4WD Lock or 4WD Auto?

[ColdCase]

At 4:53 the BW 44-44 (atuo tc) works quite well here with the crappy SRA tires. There are also plenty of other videos of the 44-44 handling some fairly extreme scenarios I know many us would never put our trucks through.

It works well in reducing transfer case warranty claims for those owners that run traditional 4 lock year round . The rub is many buyers expected that the transfer case is locked when you select lock, where in fact it does not (not even in 4Low). It acts like a limited slip diff not a locker. Functions well for 99% of owners (an open diff type transfer case with BTC functions well for 98%), but my locking transfer case cruises up my driveway without drama, where my 44-44 needs a lot more hair raising speed and finesse to get to the top as it slips in and out of 4WD.

I spent extra bucks and bought the auto in my 2016 because the girls don't know full time, part time, lock, 2WD from nothing... even after 20 years of driving. It was a bit disappointing to find out later it was limited slip, not a locker. Limited slips work well for most owners, but lockers work better when the going gets tuff in snow and mud. The 2016 generally stays in the garage in foul weather.

One would never know you are buying a limited slip, unless one researches deep in forums like this. Thats the biggest rub. A big deal if you are in that 1%.

 

[VA10]

So if my truck doesnt specifically have 4 auto listed on the dial it does not have it correct?

Yes. you have a part time TC not the Auto TC.

 

[VA10]

It works well in reducing transfer case warranty claims for those owners that run traditional 4 lock year round . The rub is many buyers expected that the transfer case is locked when you select lock, where in fact it does not (not even in 4Low). It acts like a limited slip diff not a locker. Functions well for 99% of owners (an open diff type transfer case with BTC functions well for 98%), but my locking transfer case cruises up my driveway without drama, where my 44-44 needs a lot more hair raising speed and finesse to get to the top as it slips in and out of 4WD.

I spent extra bucks and bought the auto in my 2016 because the girls don't know full time, part time, lock, 2WD from nothing... even after 20 years of driving. It was a bit disappointing to find out later it was limited slip, not a locker. Limited slips work well for most owners, but lockers work better when the going gets tuff in snow and mud. The 2016 generally stays in the garage in foul weather.

One would never know you are buying a limited slip, unless one researches deep in forums like this. Thats the biggest rub. A big deal if you are in that 1%.

Agreed. I really did not want an auto TC. I figure the outdoorsman was safe way to avoid it.....except my outdoorsman model year with the long bed = the auto TC.

This is my second truck with an auto TC. The first truck with the auto TC preformed rather well off road. But now that I under stand how the 4x4 system worked in that truck it explains why it behaved the way it did in certain scenarios. NEVER GOT STUCK even with an open rear diff.

 

[ej132]

It works well in reducing transfer case warranty claims for those owners that run traditional 4 lock year round . The rub is many buyers expected that the transfer case is locked when you select lock, where in fact it does not (not even in 4Low). It acts like a limited slip diff not a locker. Functions well for 99% of owners (an open diff type transfer case with BTC functions well for 98%), but my locking transfer case cruises up my driveway without drama, where my 44-44 needs a lot more hair raising speed and finesse to get to the top as it slips in and out of 4WD.

I spent extra bucks and bought the auto in my 2016 because the girls don't know full time, part time, lock, 2WD from nothing... even after 20 years of driving. It was a bit disappointing to find out later it was limited slip, not a locker. Limited slips work well for most owners, but lockers work better when the going gets tuff in snow and mud. The 2016 generally stays in the garage in foul weather.

One would never know you are buying a limited slip, unless one researches deep in forums like this. Thats the biggest rub. A big deal if you are in that 1%.

Why dont you add a locker? Like an arb air locker would be great, though really unless your lifting wheels the benefit will be negligible for most places your gonna drive a truck

 

[Danno]

AWD belongs in a car or suv not a truck.

 

[smiley]

AWD belongs in a car or suv not a truck.

The problem is it is not AWD it is sad excuse for 4X4 lock. If it was AWD like the Durango it would be really good but it isn’t. It is not smart like actual AWD and it is really a lie to paying customers since you can’t lock it like a traditional 4WD or even an older Auto case like mine by NVG which worked well but still not as good as the Durango had in my 05. Deceptive and should be specified to the buyer.

