Ram 1500 EV is questionable if it makes it to market

[NETim]

I think most folks that talk of how clean and how good for the environment the BEV's are have not seen a lithium mine or the way cobalt is mined. the proposed mine to be built in the desert of Nevada for example will use an estimated 1.7 Billion gallons of water a year and will create 75 semi truckloads per day of molten sulphuric acid. the mine when finished will produce an amount of co2 equal to a small city. just to the S.E. of the mine one can see the hole in the earth created by the much smaller Newmont gold mine by google earth. the BEV will be clean going down the road but a lot of polution will be created to get to that point. not to mention the major stock holder in the Thacker pass mine is a Chinese company.

I would really like to know how much CO2 is released in the production and transportation of ethanol.

I live in east central Nebraska. Every tillable acre is producing corn. Shelterbelts and fence rows are increasingly rare. Wildlife habitat is being replaced with endless cornfields. More chemicals are needed to grow more corn. More water is needed to irrigate the corn. More fertilizer is produced to grow more corn. More water is needed to process the corn into ethanol. All of this translates into more diesel being burned to produce all this corn.

So, the end result? From beginning to end, are we really reducing CO2 emissions by burning ethanol?

 

[runamuck]

widespread adoption of new technology can take a while and the kinks will eventually be worked out. meanwhile it has been reported that an immense cache of easily developed hydrogen was recently discovered and that could open a whole new focus on hydrogen powered cars/trucks

 

[NETim]

widespread adoption of new technology can take a while and the kinks will eventually be worked out. meanwhile it has been reported that an immense cache of easily developed hydrogen was recently discovered and that could open a whole new focus on hydrogen powered cars/trucks

There's definitely a time factor involved when new technology comes online.

I'd just prefer the process be market driven than by the dolts in DC.

 

[rzr6-4]

More water is needed to irrigate the corn.

Increasing popularity of pivots, sub irrigation (water dispensed directly to the roots), and poly pipe is allowing us to be more and more water efficient every year.

More fertilizer is produced to grow more corn.

Soil studies and variable rate applicators are now allowing for the same if not better yields while using LESS fertilizer and other chemicals.

And while I'm not a huge fan of removing shelter belts either, the corn/beans that are planted there are pulling CO2 out of the atmosphere the same as the tress would have, so it's not like it is a total loss.

Ethanol has its own set of issues and big daddy government mandating its use is garbage, but it does have potential as an alternative fuel for ICE engines in the future when the green whackos inevitably get oil banned/regulated out of existence.

 

[Dave Haddon]

Well survey says Giganova types are in the low % range and probably a different pay range than the average guy..to each their own. But all the points made by runamuck are an eyebrow raiser. The alleged study by "The brain childs".should have dug deep and looked at all the negative points. The factors made by the many open eyed members on this forum for example is a tip of the iceberg...in the big picture..cross section of folks able to access and pay for charging..the infrstructure required....to flooding..safety aspect of fires..to maintenance costs..cold weather adaptability..the mining..on and on...so many valid points you make lads..Bottom line we do have the power...just do not buy..the Big 4 will succumb ...as will the politicians who get their pockets lined for pushing this ill thought through idea..and lastly to those climate change hysteria types..the time has come and gone my friends that this aspect of EV's will make any difference in the big picture...on that note have a great weekend all you brothers & sisters ....drive your Ram and enjoy!

 

[NETim]

Increasing popularity of pivots, sub irrigation (water dispensed directly to the roots), and poly pipe is allowing us to be more and more water efficient every year.


Soil studies and variable rate applicators are now allowing for the same if not better yields while using LESS fertilizer and other chemicals.

And while I'm not a huge fan of removing shelter belts either, the corn/beans that are planted there are pulling CO2 out of the atmosphere the same as the tress would have, so it's not like it is a total loss.

Ethanol has its own set of issues and big daddy government mandating its use is garbage, but it does have potential as an alternative fuel for ICE engines in the future when the green whackos inevitably get oil banned/regulated out of existence.

