2004 Dodge Ram 5.7 Rough Running

[ABuchler]

Hello, everyone. I have a 2004 Dodge Ram with the 5.7L, and I'm having some problems with the old truck. Before I parked it last winter, I replaced all the spark plugs with new Champion 570s, and tried to replace the PCV Valve, but it snapped off in the intake manifold and I had to remove the entire intake manifold to try and extract it. I successfully extracted the PCV valve and replaced it with a new one, and while I was in there I replaced the intake manifold gaskets and cleaned the inside of the manifold the best I could, I also sprayed down the throttle body and cleaned it. I installed everything when I was done and now the truck has a rough idle, sometimes it will smooth out a little bit, but it runs significantly rougher than before I did all the work, and sometimes while driving down the road at lower RPMs, it has a very distinct fish-bite type feel as if a cylinder or two have a dead miss. I took it to a shop to see if they could diag the problem, and the only things they pointed out was the EGR Valve was stuck open and the very obvious exhaust leak (the manifolds are warped, as is common on the trucks, and they're pretty bad). They said the exhaust leak was messing with the reading of the O2 sensors, and is causing the rough running issue, but I'm not gonna give them 1,100 dollars to replace one manifold, and besides, the truck was running fine before with the exhaust leak, it didn't make it run like it is now. So, I replaced the EGR valve, including both gaskets from the head to the EGR valve and from the EGR valve to the EGR pipe, and the one gasket from the EGR pipe to the intake manifold. Fingers crossed that it would fix it and unfortunately it did not, so now I have no clue. Not sure if it's relevant but after the test drive after the EGR valve replacement I turned the key off and even pulled it out of the ignition and it was still running. I had to pull the fuel pump relay to get it to shut off. Also, when I try to hook my scan tool up to it (Innova 5610), some functions, such as Active Test no longer work, and it tells me it can't communicate with the PCM, however, other things still work fine, not sure what that's about. Codes are indicating multiple cylinder misfire, however live data doesn't show me which cylinders are misfiring.
So here's my questions for the forums. Should I just bite the bullet and call around for a decent price quote on exhaust manifold replacement, or is there something else that's cheaper to replace that I should try first? I'm kind of sick of taking it to shops because they just want to charge me an exorbitant amount of money and fire the parts cannon at it. Is there a specific problem that aligns with the symptoms of what's happening? I've heard about valve springs breaking, and also heard about PCM's frying, but not sure if I should take that route yet. There's no forbidden glitter in the oil.
Any suggestions? Thanks

 

[Hanover Fiste]

My 2005 5.7 calls for Champion RE14MCC4 plugs. Are you sure the plugs you installed are compatible? Torqued properly? Are the plug wires installed correctly?

It's also possible there is an intake leak somewhere that was created when the gasket and PCV valve were replaced.

Is the Check Engine light on? Any trouble codes detected when the system is scanned?

 

[ABuchler]

The 570s do read RE14MCC4 on the porcelain, so I'm sure they're compatible. All plugs torqued to 12-13 ft-lbs. The wasted spark flyover plug wires were installed following a diagram and done multiple times. The CEL is also illuminated, however the bulb is out on the dash cluster, so I'm not sure if it's a engine light blinking misfire or not. Codes pulled were P0300, and P0038, of which only P0300 is new.

 

[ABuchler]

A new DTC has appeared since the last time I checked, now displaying a P0700 as well.

 

[kevkev]

Make sure you didnt miss torque on one bolt on the intake.Easy to miss.

 

[ABuchler]

Would an undertorque or overtorque on the manifold bolts cause such a prevalent misifre like this? I torqued all bolts to 12 nm in a circular pattern from the middle out, so to my knowledge everything is torqued to spec.

