Interesting tidbit about 8 speed fluid at the end of this .

[JS4024]

More snake oil... this stuff should be banned. The transmission should be running in the 170 - 200 range. If you are pounding the **** out of it as inferred here adding this mod and this cooler will not make your transmission last any longer. It is not built to get hammered every day, it’s build for the average driver who doesn’t need to lay down 20.00 worth of tire material showing off at every stop light.

 

[Dusty]

Yeah I saw the ending of their ad, not buying that there is no other fluid supplement for a transmission that’s been available for 12 years.

Would be nice to see data behind their claims, one can only speculate some sort of fluid monopoly with ZF/Mopar without it.

The ZF transmission fluid is a proprietary fluid patented by ZF. No one else can make the fluid to the exact recipe unless ZF grants (or sells) a license. Nor can anyone make the legal claim of compatibility unless certified by ZF. This was exactly the same situation with ATF-3 and ATF-4.

It's not just a monopoly effect. ZF is sensitive to the viability and long-term effects of the fluid going into their transmissions. And it's not just viscosity they're worried about. There are other things to consider, such as seal compatibility, temperature range, anti-corrosion protection, etc. This is why they are concerned about what goes into their transmissions. If a fluid of another type not meeting ZF's specs is used and causes a failure, people will have tendency to blame the transmission and not the sub-adequate fluid.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33 gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 03 June 2018. Now at: 041975 miles.

 

[Wild one]

More snake oil... this stuff should be banned. The transmission should be running in the 170 - 200 range. If you are pounding the **** out of it as inferred here adding this mod and this cooler will not make your transmission last any longer. It is not built to get hammered every day, it’s build for the average driver who doesn’t need to lay down 20.00 worth of tire material showing off at every stop light.

I beg to differ,the 8HP70 is used behind the 485 horse Scat Pack cars,including the 1320 Challengers.The 1320 Challenger is the one the head honcho of FCA Tim Kunis says is the car built for the grass roots racer,and is the car that is specifically geared towards the week-end racer,and they expect it to have power adders added to it.Little tidbit for you to absorb,the 1320 and the Demon are the only 2 cars built by FCA that still carry their warrenty even if it breaks at the track. Even FCA knows the tranny's will get beat on. The 8HP70 in my wifes 1320 Challenger takes 50 miles of driving before it'll get to 170F,and even then it has to be a warm day,and you have to hauling ass at 70+ mph,cruising around light footing it,and the transmission is hard pressed to get to 165F,i know that would lead me to believe there might be some merit to the fact the transmissions optimal strength occurs closer to 160 then 185F. Other little tidbit for you,the 1320's come with factory line lock and factory tranny brake,and even standing on the tranny brake,the 8HP70 in my wifes 1320 Challenger doesn't get much past 170 unless you have it engaged for 30 seconds or longer with your foot holding the engine at 2600 rpm.

Here's a short little 1 minute video on the 1320's,they even come with drag tires and light weight rims on all 4 corners,now that should tell you that even FCA figures the tranny is going to be used in a racing situation,and don't forget,they'll still warrenty it if it breaks on the track,only caveat is as long as the car is "stock",lol.

 

[Tim Garceau]

The ZF transmission fluid is a proprietary fluid patented by ZF. No one else can make the fluid to the exact recipe unless ZF grants (or sells) a license. Nor can anyone make the legal claim of compatibility unless certified by ZF. This was exactly the same situation with ATF-3 and ATF-4.

It's not just a monopoly effect. ZF is sensitive to the viability and long-term effects of the fluid going into their transmissions. And it's not just viscosity they're worried about. There are other things to consider, such as seal compatibility, temperature range, anti-corrosion protection, etc. This is why they are concerned about what goes into their transmissions. If a fluid of another type not meeting ZF's specs is used and causes a failure, people will have tendency to blame the transmission and not the sub-adequate fluid.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33 gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 03 June 2018. Now at: 041975 miles.

The only question I have is how Valvoline Maxlife @ $16/gallon is recommended for ZF Lifeguard 8?


https://sharena21.springcm.com/Publ...2d889bd3/3fa3136a-09bd-e711-9c12-ac162d889bd1

 

[Wild one]

The only question I have is how Valvoline Maxlife @ $16/gallon is recommended for ZF Lifegard?


https://sharena21.springcm.com/Publ...2d889bd3/3fa3136a-09bd-e711-9c12-ac162d889bd1

That's Valvoline themselves reconmending it Tim, FCA or ZF aren't reconmending it.I'm a little leary of any outfit doing their own reconmending,lol

 

[chrisbh17]

That's Valvoline themselves reconmending it Tim, FCA or ZF aren't reconmending it.I'm a little leary of any outfit doing their own reconmending,lol

I agree. I have no doubt MaxLife is good ATF, BUT if you look at the list of "approvals" on it, I find it very hard to believe it covers so many fairly specialized ones, like Honda Z/DW-1, Nissan Matic and ZF all at the same time.

Do they reformulate it every time a new formula comes out from a manufacturer?

Do they pay the manufacturer to allow them to print the name on the label?

I highly doubt they reformulate it each time, so what gives?

I have heard that they will stand up for the milliion mile warranty if something fails, but Im guessing that will take a lot of time and effort and luck of the draw to prove their ATF caused an issue and not anything else that they can blame it on.

 

[Tim Garceau]

ATF is ATF, if my 8hp goes then I’ll put in a TR-6060!

