15% ethanol

[Old Tractor Man]

All I have to say is this: 1. Unless you have been purchasing specifically identified 100% gasoline you have been running 10% ethanol blend for years. 2. One needs to include the cost per gallon difference between 10% ethanol and 100% gasoline in your equation. 3. I am at a loss how you arrive at an increase in food prices as it relates to ethanol. Ethanol production fluctuates somewhat, but, if you are looking at today's food prices it is not because of ethanol. 4. I had a 2013 flex fuel Ram and know for a fact the truck did not suffer performance or mpg when using E85. Scientific America, and just about every other publication that proposes global warming, i.e. climate change for ALL the weather and geopolitical problems do so because it is a political agenda. As for grass biofuel, yes, there is merit in using this renewable fuel. However, given a farmers thin profit margin, the cost of equipment and storage facilities to convert to grass is prohibitive.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Simple market dynamics - you take a finite supply of corn and take away some to use to make ethanol, the price of corn in the food market is higher than it would have been. Google it.

 

[Ralph Crume]

I was thinking if Ethanol was such a good fuel , Why is it that some gas equipment has a warning sticker that if you use Ethanol it voids the warranty?

 

[GTyankee]

Sweet Corn usually goes to the store
when the stalk is no longer producing sweet corn, it is plowed under to put the protein back into the ground.

Cow corn is usually eaten by cows, there is really no eatable corn kernels on a stalk

When you are driving through the corn fields along the highway, that is mostly cow corn

Bioenergy Corn | CropWatch​

https://cropwatch.unl.edu › bioenergy › corn

by A Links — Corn grain makes a good biofuel feedstock due to its starch content and relative easy conversion to ethanol.

==================================
I saw some people mentioning prices, as of May 1st, you will be pumping summer gas into your gas vehicles
Your prices will jump when that happens, some stations are already selling it

I will continue driving my diesel, i know that finding Diesel #2 is getting harder to find & we are getting price gouged.
diesel substitute is cooking oil & it is crap

 

[fireflymedic]

All I have to say is this: 1. Unless you have been purchasing specifically identified 100% gasoline you have been running 10% ethanol blend for years. 2. One needs to include the cost per gallon difference between 10% ethanol and 100% gasoline in your equation. 3. I am at a loss how you arrive at an increase in food prices as it relates to ethanol. Ethanol production fluctuates somewhat, but, if you are looking at today's food prices it is not because of ethanol. 4. I had a 2013 flex fuel Ram and know for a fact the truck did not suffer performance or mpg when using E85. Scientific America, and just about every other publication that proposes global warming, i.e. climate change for ALL the weather and geopolitical problems do so because it is a political agenda. As for grass biofuel, yes, there is merit in using this renewable fuel. However, given a farmers thin profit margin, the cost of equipment and storage facilities to convert to grass is prohibitive.

I Was a farmer. Once they started using corn for Ethanol (years ago) it raised the cost of corn substancely and all most immediately. This took all the profits from our farm (dairy)

 

[dhay13]

I was thinking if Ethanol was such a good fuel , Why is it that some gas equipment has a warning sticker that if you use Ethanol it voids the warranty?

Ethanol will break down and erode certain materials. Seals and fittings, as well as fuel lines will deteriorate after awhile. Newer cars are made with components compatible with ethanol. It's not necessarily bad for the engine itself. We bought a boat in 2018 that had been sitting for 3 years with regular pump gas in it. I had to drain about 50 gallons out of it (75 gallon tank) and you could see the ethanol separate from the fuel. About 20 of the 50 gallons had separated. Even after that it wouldn't stay running so I rebuilt the carb. I have rebuilt dozens of carbs back in the day and used to modify my carbs when I drag raced so am very comfortable tearing one down. This one had white crystalized pieces stuck inside the float bowl that I had to scrape off. This was crystalized ethanol. Even after this it wouldn't run right so I beoke down and bought a new carb and it ran like brand new. Apparently some ethanol had crystalized in my idle circuits and I couldn't get them out.

 

[mcarey]

Looking at long term corn futures charts is pretty interesting. I'm sure the farmers are quite happy. Though, I'm of the opinion the recent price climb has a lot more to do with Chinese import costs than the less than a handful of percentage points each billion gallons of ethanol creates.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Sweet Corn usually goes to the store
when the stalk is no longer producing sweet corn, it is plowed under to put the protein back into the ground.