 

[JPT]

The problem is it is not AWD it is sad excuse for 4X4 lock. If it was AWD like the Durango it would be really good but it isn’t. It is not smart like actual AWD and it is really a lie to paying customers since you can’t lock it like a traditional 4WD or even an older Auto case like mine by NVG which worked well but still not as good as the Durango had in my 05. Deceptive and should be specified to the buyer.

The real question is... Do you get stuck in ND winters with this system?

I haven’t had my truck through a winter yet, so I don’t know.

 

[smiley]

The real question is... Do you get stuck in ND winters with this system?



I haven’t had my truck through a winter yet, so I don’t know.

I have 09 so I am good my auto transfer case was made by NVG not Borg Warner. I refuse to upgrade to a new truck until I can afford an HD. I don’t think a person should have to chose a lower trim to get a good transfer case that is what bugs me. If I had one of those Borg Warners I would have switched already as I need it locked for driving on ice.

 

[JPT]

I have 09 so I am good my auto transfer case was made by NVG not Borg Warner. I refuse to upgrade to a new truck until I can afford an HD. I don’t think a person should have to chose a lower trim to get a good transfer case that is what bugs me. If I had one of those Borg Warners I would have switched already as I need it locked for driving on ice.

I have a feeling (no experience in heavy snow yet) the Auto works perfectly fine on all on road situations (snow, ice, rain, dry), and 90% of what most people do off road (beaches, dirt roads, muddy roads). It may fail in what 10% of off roaders do, but most people will be fine with it, and not even notice.

If you wheel your truck hard, I get it, but just like everything else, you have to mod to make it work. I used to do rock climbing with a wrangler, where I changed the transfer case (to a 4:1), added ARB lockers, put in a custom cage,... That is the price of playing, but if I didn’t do that extreme wheeling, stock would have been perfectly fine, just like I believe this transfer case is with the Auto.

EDIT: I will say, the Auto has performed flawlessly in the rain I have had so far in the 2 months since I’ve had mine (actually planting power to the ground, even with tires near the wear indicators).

 

[smiley]

My auto sucks on ice because it doesn’t switch fast enough for my liking. I only use the lock when icy. The snow wouldn’t worry me as much as slipping is okay then but on an ice sheet you have slipping then you have fish tailing and that just won’t work because in the winter we drive on ice all the damn time until it wears down to concrete. When locked in no worries of fish tailing due to one end slipping so you have much more predictable behavior.

 

[mohemipar]

The system will get you through any standard conditions you might expect to experience in winter.

The problem as said above they label it as "lock" when it's not. A huge number of people dont realize how the system operates. If you pulled 50 random 1500 drivers off the street and asked them about it, I wouldnt be surprised if every single one had no clue.

Not to say the system wont get you through it, but its just not what they are advertising. Me.. i like to know my wheels are being constantly powered when on a long stretch off road or in deep snow and having an old school t-case.

 

[mohemipar]

My auto sucks on ice because it doesn’t switch fast enough for my liking. I only use the lock when icy. The snow wouldn’t worry me as much as slipping is okay then but on an ice sheet you have slipping then you have fish tailing and that just won’t work because in the winter we drive on ice all the damn time until it wears down to concrete. When locked in no worries of fish tailing due to one end slipping so you have much more predictable behavior.

Hell, even in just snow it is annoying. Some people say you dont notice the delay, but I always did in bad conditions. It was a PITA. Icy conditions, especially in traffic i certainly dont want my wheels engaging and disengaging constantly.

 

[ColdCase]

The real question is... Do you get stuck in ND winters with this system?

I haven’t had my truck through a winter yet, so I don’t know.

My wife and daughter get stuck in the driveway on occasion. I hate it when they end up crosswise across the road. I don't get stuck as I may have a different driving technique.

They rarely get stuck with a simple open diff style transfer case (with a BTC traction control system) for some reason and just don't get stuck with a true locking transfer case.

Granted, we have a driveway that 99% of the folks will never see.

 

[ColdCase]

Why dont you add a locker? Like an arb air locker would be great, though really unless your lifting wheels the benefit will be negligible for most places your gonna drive a truck

No one makes a locker for the transfer case. One of the gear manufactures tried to put together a conversion kit, but I don't think they figured out a practical and legal method to avoid error codes and fault lights.

