Eibach vs Bilstein, my opinion.

[RamMan381]

I had bilstein 5100’s on my truck set at 2.8” lift height with stock springs. I was going to put the Eibach 2.75” springs on the bilstein struts but the top nut had seized onto the shock shaft. The little Allen hole in the top of the strut shaft stripped out instantly... The bilstein’s only had 35,000 miles on them!

I bought the Eibach struts to replace the bilstein struts. Here is what I noticed.

The strut shaft on the bilstein’s was 14mm, the shaft on the Eibach’s is 16mm. Because of this the Eibach struts do not need the washer at the top of the shaft, the bilstein’s need the washer.

The Eibach strut does not have a hole at the top for a Allen wrench, it has the ability to put a wrench on it instead. I think it’s less likely to strip out than the little Allen on the bilstein’s.

After the Eibach springs were installed the truck rode much smoother. Having the factory springs under tons of preload to achieve lift is not ideal. I highly recommend the Eibach springs and struts.

 

[Cableman]

I have new not installed yet bils, would you recommend installing the eibach springs on the bils over using the stock springs?
Do they make an eibach kit for the front or you have to buy shocks and springs separate?

 

[crazykid1994]

Struts and springs come separate. Depending on what height you go with the stock springs are fine. I ran mine at 2” lift with no issues on bilsteins. The stocks springs on bilsteins was a slightly stiffer more controlled feeling than factory but that’s due to the bilstein struts. I’m running eibach springs on the second clip and I was right at 2.7” lift until I swapped in my offroad bumper. My truck sank about 1/4” with my new bumper. I fixed that with a 1/2” top spacer. In my opinion the eibach coils are a softer smoother ride but they don’t feel bouncy. The bilstein struts definitely feel nice with the coils. The dampening and rebound feel smooth and more plush in my opinion. Hopefully the OP gets a review in on those eibach struts.

 

[JB1]

That’s why I like the Bilstein 6112’s, the shaft is 18mm so no washer required and they are squared off on the end for a wrench flat too.

 

[RamMan381]

I would without a doubt put the Eibach springs on the bilstein struts if you already have the bilstein’s.

The only reason I wouldn’t would be if you wanted less lift height. 2.75” of lift is not really hurting anything except the factory upper ball joint. The angles of the cv joint are fine.

I ran zone upper control arms, they have been trouble free. Much beefier than stock.

 

[Cableman]

I would without a doubt put the Eibach springs on the bilstein struts if you already have the bilstein’s.

The only reason I wouldn’t would be if you wanted less lift height. 2.75” of lift is not really hurting anything except the factory upper ball joint. The angles of the cv joint are fine.

I ran zone upper control arms, they have been trouble free. Much beefier than stock.

So if going 2.1 dont use the eibach springs on bils?

 

[olyelr]

So if going 2.1 dont use the eibach springs on bils?

Sounds like the eibach springs alone lift it 2.75”.

 

[ram1500rsm]

I had bilstein 5100’s on my truck set at 2.8” lift height with stock springs. I was going to put the Eibach 2.75” springs on the bilstein struts but the top nut had seized onto the shock shaft. The little Allen hole in the top of the strut shaft stripped out instantly... The bilstein’s only had 35,000 miles on them!

I bought the Eibach struts to replace the bilstein struts. Here is what I noticed.

The strut shaft on the bilstein’s was 14mm, the shaft on the Eibach’s is 16mm. Because of this the Eibach struts do not need the washer at the top of the shaft, the bilstein’s need the washer.

The Eibach strut does not have a hole at the top for a Allen wrench, it has the ability to put a wrench on it instead. I think it’s less likely to strip out than the little Allen on the bilstein’s.

After the Eibach springs were installed the truck rode much smoother. Having the factory springs under tons of preload to achieve lift is not ideal. I highly recommend the Eibach springs and struts.

View attachment 200305

View attachment 200306

View attachment 200307

View attachment 200308

Preload on the 1st notch should be the same preload on the last one. What’s changing with the clips is just the position of where the lower spring seat is placed. going up will cause the strut shaft to extend and the spring will give you lift. The weight of the truck pushes down on the coil so if the weight is the same and the shaft still has room to extend you’re not adding anymore preload to the spring regardless of the notch you are using.

Were you able to see if there was a difference in strut length ?

