010 Infantry Vet]

stock is around 330 to the wheels .i may be high but its close id say it's within 20 of that atleast. tune 35hp, headers 20 to 25, vararam, fan delete, underdrive pulley, thermostat might get you 10 more but these havent been checked on a dyno so its hard to say but the point i was making is that its very expensive to go fast/make power and 500 to the wheels is power but its not that impressive any more with what manufacturer's are producing nowdays. my next vehicle will stay stock because there will always be somebody faster and a year after you put all that time and money in a vehicle your behind again.

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35 rwhp from a tune, and 20-25 rwhp from headers??? I got to see these dyno charts! Also different dynos and elevations fluctuate numbers. The mustang dyno is the most reliable and realistic. If you have dyno photos, please post them.

 

[Gary's Hemi]

35 rwhp from a tune, and 20-25 rwhp from headers??? I got to see these dyno charts! Also different dynos and elevations fluctuate numbers. The mustang dyno is the most reliable and realistic. If you have dyno photos, please post them.

I dont have dyno numbers BUT I have track numbers to compar. I gained .78 in the 1/4 mile from a motor tune, clutch fan delete & 180* T-stat. Another .15 from the trans tune when it came out. Nothing else changed between those times except removing Moes tb and going back to stock.

Then I picked up another .19 in the 1/4 mile from just getting my suspension right(better shocks to get my 60' down and Illicit brackets for 60' and wobble on big end).

Then I dropped .11 in the 1/4 from simply removing the cats. I still have stock manifolds and I already had a high flow y pipe. So .11 from just removing cats imagine that plus longtubes.

ALOT is picked up on the 8 speed trucks from a tune and lt's/no cats.

 

[mondo]

Whats the deal with the pedal commander? Does it just change the % of throttle input/tip in? The same input that you can change with the trinity also??

Reminds me of a sprint booster back in the day. Everybody raved about it when they came out for the jeep srt8 back in 07...lol

 

[Casper]

Ok, I have been following a lot of bolt on parts for the 5.7 on our rams that are popular.
Pedal commander $300.
Long tubes $1,500.
Cold air intake $300.
Trinity T2 $630.
Unlocked pcm $600.
Moes 87mm TB $380.
Total $3,710.

Pro charger supercharger kit $5,750.

Used 40,000 mile 6.4 hemi $5,000.

So question is...why would you spend all of that money on bolt ons that produce a small amount of power, when you can have a supercharger for another $2,000?

For another $1290. you can have a low mileage 6.4

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"That was Easy!"

 

[chrisp2493]

xxxxxxxxx
Wife
Warranty
Cash Flow

"That was Easy!"

“Hey babe I gotta buy these headers for $800 because my manifold bolts are broken” is way better then “Hey babe I’m gonna drop 7 grand on a supercharger”

Not everybody’s situation but you get the idea lol