New Front Brakes installed

[R/T_Fire]

I will definitely be doing this swap once I get my jeep or a trans in the blazer if I don't start cutting the axles out from under it.... With my time ability to dedicate to a project this is multi day project.

But great write up and it seems pretty easy to do. And makes changing spark plugs easier and leaves more room for the future twin turbo set up piping I would like to do.

What year cummins did you rob that from, I noticed you didn't mention it in your write up? does it need to be similar years or will lets say a 07 cummins work? I know where there is one sitting I can go rob the parts off of.

 

[charonblk07]

I got mine out of a '06 I believe that still have the 5.9L but it doesn't matter since every diesel has used the same hydrobooster since the start of the 3rd gens, just make sure you pay attention to the fluid reservoir and ensure that it has the sensor in it, unlike the first one I bought. The EcoDiesel and the 6.4Ls use the hydrobooster so they are available new if you want to pay that but the junk yard ones are perfectly fine and can be cleaned up just like mine.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

I would not suggest the hydro boost for you. For Charon it makes sense because he had less vac pressure.

As far as the reliability, the hydro booster will be worse. With it, if the engine stops you lose power brakes or if you have a problem with your power steering you lose brakes. Or if you break a belt you lose power brakes.

On the other hand the vac booster only fails if your motor is off or you lose vac.

 

[charonblk07]

If reliability was an issue with the hydroboost system do you really think it would be the system used in the HD trucks, including the 6.4L gas engine which pull a hell of a lot more weight and use the truck's brakes to slow and stop? I guess they just used the hydrobooster in the 6.4L because it performs better but is less reliable than a vacuum booster. Your fear mongering is pointless, the system is reliable and PROVEN. The system is installed the exact same way as it is on the 6.4L HD and diesel trucks so please just shut up about reliability because these trucks drive around all the time WITHOUT crashing because of hydrobooster failure.

Seriously, what if you have a belt failure or the engine stops? Having thrown a few belts with this setup because one idler pulley being too narrow (since changed out) AND having had to kill the engine while driving due to the lovely lightening bolt I can tell you that you still have brakes; there's plenty of pressure in the system even after the pump stops spinning to allow you to safely brake and pull over to the side of the road. Please relate your experience with this setup in either of these two failures that you've mentioned.

You don't like the system, fine, I don't like asparagus, which is why I don't eat it but I don't tell people they shouldn't eat it because I don't like it. In this particular case you are confusing opinion and fact.

 

[BlownGP]

Have a read through the how-to I did, should explain everything you need to do it. Because you have an '11 you still have a engine driven power steering pump which is what you need for the conversion, the '13+ guys are out of luck.

This mod doesn't affect the ABS at all as that functions independently as long as you have the fluid level sensor plugged in. Since I disable ABS and traction control anytime I'm going for a real drive it doesn't affect me either way but I did it because I was running low on vacuum with the blower and the new cam I'm installing will make it even worse. A local guy I know did the conversion on his '03 massively turbo'd hemi years ago and was able to make a set of stock pads and rotors stop the truck very effectively which was kind of my inspiration to do this myself.

That's a pretty cool setup.

If I was making the power you were, it would definitely be something on my to do list.

My brakes seem fine to me, I just merely want them for the looks. Plus the added bonus of stopping power.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

If reliability was an issue with the hydroboost system do you really think it would be the system used in the HD trucks, including the 6.4L gas engine which pull a hell of a lot more weight and use the truck's brakes to slow and stop? I guess they just used the hydrobooster in the 6.4L because it performs better but is less reliable than a vacuum booster. Your fear mongering is pointless, the system is reliable and PROVEN. The system is installed the exact same way as it is on the 6.4L HD and diesel trucks so please just shut up about reliability because these trucks drive around all the time WITHOUT crashing because of hydrobooster failure.

