transfercase diagram

[chrisbh17]

MA is one of them[emoji35]

CT, too.

I remember back in 1997 when I factory ordered my Neon R/T, they had to check "New England Emissions" which was basically the same as the CA emissions package.

At least back then it didnt make any difference in the car (same engine, no lower power rating, etc). Around the same time my sister-in-law bought a Honda Accord and indeed the CA/New England emissions version DID have a slightly different engine and lost a few HP in the process.

 

[Brandon-w]

The thing that bugs the absolute **** out if me is the fact that stationary engines, airplanes, trains and boats do not have to even consider emissions or lowering them, they have nothing to comply to and can puke as much exhaust into the air as they want. When 911 happened almost every plane was grounded and not able to fly at all. Scientists did a bunch of test that day and seen the air cleaned up considerably just with one day no planes flying. But if you look at it they burn 600 pounds per engine of fuel in what 5 hrs of flying or something like that. I dont know the numbers for exact sure but was something crazy like that. Ok rant over lol.

 

[Hemi395]

CT, too.

I remember back in 1997 when I factory ordered my Neon R/T, they had to check "New England Emissions" which was basically the same as the CA emissions package.

At least back then it didnt make any difference in the car (same engine, no lower power rating, etc). Around the same time my sister-in-law bought a Honda Accord and indeed the CA/New England emissions version DID have a slightly different engine and lost a few HP in the process.

Just think, our air here in New England is so much better because of following CARB[emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849][emoji849]

 

[Hemi395]

The thing that bugs the absolute **** out if me is the fact that stationary engines, airplanes, trains and boats do not have to even consider emissions or lowering them, they have nothing to comply to and can puke as much exhaust into the air as they want. When 911 happened almost every plane was grounded and not able to fly at all. Scientists did a bunch of test that day and seen the air cleaned up considerably just with one day no planes flying. But if you look at it they burn 600 pounds per engine of fuel in what 5 hrs of flying or something like that. I dont know the numbers for exact sure but was something crazy like that. Ok rant over lol.

C'mon Brandon, that makes too much sense[emoji23]

 

[chrisbh17]

The thing that bugs the absolute **** out if me is the fact that stationary engines, airplanes, trains and boats do not have to even consider emissions or lowering them, they have nothing to comply to and can puke as much exhaust into the air as they want. When 911 happened almost every plane was grounded and not able to fly at all. Scientists did a bunch of test that day and seen the air cleaned up considerably just with one day no planes flying. But if you look at it they burn 600 pounds per engine of fuel in what 5 hrs of flying or something like that. I dont know the numbers for exact sure but was something crazy like that. Ok rant over lol.

We would probably all be better off with one single day a year of no planes, versus stupid ass daylight savings time.

 

[Brandon-w]

We would probably all be better off with one single day a year of no planes, versus stupid ass daylight savings time.

Don't even get me started on that!!! I live way north midnight sun is a thing and it gets old them changing the time every year. But I'm not gonna start. Yalls getting me wound up today. [emoji23]

 

[Hemi395]

Wow, this thread got derailed[emoji106]

 

[Brandon-w]

Wow, this thread got derailed[emoji106]

That's what happens when great minds get together! We get very easily distracted [emoji57]

 

[AnthonyD1978]

Yep, tax-paying citizens and businesses are fleeing the state because of the high costs and its crazy government.

In 2018 Califunny @ $1.03 Billion, paid twice what New York paid in welfare. That 55% of immigrant households were on welfare. And it's been said but not published that Califunny's non-tax paying population is now larger than the tax-paying. And, 10% of the households pay 80.4% of the state's income taxes.

Califunny, the welfare and poverty capital of the USA

Middle class and up are fleeing that state like crazy. A one-way uHaul rental out of California is so expensive because the trucks never make it back since so few people are moving into California (at least they aren't using uHau to do it). That's why I sold or threw away everything when I sold my house. I only moved what I could fit in my RAM. Bought everything new when I got here. I took my 6 figure salary and state income tax with me. I was fortunate that my employer allowed me to work remotely from home.