Cow corn is usually eaten by cows, there is really no eatable corn kernels on a stalk

When you are driving through the corn fields along the highway, that is mostly cow corn

Bioenergy Corn | CropWatch​

https://cropwatch.unl.edu › bioenergy › corn

by A Links — Corn grain makes a good biofuel feedstock due to its starch content and relative easy conversion to ethanol.

==================================
I saw some people mentioning prices, as of May 1st, you will be pumping summer gas into your gas vehicles
Your prices will jump when that happens, some stations are already selling it

I will continue driving my diesel, i know that finding Diesel #2 is getting harder to find & we are getting price gouged.
diesel substitute is cooking oil & it is crap

Little wonder they don't feed corn to pigs anymore. (pearls before swine) Maybe it will stop some of the deer corn feeders around here too - spreading CWD disease and concentrating deer on their stands.

 

[Tfitz44]

There is no doubt the whole Ethanol+gasoline thing is nothing but a scam and it has HURT our economy. When the government started PAYING farmers (subsidies) to truck their corn crop to the ethanol plant rather than producing food stuffs; the prices of grocery store jumped sharply. Live stock and poultry production rely on corn. Also corn and corn based products go into a lot of the food we eat. It caused everything to get more expensive. Does anyone remember the rioting in Mexico because the prices of corn tortillas went way up?

REGARDLESS of what most people claim personally my experience running Ethanol+Gas fuels is I got worse mileage and worse performance. One of the best vehicles we ever owned was a '95 Jeep Grand Cherokee with the 5.2L It ran like new on 100% gas; smooth as silk. But on Ethanol+gas it pinged, got worse mileage, and performance was sluggish. I wasn't going to crack it open to investigate since it had nearly 200K on it. The fact is Ethanol in any amount is a poor fuel in an engine designed for gasoline. When the last gas station that was near the house went to Ethanol gas, we put it up for sale. Fast forward to now. If I fill up on ethanol gas in my 2014 Hemi RAM; even considering engine management is much more sophisticated still compared to 100% gasoline; it does not run as smooth, it is more sluggish and gets worse mileage.
This is the most glaring issue in my opinion. Corn is a poor choice if you want to produce Ethanol.
Other types of grasses (switchgrass) are a much better choice and WOULD NOT impact the economy by causing food prices to spike. How much better? Considering the return on energy used to produce and process the grass it is 540% return as compared to 25% return for corn. (info from Scientific American) So why are they not sourcing these grasses instead of corn? This is not hard to figure out. It is about political power. Some politicians purchased the farm vote with this scheme they remain in power.
You want to give the U.S of A. a real economic boost? END the farm subsidies for Ethanol.
Probably will never happen. You will not ever see Washington let go of political power.

Well, I don’t agree that it’s a scam, at the time it was implemented, it was intended to reduce emissions, support farmers, and cut U.S. dependence on energy imports. But since 2005, there’s been a lot of advances made in Biofuels. Other than using switchgrass, Industrial Hemp is another great alternative. Due to its high cellulose content, hemp has an estimated 540% energy gain compared to corn’s 34%.

And the only things I use non-ethanol gas in are my lawnmowers and all my 2-cycle engines. The one time I put non-ethanol gas in my old truck (2010 GMC Sierra), it ran like ****. And I put in a full tank too. Never did that again. I have yet to try non-ethanol in my 2021 RAM Rebel, afraid of what it might do. I did run a tank of 88 octane (E15) and that was the best my truck has ever run. Engine was smooth, pedal response was slightly better, and couldn’t really notice if my MPG’s changed or not. I doubt it would be noticeable since it’s only 5% more ethanol.

Well, just my two cents. Cheers!

 

[Dusty]

"Sweet Corn usually goes to the store
when the stalk is no longer producing sweet corn, it is plowed under to put the protein back into the ground."

I would think every environmentalist would be screaming about this. Every time crop soils are tilled, carbon is released into the environment.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 3 June 2018. Now at 68533 miles

 

[HEMIMANN]

I would think every environmentalist would be screaming about this. Every time crop soils are tilled, carbon is released into the environment.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 3 June 2018. Now at 68533 miles

Therein lies the problem - environmentalists without scientific training are just blowhards. We all have opinions - but I'm not so vain as spouting loudly if I know nothing at all about a topic.