 

[Quint]

Last fall I got stuck at my cabin during a blizzard (2+ ft of snow) and single digit temps. The lake froze but I busted ice for five miles back to my truck. Someone had plowed the boat landing seeing my truck and trailer, but my 2015 still struggled. Granted my tires needed replacing but they did last that entire winter. What they didn't do was pull my trailer around the level boat landing with an inch of snow. I shoveled, I used sand, and finally had someone help me push it down the boat landing. I used 4-lo, 4-hi, auto, and 2wd to try to push through that snow. Once the boat was on, it was a struggle to pull the boat & trailer out of the water. Once again I tried 4-lo, 4-hi, auto, nothing worked. I eventually threw in back into 2wd and gunned it until the rear-end slid sideways and caught a little traction.

The wheels did all kinds of craziness when engaged in 4-lo and 4-hi. What they didn't do was give traction. I never minded the not-full-locking issue until that night. My truck drove home on icy and snowy roads just fine, towing the boat. It just sucked when I needed to lock in the wheels most.

 

[WilliamS]

Last fall I got stuck at my cabin during a blizzard (2+ ft of snow) and single digit temps. The lake froze but I busted ice for five miles back to my truck. Someone had plowed the boat landing seeing my truck and trailer, but my 2015 still struggled. Granted my tires needed replacing but they did last that entire winter. What they didn't do was pull my trailer around the level boat landing with an inch of snow. I shoveled, I used sand, and finally had someone help me push it down the boat landing. I used 4-lo, 4-hi, auto, and 2wd to try to push through that snow. Once the boat was on, it was a struggle to pull the boat & trailer out of the water. Once again I tried 4-lo, 4-hi, auto, nothing worked. I eventually threw in back into 2wd and gunned it until the rear-end slid sideways and caught a little traction.

The wheels did all kinds of craziness when engaged in 4-lo and 4-hi. What they didn't do was give traction. I never minded the not-full-locking issue until that night. My truck drove home on icy and snowy roads just fine, towing the boat. It just sucked when I needed to lock in the wheels most.

There is a key term in this I hope every other 4x4 guy caught. Tires! You can take an H1 Alpha off road with bald tires and not make it was far as a front wheel drive honda accord. 4x4 cant overcome physics, it can only add more rotating tires. If those tires have no traction it doesnt matter.

 

[JPT]

There is a key term in this I hope every other 4x4 guy caught. Tires! You can take an H1 Alpha off road with bald tires and not make it was far as a front wheel drive honda accord. 4x4 cant overcome physics, it can only add more rotating tires. If those tires have no traction it doesnt matter.

x2... I have seen rear wheel drive vehicles with snow tires destroy 4WD vehicles in winter conditions because of crappy tires.

 

[ColdCase]

Yeah, I used to get my Rwd open diff comet into hunting camps where 4x4 guys would have to walk a couple miles. Standard passenger snow tires, avoiding wheel spin (no spin at all), finding good traction lines, keeping momentum, manual transmission, all served me well. Once a tire lost traction and spun it was usually back down the hill and try again My TR6 had more ground clearance but still skinny tires and would get me into even more areas.

The 4x4 guys just tended to mash the throttle and hope for the best. In spite of more aggressive tires and ground clearance, they could not get close. With the current traction control thats suppose to be the way to drive, however, so I hear. The computer manages the throttle so there is less chance to overpower traction.

 

[Quint]

I agree with you about tires, but you also inserted the fallacy insinuating that I had bald tires. There was plenty of tread left for a plowed parking lot. I've driven in all kinds of snow for 30+ years and know when I tire is done. 4-wheel drive absolutely can overcome worn tires, but as you pointed out, not bald. When you can't get the wheels to lock in though, it's tough to overcome tire deficiencies.

 

[JPT]

I agree with you about tires, but you also inserted the fallacy insinuating that I had bald tires. There was plenty of tread left for a plowed parking lot. I've driven in all kinds of snow for 30+ years and know when I tire is done. 4-wheel drive absolutely can overcome worn tires, but as you pointed out, not bald. When you can't get the wheels to lock in though, it's tough to overcome tire deficiencies.

Sorry, was just going by what you said, and I did assume that you did replace them after the winter:

Granted my tires needed replacing but they did last that entire winter.

Tires actually lose functionality far before they are bald. For longevity, manufacturers do not have the siping going all the way down to where one would call "bald", otherwise, you would lose chunks of rubber.

Driving on ice is 100% about siping... So I still am going to assume that if you were within 1 year of replacing them, even if they were not "bald" they were THE major contributing factor to your lack of traction.