Seriously, what if you have a belt failure or the engine stops? Having thrown a few belts with this setup because one idler pulley being too narrow (since changed out) AND having had to kill the engine while driving due to the lovely lightening bolt I can tell you that you still have brakes; there's plenty of pressure in the system even after the pump stops spinning to allow you to safely brake and pull over to the side of the road. Please relate your experience with this setup in either of these two failures that you've mentioned.

You don't like the system, fine, I don't like asparagus, which is why I don't eat it but I don't tell people they shouldn't eat it because I don't like it. In this particular case you are confusing opinion and fact.

Slow down there dude.

They use that system because it makes it easier to apply a large amount of force without having to have a massive brake booster. It comes down to packaging sizes.

My point was that a hydroboost system has more points where it can fail, and includes all the points of failure that a vac boost system does with the exception of the vac system. You can argue all you want that the HD trucks do it reliably, but that's an OEM truck designed for it, ours are not.

And sure, you can make a single stop getting to the side of the road when you snap a belt. You could do the same with a vac boost system. But if you snap a belt on a vac boost, you can actually still drive around for a little bit before your engine will overheat or your battery will die and have brakes. No such luck on the hydroboost.

Lastly, I think you should stop having such a condescending attitude. I get that the product works for you, but it's NOT the best decision for everyone, and some of us on here have quite a bit of knowledge about these things, not just you. I completely agree with the reasons you have it and why Matt has it, but in the end it will not improve braking performance like a properly set up system of calipers, rotors, and pads would, period. All it does is reduce the amount of petal effort to produce a given clamp force from the calipers. It won't prevent your brakes from getting overheated. It won't increase the brake torque unless you already have an issue with not being able to produce enough clamping force, like Charon did because his vac pressure is low.

 

[R/T_Fire]

Easy Boys!!!!
There are pro and cons to every swap or modification. I like the idea of a non vacuum assist. Most hotrod or performance muscle cars I have built I have ditched the vacuum assist. also alot of cars come equipped with it.

Hydroboost are a better performing product imo and have there own designed fail safes if other component failure occurs. that doesn't change the level of inconvenience if a belt is tossed or a pump fails, but that is also why you plan for your situation and set up to be prepared

For my build and plans its a good fit in the long run, for my personal preference of systems its a good fit. So it is why it interests me.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

At least for all the racing I've seen, there are two systems that are used. Either vac assist or manual. The vac assist units are usually extremely complicated though. It's easier to just use multiple master cylinders with the proper leverage. Sure, you have to STOMP on the petal when you have hard braking, but you also get the best petal feel. That's unbelievably important when racing.

 

[R/T_Fire]

At least for all the racing I've seen, there are two systems that are used. Either vac assist or manual. The vac assist units are usually extremely complicated though. It's easier to just use multiple master cylinders with the proper leverage. Sure, you have to STOMP on the petal when you have hard braking, but you also get the best petal feel. That's unbelievably important when racing.

Yes but I'm also not building a track car, maybe a AutoX weekend warrior but more of a street/strip unit. I drive the truck hard on the street.
My biggest issue is I do not like the feel of my current set up, nor have I ever in any performance vehicle I have had. and I can say with experience that I like the feel of the hydroboost system that was equipped on my old 07 CTD.

Like I mentioned, they all have pro's and cons and a race car will see far more heat and extreme brake cycles than a street car or track car or even a weekend warrior Auto X. For me its a good fit especially when I plan to have forced induction at some point, a bigger cam etc etc.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

Yes but I'm also not building a track car, maybe a AutoX weekend warrior but more of a street/strip unit. I drive the truck hard on the street.
My biggest issue is I do not like the feel of my current set up, nor have I ever in any performance vehicle I have had. and I can say with experience that I like the feel of the hydroboost system that was equipped on my old 07 CTD.

Like I mentioned, they all have pro's and cons and a race car will see far more heat and extreme brake cycles than a street car or track car or even a weekend warrior Auto X. For me its a good fit especially when I plan to have forced induction at some point, a bigger cam etc etc.

Have you ever driven a car with a properly set up manual braking system? Once you do everything else just feels like ****.