 

[mcarey]

I would think every environmentalist would be screaming about this. Every time crop soils are tilled, carbon is released into the environment.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 3 June 2018. Now at 68533 miles

Environmentalists have been, and currently are, against ethanol expansion. Been all over the news this month, too.

It's actually a somewhat entertaining quandary. The oilheads and the Environmentalists are finally in an agreement over something, but ya know... bipartisan teamwork is abominable.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Environmentalists have been, and currently are, against ethanol expansion. Been all over the news this month, too.

It's actually a somewhat entertaining quandary. The oilheads and the Environmentalists are finally in an agreement over something, but ya know... bipartisan teamwork is abominable.

Musta missed that over the past 30 years. The environmental groups around here remain brainwashed by the corn lobby. MN is a big corn grower and has a huge lobby that's bought off our Legislature in many ways - tax exemption, mandatory usage, false data, etc..

 

[tidefan1967]

Musta missed that over the past 30 years. The environmental groups around here remain brainwashed by the corn lobby. MN is a big corn grower and has a huge lobby that's bought off our Legislature in many ways - tax exemption, mandatory usage, false data, etc..

That’s one thing that both groups have in common: padding their pockets. Personally IDGAF about climate change or voluntarily changing or giving up anything that I’m comfortable with.

 

[mcarey]

Musta missed that over the past 30 years. The environmental groups around here remain brainwashed by the corn lobby. MN is a big corn grower and has a huge lobby that's bought off our Legislature in many ways - tax exemption, mandatory usage, false data, etc..

It's definitely multifaceted. You have environmental groups who feel it's better because it lessens oil usage, groups who feel it supports the farmers instead of the miners, groups who think its better or worse for the planet, etc. Much like anything, you can always find someone lobbying for something.

Maybe corn country isnt hearing the environmental pushback, but it's definitely taking place across the country.

That’s one thing that both groups have in common: padding their pockets. Personally IDGAF about climate change or voluntarily changing or giving up anything that I’m comfortable with.

Yikes. Must be nice living in stone age.

 

[tidefan1967]

It's definitely multifaceted. You have environmental groups who feel it's better because it lessens oil usage, groups who feel it supports the farmers instead of the miners, groups who think its better or worse for the planet, etc. Much like anything, you can always find someone lobbying for something.

Maybe corn country isnt hearing the environmental pushback, but it's definitely taking place across the country.


Yikes. Must be nice living in stone age.

And yet I feel certain many people feel the same way. That’s what happens when you get older and see how much the world has really gone to sh#% in such a short period of time!

 

[quickster2]

Just what we need......higher corn prices for feed, ethanol, and other corn uses. We have no energy policy. A dartboard would probably give better results.

 

[Dusty]

Just what we need......higher corn prices for feed, ethanol, and other corn uses. We have no energy policy. A dartboard would probably give better results.

Actually we do have an energy policy: everything related to fossil fuels is bad.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 3 June 2018. Now at 68555 miles

 

[GTyankee]

I was raised on a Dairy Farm
We had enough land to raise enough Cow corn to last a year.
We also owned & leased enough land to grow almost enough wheat & i think rye grass, but i am not sure, i left the farm 57 years ago.
We always had to buy 2 or 3 semi trucks & trailers of hay to make it until May or June.
All of the sweet & cow corn stalks were used for silage , the base of the stalks were plowed into the ground in the Fall.
Then all of the manure from 200 head of cows, heifers & calves were spread on all of the fields during the winter.
I suppose some group would complain about that too.

We also had to buy 100 pound bags of grain all year long

We usually sold about 900 gallons of milk per day & i think my Grandfather said that he got something like 10 cents per gallon, but that was in the mid to late 1950s.
Nothing goes to waste on a dairy farm, but there is no profit, you can't hire anyone full time.

 

[dhay13]

off topic but crossed over the state line into Ohio tonight. About 15 miles from my house gas is about .50/gallon cheaper so we filled up over there. But noticed regular 87 was 3.79 and diesel was 4.99