I just hope that the people fleeing California realize what created that cesspool. Not just awful policies, but a certain mentality. I was born in Arizona and I'm glad to be back. My son told me the other day that when he's done with college at NAU that he doesn't want to move back to Cali. He didn't realize how good it is outside of California since he's never lived anywhere else.

Oh and no CARB or smog check in Arizona.

SORRY FOR HIJACKING YOUR THREAD.

 

[kurek]

The thing that bugs the absolute **** out if me is the fact that stationary engines, airplanes, trains and boats do not have to even consider emissions or lowering them, they have nothing to comply to and can puke as much exhaust into the air as they want.

Plus side for all of us who like not dying from preventable pollution, U.N. pollution rules go into effect this year forcing the 90,000+ international vessels on the ocean to either use low sulfur fuel or run scrubbers. Bad news is that the global supply of both scrubbers and ports capable of installing them (not exactly an Amazon Prime next day delivery, ten minute no drill install...) is maybe good enough to tag 1% of the global fleet per year, maybe. And low sulfur fuel demand is going to strain both supplies and market prices.

Good news from that is it might slow global trade a little and while the idea of global trade is awesome and a big part of how we built the modern human society it's also a nightmare for anyone who, again, likes not dying of preventable pollution.

In theory we could all cut freight emissions in half by doubling the life span of the articles we buy (either by buying based on quality rather than price.. or just maintaining our sh**) but that takes effort by everyone and it seems most people are just too lazy and too cheap to care.

 

[Brandon-w]

Plus side for all of us who like not dying from preventable pollution, U.N. pollution rules go into effect this year forcing the 90,000+ international vessels on the ocean to either use low sulfur fuel or run scrubbers. Bad news is that the global supply of both scrubbers and ports capable of installing them (not exactly an Amazon Prime next day delivery, ten minute no drill install...) is maybe good enough to tag 1% of the global fleet per year, maybe. And low sulfur fuel demand is going to strain both supplies and market prices.

Good news from that is it might slow global trade a little and while the idea of global trade is awesome and a big part of how we built the modern human society it's also a nightmare for anyone who, again, likes not dying of preventable pollution.

In theory we could all cut freight emissions in half by doubling the life span of the articles we buy (either by buying based on quality rather than price.. or just maintaining our sh**) but that takes effort by everyone and it seems most people are just too lazy and too cheap to care.

I'd rather run and maintain my stuff. Cheaper in the end. But that's good and bad news.

 

[Nwzjscott]

All caught up!!

Ok, My 16’ ecodiesel is currently at the dealership for the 3rd time this month because the 4wd has failed, at 45k miles they have decided the transfercase is cooked and it’s blatantly obvious to them it’s MY fault for abusing the sensitive 4wd system, so they have stated this will be the only warranty repair transfercase they will give me

Yep, I’ve been treated like absolute dog ****. I’ve been waiting for my ecodiesel settlement check to just trade the truck in, But honestly if I could get the 4wd to work properly I’d love to keep it.

This thread has given me hope.. please please put me on this list and I’ll happily buy this wire harness/switch combo. I’ve watched the videos. I’m sold!

Brandon: Awesome work

 

[LouM]

All caught up!!

Ok, My 16’ ecodiesel is currently at the dealership for the 3rd time this month because the 4wd has failed, at 45k miles they have decided the transfercase is cooked and it’s blatantly obvious to them it’s MY fault for abusing the sensitive 4wd system, so they have stated this will be the only warranty repair transfercase they will give me

Yep, I’ve been treated like absolute dog ****. I’ve been waiting for my ecodiesel settlement check to just trade the truck in, But honestly if I could get the 4wd to work properly I’d love to keep it.

This thread has given me hope.. please please put me on this list and I’ll happily buy this wire harness/switch combo. I’ve watched the videos. I’m sold!

Brandon: Awesome work

We just tell them to be damned sure it's a good one, and that if it is you shouldn't need another till long after the warranty is gone.