 

[R/T_Fire]

Have you ever driven a car with a properly set up manual braking system? Once you do everything else just feels like ****.

Yes, my first 1967 mustang I built had a wilwood manual set up on it. it was also used as I will be using my truck.. it was a street/drag car that I also played with Auto X.

My CTD ram had very good feed back on braking and such, granted I wasn't racing it but it still got driven hard and towed even harder and you feel alot while towing especially 30k+ with 35" tires.

Alot of it is personal preference, especially cause I hate how these brakes feel, and I was happy with the Power stop until I felt a pop and now I have a leaky piston I think. I think there is more going on with my brakes than caliper issues. this is the 3rd caliper that has had issues and I haven't even been hard on the powerstops

 

[Dubstep Shep]

Yes, my first 1967 mustang I built had a wilwood manual set up on it. it was also used as I will be using my truck.. it was a street/drag car that I also played with Auto X.

My CTD ram had very good feed back on braking and such, granted I wasn't racing it but it still got driven hard and towed even harder and you feel alot while towing especially 30k+ with 35" tires.

Alot of it is personal preference, especially cause I hate how these brakes feel, and I was happy with the Power stop until I felt a pop and now I have a leaky piston I think. I think there is more going on with my brakes than caliper issues. this is the 3rd caliper that has had issues and I haven't even been hard on the powerstops

One of my biggest qualms with comparing the hydroboost on the HD trucks and ours is that the HD trucks have a brake system designed to take the increased pressures in the brake system. If you're already popping pistons out then pushing your brake system pressures higher isn't going to help you at all.

The problem with braking systems is that they're made to be easy to use over and over again in a variety of conditions, most of which are very easy to stop in. If you're using the same set of brakes to stop a 5,000 lb truck as when you use to stop a 6,000lb truck with a 10,000lb payload, you're going to feel the brakes a lot less on the unloaded truck. There's no way around that one. If you were to go to manual brakes you'd have the same issue, except that stopping the vehicle pulling all that weight would require a ridiculous amount of force on the petal.

 

[R/T_Fire]

One of my biggest qualms with comparing the hydroboost on the HD trucks and ours is that the HD trucks have a brake system designed to take the increased pressures in the brake system. If you're already popping pistons out then pushing your brake system pressures higher isn't going to help you at all.

The problem with braking systems is that they're made to be easy to use over and over again in a variety of conditions, most of which are very easy to stop in. If you're using the same set of brakes to stop a 5,000 lb truck as when you use to stop a 6,000lb truck with a 10,000lb payload, you're going to feel the brakes a lot less on the unloaded truck. There's no way around that one. If you were to go to manual brakes you'd have the same issue, except that stopping the vehicle pulling all that weight would require a ridiculous amount of force on the petal.

But the pressure is the same in the system whether its loaded, unloaded or not, its will apply the same amount of force with relation to the pedal pressure given and will have a more realistic feedback.
This is also the same reason as to why the larger brake kits use the increased amount of pistons to increase clamping force, (fluid pressure is still the same) but is multiplied by the piston force therefor increasing braking performance.

The pressure issue is specific to this truck, and I believe it to be a ABS module or something in the brake system causing this particular failure. every thing is in stock form, there is no modified parts except rotors which are OEM upgrades. I'm going to take things apart this weekend if I get time to investigate the issue. and if I find nothing then it is going to the dealership to be looked at as to why it is blowing up calipers.

Also when I upgrade to the hydro boost system I will also upgrade the calipers to a SSBC 4 piston caliper system.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

But the pressure is the same in the system whether its loaded, unloaded or not, its will apply the same amount of force with relation to the pedal pressure given and will have a more realistic feedback.
This is also the same reason as to why the larger brake kits use the increased amount of pistons to increase clamping force, (fluid pressure is still the same) but is multiplied by the piston force therefor increasing braking performance.