 

[Ricks Ram]

As far as the Eibach setup riding smother I have no first hand knowledge but as stated by ram1500rsm changing the spring clip to different positions on the 5100 makes NO difference on spring preload. All you are doing is moving the spring perch higher. It's still compressed exactly the same amount when the truck is on the ground. I've had my 5100 shocks for several years an set to 2.1 and noticed a firmer ride because the shocks are valved differently but the truck rode fine and I liked the more sure footed feel. I have a 6" BDS lift now but still use the Bilsteins. As far as the nut rusting to the shaft it happens on all shocks and the ones with the flat sides on the shaft for a wrench strip out just as easily as the allen head. Best option is to put anti seize on threads before you tighten the nut on the shaft. I always put the spring compressor on and tighten it only enough to hold the spring in place once the nuts temoved and the hit it with the impact and it will usually come off.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[ram1500rsm]

So if going 2.1 dont use the eibach springs on bils?

You can ask @crazykid1994 . He's running the Eibach springs but on the 2nd notch which should be 1.4" lift and he said he's got 2.7" with that setup.
I don't know if he has the newer 2.75" spring or the old ones that didn't lift 2.75" so given that he had to use the 2nd notch perhaps he's got the old ones ?

I haven't followed the Eibach springs in a big while. People got to try the old version but apparently they didn't get the advertised height in the zero clip and Eibach stop selling those for a while until recently where i'd guess they have started offering a new version ?

5100's

 

[crazykid1994]

“They fixed it” according to them but I only received 2” on the lowest notch. Hence why I’m on the second notch at 2.5” plus my 1/2” top spacer to make 3”. I was in contact with eibach but they basically said manufacturing tolerances between vehicles and between their springs is the reason for this. To many different variations in trucks to offer a spring for model. Told me they’d swap mine out to see if it fixed the problem. Told me if I didn’t want to swap springs that I could just move the clip up to the next notch.

 

[RamMan381]

Preload on the 1st notch should be the same preload on the last one. What’s changing with the clips is just the position of where the lower spring seat is placed. going up will cause the strut shaft to extend and the spring will give you lift. The weight of the truck pushes down on the coil so if the weight is the same and the shaft still has room to extend you’re not adding anymore preload to the spring regardless of the notch you are using.

Were you able to see if there was a difference in strut length ?

Fake news!! This is not true at all, there is more preload the higher you move that clip up. Otherwise there would be no lift.

The same principal applies to setting sag on motorcycle rear suspension. Too much or to little preload is a bad thing.

 

[RamMan381]

Think of it like this, the spring stores more energy the more you compress it. That is how you are able to lift the truck with these struts “preload”.

Therefore if you compress a spring more to install it, it is storing more energy and it will take more energy to compress it when you hit a bump.

That is why buying the lift coils is a better option, and why they ride better.

 

[ram1500rsm]

Fake news!! This is not true at all, there is more preload the higher you move that clip up. Otherwise there would be no lift.

The same principal applies to setting sag on motorcycle rear suspension. Too much or to little preload is a bad thing.

We can discuss it no problem. It's not fake-news, lol
The spring is already preloaded when you set the clip on the lowerst perch. That amount of preload is not changing after that. The spring will compress under the truck weight the same amount whether you're using the lower perch, the middle one of the highest one. What's inducing the lift ? the spring mounted higher in its seat. That's it. every groove is placed thecnically 0.7" higher from the previous one.
Start the the base, 0" lift, spring is preloaded on that seat the truck weight compresses the springs and the strut shaft will compress accordingly.
Now move the seat to the 1st notch, the spring now seats 0.7" higher than the base, the strut is compressing the same amount under weight, and the strut shaft is extending that much, so everything else remain exactly the same as far a s preload, except now you springs is sitting 0.7" higher, and the strut shaft has been extended that much. the truck goes up that amount.
Now move the seat to the 2nd notch and the spring will seat 1.4" higher than the base, the springs are compresing exactly the same amount under the truck weight but now you strut shaft is extended 1.4 from the whatver they were at when the spring was sitting on the zero notch. Get the idea now ?

The only way you will be adding more preload to the spring from whatever preload they get when you set them to any groove will be if you ran out of extension in the strut and the shaft has no way to extend further, or if you added extra weigh in the front via bumpers/winch etc. the amout of preload will change because of the extra weight as the spring is being crushed under weight.