 

[jws123]

Would an undertorque or overtorque on the manifold bolts cause such a prevalent misifre like this? I torqued all bolts to 12 nm in a circular pattern from the middle out, so to my knowledge everything is torqued to spec.

yes I would tighten it til it feels snug/firm torque wrenches are useless for plastic and things this small

 

[ABuchler]

I've double checked the torques, and everything seems to be fine. I also bit the bullet and took it to a muffler shop to get the passenger side manifold fixed, they resurfaced it and replaced the gasket and bolts, according to the guy, every single bolt on the passenger side was broken, doesn't surprise me. Truck runs a lot quieter and I've never heard it this quiet in the 2 and a half years I've owned it, but it still runs like crap, and now that the exhaust is running INTO the exhaust pipes, I can hear that it's backfiring, still have P0300 and P0038. P0038 points to downstream O2 sensor on Bank 1, so I'm gonna replace the downstream sensor and cross my fingers that it'll make a difference, though I doubt it will. Also, while I was driving it to the shop, I noticed some smoke coming from between the bed and cab, and it smelled heavily of burning rubber or an electrical burning smell, and I immediately got out and disconnected the battery. At first I thought it was the fuel pump overheating or something, but when I crawled under the truck I noticed smoke practically billowing out of a large heatshield above the transmission in the transmission tunnel. The smoke was coming out from between the top of the tunnel and the heat shield. Are there any harnesses that run up there and what are they? Is this a common thing for these to short out if there are, and should I be worried? I don't want the truck to burn down. Not sure if this is related to my rough running issue.

 

[Tominator223]

Sounds like you damaged a plug wire. 700 is a trans code. The factory cats are Not very good. Mine actually blew out completely just after I hit 100,000 miles. The valve springs are not an issue, But the valve seats can drop after a good hot freeway run & then parking for a few min. And then starting back up and driving. A lower t-stat has fixed this in my opinion . I did the 6.1 coil / valve cover swap. (Tired of plug wires). Mmx has apdapter plugs for 6.1 coils on a 5.7. You have to buy 6.1 valve covers to use 6.1 coils. You may also have a crossed wire . A bad or crossed will cause all kinds of codes.

 

[Tominator223]

Also if you have a vacuum leak ,you can spray carb cleaner or WD40 around intake & such. While running. If the idle goes up you found the leak.

 

[ABuchler]

Sounds like you damaged a plug wire. 700 is a trans code. The factory cats are Not very good. Mine actually blew out completely just after I hit 100,000 miles. The valve springs are not an issue, But the valve seats can drop after a good hot freeway run & then parking for a few min. And then starting back up and driving. A lower t-stat has fixed this in my opinion . I did the 6.1 coil / valve cover swap. (Tired of plug wires). Mmx has apdapter plugs for 6.1 coils on a 5.7. You have to buy 6.1 valve covers to use 6.1 coils. You may also have a crossed wire . A bad or crossed will cause all kinds of codes.

I think I got all the plug wires in the proper orientation, I used a couple of diagrams online and redid it a few times, and just to be sure I went out and did it again. I don't plan to do the wasted spark system delete, but it could've been possible that I damaged a wire. I just don't see how that would cause such a horrible misfire since those wires are only for the second spark plug pulse that gets rid of any additional unburnt fuel, but I guess if replacing the O2 sensor doesn't fix it, I could try plug wires. What brand would be good for these? I know they're picky about certain parts and brands, such as preferring Champion Copper spark plugs and not liking the Bosch O2 sensors.

P.S. I think the Trans code is due to the battery dying a couple of times, since the low voltage codes are stored in the TCM for some reason. No new codes, or any cylinder specific misfire codes unfortunately (that would make things a lot easier)

 

[ABuchler]

Alright, I got an update. Received the replacement driver side downstream O2 sensor today, and replaced it. The harness on the old one was completely gone, almost like someone just snipped the harness at the base of the sensor, weird. Anyway, after clearing the codes and taking it around the block a few times, the ECM was able to set a new code. After the test drive, a P0171 DTC was set, and a P2097 DTC was pending, which is kind of confusing since one code indicates lean mixture and the other a rich mixture, but now I'm suspecting a vacuum leak. Am I headed in the right direction? What are the common areas for a vacuum leak to occur on these engines? I've already replaced the intake gaskets, PCV valve, and EGR system gaskets, what else should I check?