I understand fertilizer and chemicals are being applied MUCH more efficiently now and I expect that trend to continue. However, there is less "idle" land out there now. Whether or not this all translates into less fertilizer or not, I can't say for sure.

I'd like to know how many BTU's are required, through the entire production chain, to produce 1 BTU of ethanol.

 

[Docwagon1776]

I would really like to know how much CO2 is released in the production and transportation of ethanol.

Personal theory, I think the environmentalism aspect is a trojan horse and ethanol is a subsidy for domestic agriculture and energy diversity for national defense. Military motors are multi-fuel, and having an alternative to oil if supplies are disrupted is pretty important. Remember the interstate system wasn't built to enhance commerce and tourism, that was a side effect, it was built for national security. Rules about US shipping and mandates for ships built in the US, same, a subsidy for the industry to protect the ability to build warships at home. Even all this battery tech directly benefits the soldier on the ground as power sources get lighter and more robust.

 

[star_deceiver]

My wife has a commute of 110 miles one way and never has to pull over to charge the Tesla. 220 miles back & forth and she charges when she's back home, no problem at all.

Wait… your wife spends almost 4hrs every day commuting??? All wife out of the house jokes aside, to me, that is a huge problem. Time apart has costs and you won’t get time back.

 

[BossHogg]

That's overly optimistic.

The infrastructure to support charging large numbers of EVs will take decades to put in place. For homeowners it's relatively easy to put in a home charger. For the 36% of American households who rent? You think the landlord is going to be installing chargers?

What about all the people who park on the street or in a lot or garage? Even if the chargers are there what's to stop some hoodlum from unplugging them all in the middle of the night?

Of course none of this addresses the matter of available power in the electric grid. California has ...

Optimistic, yes, overly, well I don't have a crystal ball but I don't think overly but to your point, there are many variables involved. I'm not suggesting the entire population will run out and buy an EV when solid-state batteries (if they deliver what they promise) hit the market. It will be a slow adoption (if folks find them affordable) and likely pace the recharging infrastructure development. I do have inside information, my neighbor is in a position with DTE, the area electric company. He tells me the grid in this area is fully capable of supporting an EV recharging infrastructure.

There are so many variables and many regions in our country that have different use cases and solutions. Take my son, he has a one-way commute of 33 miles to work. He drives a Bolt and in the winter, he cannot make the round trip but because his employer has installed recharging stations, he can. So, many folks who live in apartments, condos, and neighborhoods without our private garages that could not recharge at home, may find recharging resources at their work.

Then there is my use case. I would entertain an EV pickup that had the ability to tow my fishing boat to places I fish which are for the most part, in the middle of nowhere (think the Michigan thumb coasts). I'm not going to find a recharging station that would be capable of high output, I think they call them superchargers. If I can't get a towing range of several hundred miles, the EV pickup is dead to me. Then at home, I don't and won't have a supercharger. Residential areas simply do not have this amount of power available (I believe 480 volt 3 phase is needed). What did TFL measure, a 220-volt home recharger took somewhere around 4 days to recharge the Hummer EV. That isn't going to work for anybody.

Then there are the issues of the battery versus the climate you are in. 20% plus capacity is lost when in cold or hot climates, basically half the country. That sucks.

Then the negativity that is hitting news cycles regarding recharging stations. Located out and away from stores and bathrooms, lacks weather cover, safety and security issues, recharging has multiple standards (they really need to select one, only one if they want success), broken charges (this seems to be a significant issue), and then I've read recently about the recharger's phone app not connecting leaving people stuck.

And the creeps running around at night unplugging EV chargers you mentioned, not only do I see that happening, but it will, and often I'm sad to say. If you have an EV, you get unplugged and if your have an ICE, you get your tires slashed. What's left, a bike, they will steal that, a horse got to feed and room it and then it will, as dictated by Murphy, take a dump in the most inopportune place. Now we are down to walking, where you can get mugged.