The pressure issue is specific to this truck, and I believe it to be a ABS module or something in the brake system causing this particular failure. every thing is in stock form, there is no modified parts except rotors which are OEM upgrades. I'm going to take things apart this weekend if I get time to investigate the issue. and if I find nothing then it is going to the dealership to be looked at as to why it is blowing up calipers.

Also when I upgrade to the hydro boost system I will also upgrade the calipers to a SSBC 4 piston caliper system.

The hydro boost works by increasing the amount of "boost" on the brake petal, meaning that for the same pressure on your foot the system pressure is increased.

 

[DocHoliday]

Hey guys ,anyone got the link to the Rotora brakes? I think the Power stop look amazing dude, sorry everyone got of the topic of your upgrade. I had the same kit on my 2005 Tahoe and loved them. I just put the SRT8 Jeep Kit Brembo on my 2015 Durango AWD RT and now I want to do my 14 Ram sport and the options suck. Are the power stop 2 piston front and back? is that what factory are? I haven't even looked I am so pissed that my complete Brembo upgrade cost less the just the fronts for the Baer ! So I am going Power Stop unless someone can help me with that link or SSBC for the rear? 1200 for the front is fine if you can produce the rear, otherwise, whats the point if you are not all the way around?

 

[charonblk07]

Hey guys ,anyone got the link to the Rotora brakes? I think the Power stop look amazing dude, sorry everyone got of the topic of your upgrade. I had the same kit on my 2005 Tahoe and loved them. I just put the SRT8 Jeep Kit Brembo on my 2015 Durango AWD RT and now I want to do my 14 Ram sport and the options suck. Are the power stop 2 piston front and back? is that what factory are? I haven't even looked I am so pissed that my complete Brembo upgrade cost less the just the fronts for the Baer ! So I am going Power Stop unless someone can help me with that link or SSBC for the rear? 1200 for the front is fine if you can produce the rear, otherwise, whats the point if you are not all the way around?

Here's the front SSBC kit as for the rotora, you'll need to contact them directly as they only made a few kits. When it comes to the rears you'll be hard pressed to find anything except matching rotors since the front-biased system take a lot of work away from the rear brakes, it's somewhere between 70/30 and 60/40, I can't remember the exact proportioning at this moment.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

Here's the front SSBC kit as for the rotora, you'll need to contact them directly as they only made a few kits. When it comes to the rears you'll be hard pressed to find anything except matching rotors since the front-biased system take a lot of work away from the rear brakes, it's somewhere between 70/30 and 60/40, I can't remember the exact proportioning at this moment.

70/30 is pretty standard for most vehicles. 60/40 would be for one that either had a big rear weight bias and/or big rear tires

 

[Big Boi]

Me too, thank you. And at the same pricing as OEM replacements it was hard not to go this route.

Summit was $65ish each rotor and $80ish for each caliper.
and $60 for the duralast performance ceramic pads.

AutoZone wanted the same price for OEM parts. So I figured it was a was to try these out for a OEM cost replacement comparison

So if I wanted to buy new calipers and mounting brackets all around it would be around $320? If so, I could have them powder coated before install!

 

[R/T_Fire]

So if I wanted to buy new calipers and mounting brackets all around it would be around $320? If so, I could have them powder coated before install!

That's always a option, with my time and such I opted for the already done caliper so I didn't have to paint or powdercoat myself.. it was the same price and just easier for me.

Kinda regretting it now if their quality isn't as good as they claim. I'm hoping its more of a fluke what I'm dealing with or something with my truck..

As for whoever asked about the Powerstop units, they are basically OEM 2 piston calipers that are rebuilt and supposedly re-engineered with better than OEM hardware.. so far they are nice and feel good except my leak somewhere that I don't have much time to find out why.

 

[BlownGP]

As for whoever asked about the Powerstop units, they are basically OEM 2 piston calipers that are rebuilt and supposedly re-engineered with better than OEM hardware.. so far they are nice and feel good except my leak somewhere that I don't have much time to find out why.

You change the crush washer on the brake line bolt on caliper?