 

[ABuchler]

Another update. I decided to replace all ignition coils and spark plug wires, and it fixed it, or so I thought. It now runs fine at idle and at most RPMs, but it was still throwing a P0301 and P0306 code, as well as sometimes a P0300. It also was throwing a P2097, and a P0113, but I cleared the codes and the only code that came back was the P0306 and P0300. At first, I didn't think anything was wrong, just felt a little sluggish, but then I took it on the highway for the first time and got it up to 70 and it started running poorly; misfiring and everything. It seems to happen more when the truck is in a higher gear and more throttle is applied, such as under a load. Also, the truck has a very hard time starting after sitting. This all makes me suspect that it might be a bad injector, and so I was going to replace the Cyl 6 injector, but wasn't sure if this was the right way to go. Any additional input would be appreciated.

 

[Barr2255]

Wow, this truck is testing your patience. Did you ever spray starting fluid or brake clean around the intake manifold to insure you don’t have a vaccum leak?

Rough running and a miss under load and those speeds make me think fuel issue. Go rent a fuel pressure testor guage and make sure it in spec.

Before replacing injector give it a heavy dose of seafoam and some good quality gas, chevron or shell. Cheaper than replacing injectors and it’s beneficial to your motor either way even if it doesn’t fix the current issue.

 

[GTyankee]

2004 Dodge Ram 5.7L

Information for CHAMPION 570
{Alternate Inventory Numbers: RE14MCC4}
other plugs that will work, listed on this site

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I would not use Carb Cleaner, there is a special coating on every throttle body,
Though, a 2004 throttle body may have lost the coating long ago
Use throttle body cleaner to clean it

As for the other codes

p0700 is only a Generic Trouble Code for the Transmission until there are numbers after the p07
it does not mean anything

same with p0300 only means that there is a misfire
where p0306, means that the misfire is at cylinder 6

this site is one of the best trouble shooting sites

OBD-II Check Engine Light Trouble Codes

 

[ABuchler]

I've already tried the carb cleaner trick and didn't find anything that affected engine RPM. I ran two tanks of Techron and a tank of Seafoam Injector Cleaner and it made no difference so I replaced the Cylinder 6 fuel injector and that also made no change. I didn't check fuel pressures but it didn't occur to me that fuel pressure would be an issue here. I'd have to investigate that avenue next.

 

[GTyankee]

I am curious

Is there a fairly simple way to test the
Crank & Cam Sensors ??

 

[Fast69Mopar]

I am curious

Is there a fairly simple way to test the
Crank & Cam Sensors ??

My simple way of testing camshaft and crankshaft position sensors is by back-probing the signal return wire with my DVOM connected and watching the voltage change while cranking. It's a 3-wire connector with a 5.0V signal, Ground and Return.

Key On Engine Off you will have 5.0V on one wire, ground on another and the return wire.

Connect the black lead of your DVOM to a solid ground. Use a back-probing tool or a small paperclip to push the paperclip inside the rubber seal on the back side of the connector and connect the red lead to the return wire

If you have a voltage change while cranking then the sensor is working.

 

[ABuchler]

It appears I've fixed my issue. Not sure what exactly was wrong, but I decided to remount the intake manifold and re-assemble the coils and plug wires and now it doesn't misfire anymore. It's possible there could've been a vacuum leak that I didn't identify or that a coil didn't seat properly, but regardless, it's fixed now and I've tested it at all speeds and loads and it no longer misfires. As a reference for anyone else facing this issue or taking off and installing the manifold in general, be mindful of the rear intake runner gaskets (Cyl 7/8), as they seem to get twisted sometimes when installing the manifold (this could of possibly been the problem, but not sure). Appreciate all the advice and glad to get it working again. Really glad that it wasn't a valve spring lol.

 

[azmillgod]

Get a new throttle body. You probably bent the plate. I did the same thing while cleaning mine, way back, a couple years after i bought the truck. I paid around $180 for a new one. They are probably more than that now. :I think youve gone down a rabbit hole. First, think about what you did just before it started running rough. Plugs, EGR valve and throttle body. you said it was running fine before that point. Warped exhaust manifold? Did it coincidentally warp at the same exact time you changed the plugs.? Did you remove the throttle body? I was surprised how easy it was to bend, i didn't think i bent mine, but a new one fixed the issue that i had inadvertently created.

Good luck