California is so different, in a bad way, that it shouldn't be used for comparison unless the topic is garbage dumps.

 

[crash68]

recharging has multiple standards (they really need to select one, only one if they want success),

Most of the auto manufacturers have jumped over to using the NACS (or Tesla) charger standard. Your right about using one standard along with all chargers should have to treat all vehicles equally as far as charging speed ability (controlled by the vehicle not because the vehicles brand).
The government should have sat down with all the car manufacturers to make the agree on the standard then included that with the mandates of going to electrified vehicles

 

[BossHogg]

I will definitely buy the RAM EV when it comes out.

When my wife bought a Tesla, I was highly skeptical about EVs, but I was totally wrong and there are so many misconceptions out there:

Range Anxiety: non-issue. Tesla superchargers are incredibly fast: 10 min and its up to 80% again, so you hook it up at the Tesla supercharges at the gas station, go to the bathroom, get a soda, and when you come out the Tesla is at 80% again. My wife has a commute of 110 miles one way and never has to pull over to charge the Tesla. 220 miles back & forth and she charges when she's back home, no problem at all. And here on the East cost, Tesla supercharges are everywhere.

Battery replacement or degradation? That's all a myth. My friend has one of the first Tesla Model S that came out and after 10+ years, the battery is still like new and holds a full charge. The trick is to charge it to the recommended 80% and only to 100% when you need it.

Costs: charging the Tesla at home costs me a whopping $6 in electricity. Zero maintenance costs other than tire rotation.

What are the other "many misconceptions" outside of what you mentioned?

The time it takes to recharge a battery is variable with respect to the current battery charge. Typically, a search reveals a supercharger requires somewhere between 20 and 40 minutes to get to 80% charge (in a Telsa of an unknown battery size). But you are talking Telsa. Let's talk about recharge time in an EV pickup with a battery size of around 230 kWh (EV pickups seem to have batteries that range between 200 and 250 kWh). If your pickup EV is at 10% (23 kWh) and you want to charge it to 80% (184 kWh) you would need to put in 161 kWh of charge. A 220 volt 30 amp home charger would take just over 24 hours to do that in a perfect world but we know that around 15% of the recharging power is lost to heat. So add to the recharge time accordingly.

Range anxiety is real if you do not have a network of supercharges available to you, many of us do not (where I live, I do not) so range is the number one issue. Are we still talking about the RAM EV, you started with getting one, and then you tried to make an apples-to-apples with a Telsa.

Each time the battery goes through a discharge/recharge cycle, it loses capacity. I'll let you do your own research and you can start with the search phrase "What causes lithium-ion battery degradation"

From what I've seen recharging at home is cost-effective but the bigger the EV's battery, the longer the recharge takes exceeding overnight recharge possibilities. On the road, it seems recharging costs are on par or a bit more costly when compared to gasoline.

Generally speaking, EVs have lower maintenance costs than similar ICE-powered vehicles but do they? They're harder on their tires and a study suggests the cost of oil changes and filters on an ICE is a wash with EVs and tires. The biggest expense of an EV is replacing the battery which has an undetermined life and vehicle insurance, it is getting very costly to insure an EV and some insurance companies are not renewing EV policies. This has to do with the vehicle getting into an accident, even a fender bender, the insurance industry claims they have no way to determine if the battery had internal or external damage. Apparently, the battery case is part of the vehicle's structural integrity in some EV designs.

 

[BossHogg]

The government should have sat down with all the car manufacturers to make the agree on the standard then included that with the mandates of going to electrified vehicles

Should have, yes. But the whole of the green push was political and not technical.

 

[DanAR]

If Regular Cars were like EVs... | MGUY Australia

Send tips or stories to Instagram: https://instagram.com/mguy.tv or email: [email protected] - thanks!Follow MGUY on Instagram : https://instagram.com/mguy.tv...

youtu.be

 

[dsword]

half the price but the cost of maintenance is 1000x what is is for an ev. my wifes Tesla cost $15 for maintenance in 2023,not including insurance.it may be a little more next year because it will need new wiper blades. she's on the list for a cybertruck.if we're on a road trip it cost about $17 for a full recharge which goes on my oldest sons account.my powerwagon cost about $200 to fill.