 

[Hemi395]

All caught up!!

Ok, My 16’ ecodiesel is currently at the dealership for the 3rd time this month because the 4wd has failed, at 45k miles they have decided the transfercase is cooked and it’s blatantly obvious to them it’s MY fault for abusing the sensitive 4wd system, so they have stated this will be the only warranty repair transfercase they will give me

Yep, I’ve been treated like absolute dog ****. I’ve been waiting for my ecodiesel settlement check to just trade the truck in, But honestly if I could get the 4wd to work properly I’d love to keep it.

This thread has given me hope.. please please put me on this list and I’ll happily buy this wire harness/switch combo. I’ve watched the videos. I’m sold!

Brandon: Awesome work

That's terrible. People have burned these tcases up simply by driving through the snow before. I certainly wouldn't call that abuse...

The good thing is if you get @Brandon-w 's switch, it engages that clutch at full power so there is no slippage. So your new tcase should last you a while with his switch installed[emoji106]

 

[AnthonyD1978]

Brandon, how'd the move go? Any update on the switches?

 

[AnthonyD1978]

Brandon and I have been talking behind the scenes about possible 5th gen differences. Here is a video I captured of the truck testing out the various TC modes. I would have liked to test in mud or snow to more exaggerate the TC modes, but the chance of snow this week in my area has changed to minimal so this dirt lot is all I used.

The new 48-11 TC in the 5th gen trucks has been advertised from the manufacturer as being much faster to engage when traction issues are detected. When comparing to the limited amount of 4th gen videos this does appear to be the case. To the point that even in 4auto I cannot see the rear wheels slip at all before the truck engages the front wheels.

This also makes it very hard to tell if the 5th gen trucks already have 100% clutch engagement in 4HI/LO since the clutch engagement is already so fast.

I also went back to the original hill from my from the first video I posted in this thread. As expected I had the same results with the 4wd system warning me of over heating. I’ve had this warning in about 4 or 5 different instances since pushing this truck off road. Each time I’m in 4LO as required by the terrain I’m in.

This is a pretty aggressive hill to tackle in a truck of this type. It’s a pretty extreme angle and pretty long. With large rocks and rock shelves. My rock sliders took a pretty big hit today on the hill and saved me from body damage.

My current theory for the 5th gen trucks is that even though the new TC is an improvement in speed of engagement (4auto) and they *may* have updated the system to have 100% clutch engagement in 4HI/LO; I believe the extra low RPM torque that 4LO puts on the TC is too much for the clutches to handle for more than very short periods of use.

My current question; does the TC use an actual temp sensor or some software algorithm to determine an over heat situation (like the BLDS system and brake overheat)? My money is that’s it’s software based. In either case I wonder if FCA updated the heat threshold for the new TC system and its logic if it is indeed now using 100% clutch engagement. Again, I’m still not sure if it is or that the system is just so fast to engage now that it appears to be 100%.


The practical test will be tackling this hill with the bypass switch.

 

[LouM]

Brandon and I have been talking behind the scenes about possible 5th gen differences. Here is a video I captured of the truck testing out the various TC modes. I would have liked to test in mud or snow to more exaggerate the TC modes, but the chance of snow this week in my area has changed to minimal so this dirt lot is all I used.

The new 48-11 TC in the 5th gen trucks has been advertised from the manufacturer as being much faster to engage when traction issues are detected. When comparing to the limited amount of 4th gen videos this does appear to be the case. To the point that even in 4auto I cannot see the rear wheels slip at all before the truck engages the front wheels.

This also makes it very hard to tell if the 5th gen trucks already have 100% clutch engagement in 4HI/LO since the clutch engagement is already so fast.

I also went back to the original hill from my from the first video I posted in this thread. As expected I had the same results with the 4wd system warning me of over heating. I’ve had this warning in about 4 or 5 different instances since pushing this truck off road. Each time I’m in 4LO as required by the terrain I’m in.

This is a pretty aggressive hill to tackle in a truck of this type. It’s a pretty extreme angle and pretty long. With large rocks and rock shelves. My rock sliders took a pretty big hit today on the hill and saved me from body damage.