I don't mean to say you don't have a clue either with you motorcycle example of prelaod and sag. , but here, knock yourself down i used to believe as well the spring was getting more preload. It doesn't and the concept is fairly simple to understand if you think about it.
http://www.promecha.com.au/sag_preload.htm

 

[Ricks Ram]

Come on guys ram1500rsm is 100% correct. You are NOT increasing the preload on the spring in any way when the truck is on the ground. Obviously there is more preload on the spring when the assembly is out of the truck because the shock is fully extended and the spring is compressed the extra 2.1" or whatever you set it at but as soon as the spring is compressed with the regular weight of the truck and the shock is not fully extended the preload is the same. All it does is move the spring perch higher. Raise the bottom if the spring 2.1" and the truck is raised 2.1". If the truck is raised exactly the same amount as the spring was raised how can there be any more preload then there was before? The answer is there cannot.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[RamMan381]

The spring with more preload will rebound much differently than the spring with less preloaded.

You can’t tell me that spring preload will change nothing.

 

[Tim Garceau]

The OEM front is a Linear rate spring.

These shocks cost 3 times the price so they should be more robust than Bilstein. I do enjoy the sporty firm/quick rebound dampening of 5100s at stock height setting. They may have similar valving, OP let us know how they compare after some seat time.

 

[RamMan381]

Preload does not change spring rate, I get that.

But taking the same spring “the stock one” and putting the clip higher up “applying more preload”, it will change the force the spring has on the shock.

It will rebound faster, and take more force to get it to move.

If I apply 400 lbs of preload on a strut spring I can put 350 lbs of weight on that strut and it will not compress.

If I apply 300 lbs of preload on the same strut spring and apply 350 lbs of weight on that strut, it will compress.

When you drive your truck and hit bumps the suspension moves, it’s not always at ride height.

 

[RamMan381]

We can discuss it no problem. It's not fake-news, lol
The spring is already preloaded when you set the clip on the lowerst perch. That amount of preload is not changing after that. The spring will compress under the truck weight the same amount whether you're using the lower perch, the middle one of the highest one. What's inducing the lift ? the spring mounted higher in its seat. That's it. every groove is placed thecnically 0.7" higher from the previous one.
Start the the base, 0" lift, spring is preloaded on that seat the truck weight compresses the springs and the strut shaft will compress accordingly.
Now move the seat to the 1st notch, the spring now seats 0.7" higher than the base, the strut is compressing the same amount under weight, and the strut shaft is extending that much, so everything else remain exactly the same as far a s preload, except now you springs is sitting 0.7" higher, and the strut shaft has been extended that much. the truck goes up that amount.
Now move the seat to the 2nd notch and the spring will seat 1.4" higher than the base, the springs are compresing exactly the same amount under the truck weight but now you strut shaft is extended 1.4 from the whatver they were at when the spring was sitting on the zero notch. Get the idea now ?

The only way you will be adding more preload to the spring from whatever preload they get when you set them to any groove will be if you ran out of extension in the strut and the shaft has no way to extend further, or if you added extra weigh in the front via bumpers/winch etc. the amout of preload will change because of the extra weight as the spring is being crushed under weight.

I don't mean to say you don't have a clue either with you motorcycle example of prelaod and sag. , but here, knock yourself down i used to believe as well the spring was getting more preload. It doesn't and the concept is fairly simple to understand if you think about it.
http://www.promecha.com.au/sag_preload.htm

That article is 100% correct and validated my point

 

[ram1500rsm]

Preload does not change spring rate, I get that.

But taking the same spring “the stock one” and putting the clip higher up “applying more preload”, it will change the force the spring has on the shock.

It will rebound faster, and take more force to get it to move.

If I apply 400 lbs of preload on a strut spring I can put 350 lbs of weight on that strut and it will not compress.

If I apply 300 lbs of preload on the same strut spring and apply 350 lbs of weight on that strut, it will compress.

When you drive your truck and hit bumps the suspension moves, it’s not always at ride height.

Lol, don't over complicate yourself with the assumptions. Again preload only changes ride height assuming your shock is not maxed out.. You think the spring is compressing more but in reality is not as long as the strut shaft can extend in relation to the spring lifting the same weight. The spring is compressing exactly the same whether you're using the lower or higher perch as long as you're not adding any more weight.

See if you can grasp the concept from people who do this for a living. I had a conversation with them not long ago about this same topic. It was an eye opener.

https://accutuneoffroad.com/articles/coilover-spring-rates-for-toyota-tacoma-4runner/