 

[chrisbh17]

ATF is ATF

View attachment 225613

It does not carry the same number as the LifeGard 8 fluid (S671.090.31x) which is what ZF specs for the 8HP70, so its about as "compatible" as MaxLife ATF.

 

[Tim Garceau]

Yeah there was a time where ZF lifeguard 8 wasn’t approved by Chrysler, all a bunch of BS

 

[chrisbh17]

Yeah there was a time where ZF lifeguard 8 wasn’t approved by Chrysler, all a bunch of BS

I honestly wouldnt care about Chrysler approvals...I would care about ZF approvals.

The genuine ZF fluid costs about the same as the Mopar labelled stuff, we dont change it very often (at least I wont be), so I see no reason not to get the OEM stuff.

 

[Tim Garceau]

I’ve always had a problem following rules...

 

[Wild one]

I’ve always had a problem following rules...

I'd sort of come to that conculusion myself Tim,lol.Just razzing ya,lol

 

[Tim Garceau]

Don’t know the limits unless you push them.

 

[Wild one]

Don’t know the limits unless you push them.

But that usually entails breaking something expensive,lol

 

[Tim Garceau]

But that usually entails breaking something expensive,lol

You’ve been through 3 because of that subpar fluid, JMO

 

[Wild one]

You’ve been through 3 because of that subpar fluid, JMO

Nope only 1 and it was more tuner error then anything,fluid didn't have anything to do with it,as i wasn't changing fluids yet back then,lol.The subpar fluids you're thinking of,i don't use Tim,i use the factory /dealer fluid,i'll leave you low horsepower guys to check out the aftermarket fluids,lol. You can take the 8 speed out pretty fast just by playing with some of it's tune parameters.
That was also back before anybody knew how to tune the 8 speed and it was still a steep learning curve for tuning the 8 speed.We kept leaning on my 8 speed till we hit a point of rapidly dimiinshing returns,lol.BTW i had the fastest 8 speed 4X4 anywhere for several years,it's only been about the last year that anybody else has had a faster 8 speed 4X4 and even still there's only 3 or 4 that are faster then my old gal is,and my combo hasn't changed in 6 years,lol

 

[clint440]

I beg to differ,the 8HP70 is used behind the 485 horse Scat Pack cars,including the 1320 Challengers.The 1320 Challenger is the one the head honcho of FCA Tim Kunis says is the car built for the grass roots racer,and is the car that is specifically geared towards the week-end racer,and they expect it to have power adders added to it.Little tidbit for you to absorb,the 1320 and the Demon are the only 2 cars built by FCA that still carry their warrenty even if it breaks at the track. Even FCA knows the tranny's will get beat on. The 8HP70 in my wifes 1320 Challenger takes 50 miles of driving before it'll get to 170F,and even then it has to be a warm day,and you have to hauling ass at 70+ mph,cruising around light footing it,and the transmission is hard pressed to get to 165F,i know that would lead me to believe there might be some merit to the fact the transmissions optimal strength occurs closer to 160 then 185F. Other little tidbit for you,the 1320's come with factory line lock and factory tranny brake,and even standing on the tranny brake,the 8HP70 in my wifes 1320 Challenger doesn't get much past 170 unless you have it engaged for 30 seconds or longer with your foot holding the engine at 2600 rpm.

Here's a short little 1 minute video on the 1320's,they even come with drag tires and light weight rims on all 4 corners,now that should tell you that even FCA figures the tranny is going to be used in a racing situation,and don't forget,they'll still warrenty it if it breaks on the track,only caveat is as long as the car is "stock",lol.

Enlightening. What makes your challenger run cooler tranny temp?

 

[Wild one]

Enlightening. What makes your challenger run cooler tranny temp?

The cars don't have the thermal management heater on the side of the transmission that circulates hot engine coolant to the transmission,so they don't heat the transmission fluid like the trucks do. The trucks 8 speeds run noticably hotter tranny temps then the cars 8 speeds. I can drive to my buddies place 12 miles away and 12 miles back on the freeway at 80mph,and the last 2 Challengers my wife has owned will just barely be touching 155/160'ish on an 80F day,while my truck would be closer to 190F. Swapping to a 160 thermostat and going to the PPE pan has made a noticable differance in my trucks tranny temps,now it runs a little closer to the cars tranny temps,it'll run in the neighbourhood of 168 to 175 now

 

[chrisbh17]

The cars don't have the thermal management heater on the side of the transmission that circulates hot engine coolant to the transmission,so they don't heat the transmission fluid like the trucks do. The trucks 8 speeds run noticably hotter tranny temps then the cars 8 speeds. I can drive to my buddies place 12 miles away and 12 miles back on the freeway at 80mph,and the last 2 Challengers my wife has owned will just barely be touching 155/160'ish on an 80F day,while my truck would be closer to 190F. Swapping to a 160 thermostat and going to the PPE pan has made a noticable differance in my trucks tranny temps,now it runs a little closer to the cars tranny temps,it'll run in the neighbourhood of 168 to 175 now

160 thermostat on the trans? Where did you pick that up?

 

[Wild one]

160 thermostat on the trans? Where did you pick that up?

160 engine t-stat Chris. As soon as Charles has the transmission thermostat kit in stock for the trucks,which hopefully should be later this week,i told him to send me one,lol. You've been able to get ones for the cars for awhile,Paramount was offering a 160 tranny thermostat for the cars a few years back,but the only way to get it was to buy one of their transmissions,and Russell at Sound German Auto has been offering a 160 thermostat for the cars for close to a year now,but nobodies had one for the trucks till now.