My current theory for the 5th gen trucks is that even though the new TC is an improvement in speed of engagement (4auto) and they *may* have updated the system to have 100% clutch engagement in 4HI/LO; I believe the extra low RPM torque that 4LO puts on the TC is too much for the clutches to handle for more than very short periods of use.

My current question; does the TC use an actual temp sensor or some software algorithm to determine an over heat situation (like the BLDS system and brake overheat)? My money is that’s it’s software based. In either case I wonder if FCA updated the heat threshold for the new TC system and its logic if it is indeed now using 100% clutch engagement. Again, I’m still not sure if it is or that the system is just so fast to engage now that it appears to be 100%.


The practical test will be tackling this hill with the bypass switch.

A couple of questions for you,
do you feel anything in the steering in four lock on a tight turn?
also do you know if it disengages 4wd when in park while running?
Have you had your truck in any very low traction situations?
when my 2015 is in very low traction situations and you are easing into the
throttle to try and hook up you can feel the front end grap slip and release,is it still that way?

Thanks
Lou

 

[Brandon-w]

The t case temp is an algorithm there are no temp sensors or anything like that within the wiring system of the t case. I'm sure it's based on engine rpm and torque and then calculated as a load. Surpass x amount and it gets mad. Mine will do the over heat in 2 wheel drive on ice, if I floor it I get a t case over temp warning. Not sure if anyone else has gotten that before.

 

[AnthonyD1978]

A couple of questions for you,
do you feel anything in the steering in four lock on a tight turn?
also do you know if it disengages 4wd when in park while running?
Have you had your truck in any very low traction situations?
when my 2015 is in very low traction situations and you are easing into the
throttle to try and hook up you can feel the front end grap slip and release,is it still that way?

Thanks
Lou

Yes, I've had what I would consider very low traction situations. I posted 2 other videos here of some of those situations. In one video that was on more level ground, but with numerous big rocks (lots of underbody scrapping) and rock shelves. I got no warning messages.
The other video is a pretty steep hill with smaller, but still large, rocks and looser gravel. I constantly got the overheat message on this hill on the two times I went up it.

The steering wheel does seem tighter in 4lo (no 4lock in 5th gen). Do the 4th gens have "drive by wire steering"? 5th gen does not have any mechanical link to the steering rack and steering wheel and that makes it hard to tell by steering wheel feel.

I will say that in 4HI that if I let the truck move under its own power in a straight line (idle speed) and then turn the wheel full lock that the truck will stop on its own. This would be because of the extra friction from the front diff (100% clutch engagement). I think this is the strongest evidence that the 5th gen trucks do have 100% clutch engagement. Do the 4th gen trucks behave like this as well??? I can't duplicate this with 4Lo because all the extra TQ does not let the truck come to a stop.

I've only ever had the felt "grab and release" when I get the over heat message that then causes the truck to go in and out of 4wd constantly. If I don't get the message then it seems to be 100% 4wd all the time. Again, it could be doing it so fast with the new TC that I can't feel it.

If it's just so fast that I can't tell then that would still create a lot of unnecessary heat. Which I hope is the case because then the switch from Brandon should help with this. But only if the algorithm the truck uses to determine the overheating scenario takes into account the amount of time the clutches engage in a given period of time. If the truck doesn't take that into account then it doesn't matter and the truck will still think the TC is overheating and will throw it into 2wd mode.


@Brandon-w , your switch definitely allows 100% clutch engagement as shown in your vids, but do you know how the switch has effected the overheat warning? I don't think many people were getting the actual overheat warning to begin with and maybe they would still get that warning at the same rate as before the switch if the 4wd was worked hard enough before and after the switch. Meaning the requirements for the overheat algorithm are still met at the same rate no matter if they have the switch or not. Which would them put them into 2wd mode.

 

[Brandon-w]

With my switch on I can blast through anything without an overheat code. I usto get it all the time but have never received it with the switch on.