Here in Wisconsin, when the weather starts to get chilly, my daughter's Tesla ends up costing as much for "fuel" as her Jeep Wrangler. The operating costs of a Tesla are highly dependent on location and usage. In this location, with the environment and the lack of charging infrastructure, Teslas (and any other EV) are a joke. All of the big YouTubers are dumping their EVs because they are a nightmare to roadtrip, even in warm climates.

The U.S. is not ready for EVs except for maybe some daily drivers in a big city. Useless to the other 95%ers.

 

[tron67j]

Wait until it comes time to replace that battery my friend.

Tesla's also have interiors that are more suitable in a geo prizm. Guess we all value different things in our purchases, for me it's not just the cost but like 99% of my pushback against electric trucks is due to range and how impractical it is to work with.

I had a Geo Prizm. Hairdryer for an engine, but with 4 snow tires I could co anywhere. When snow hit deep enough I imagine I looked like one of those snowplow trains running tracks in winter. But more mousy.

 

[demonram]

Not all municipalities have the grid to recharge every vehicle battery every day, plus run your home, plus charger fires, insurance companies cancelling homeowner policies due to potential fire hazard, cancelling or raising automobile policy because of repair cost associated with EV's, how many other drawbacks can anyone on here add to the list? Maybe they are practical for local trips where you don't have to drive it every day. But taking everything into consideration from all I read on this topic, EV's just aren't practical for everyone.

 

[DA Smith]

half the price but the cost of maintenance is 1000x what is is for an ev. my wifes Tesla cost $15 for maintenance in 2023,not including insurance.it may be a little more next year because it will need new wiper blades. she's on the list for a cybertruck.if we're on a road trip it cost about $17 for a full recharge which goes on my oldest sons account.my powerwagon cost about $200 to fill.

Big deal EV sucks I'm not interested!

 

[2019RamInSC]

half the price but the cost of maintenance is 1000x what is is for an ev. my wifes Tesla cost $15 for maintenance in 2023,not including insurance.it may be a little more next year because it will need new wiper blades. she's on the list for a cybertruck.if we're on a road trip it cost about $17 for a full recharge which goes on my oldest sons account.my powerwagon cost about $200 to fill.

CyberTruck. That is one fine looking vehicle there.

 

[tron67j]

To talk about batteries always gives me great pause. They are not finite items and are incredibly expensive to replace. One way I have thought about this is a recently looked at one of those electric zero turn mowers that was on clearance at Lowe's for about 3,500. It needs six batteries and the instructions recommend 17 amp hour batteries. However, it only came with 13 amp hour batteries. So usage time I'm sure is very limited. I looked at buying the six 17 amp hour batteries just for giggles and the total to replace all those batteries was about $3700. I certainly am not against doing things that will help our environment, it certainly isn't the best too dump all the emissions into it. However, it's got to be in a way that allows us to gradually adjust to it rather than all at once and that doesn't leave us holding the bag for future impacts (replacement costs, future disposal). Couldn't imagine buying a lawn mower that I'd be spending that kind of money in a couple years. When I buy a truck, I certainly don't expect to have to replace such an expensive item in a few years and I keep my trucks for a long time. Knowing that my ability to use my truck as I want would diminish over time certainly won't get me in the seat of an electric one. In fact, I think that electric vehicles need to be sold at a discount to regular ice vehicles to account for the increase costs of batteries, tires, and other related impacts of buying such. But lose government subsidies, they just transfer money from our pockets to corporate leaders by way of artificially increasing sales. If a product is that good and priced right it will fly off the lot all by itself.

 

[ramffml]

CyberTruck. That is one fine looking vehicle there.

You misspelled "fugly".