2013 frame repair

[CaptOchs]

Had to take my Ram in to address some frame rot issues. NY salt!

Welder did say he rarely sees Rams. Most of the frame issues he has repaired are Ford and Chevys. He says the bodies rot, but typically the frames are solid.

This proves the Ziebart protection is pretty useless. Perhaps it trapped water causing the rust. Both issues are right between the gap by the cab and bed.

 

[Ken226]

That sucks. They must use a ****load of road salt over there.


My 2013 doesn't have a spec of rust, and i'm in a coastal area.

 

[tron67j]

My family has had moderate success with Ziebart, but the only way to combat that salt up there is constantly washing the underside with blasts of water. Unless you have a garage with a drain, pretty hard to do that. I was in areas north and south plus west of Syracuse. I never coated any of my trucks or cars, but was in a car wash whenever possible. Held up fairly well. It sucks. Good luck.

 

[62Blazer]

Not a fan of the Ziebart style coatings. If the coating gets any cracks or chips in it that lets water in and traps it between the coating and metal. I've always used the oil based coatings like Woolwax, Fluidfilm, etc.... A buddy has a truck he bought brand new and had it undercoated by Ziebart, and takes it in every year for touchups (part of a lifetime guarantee package) and it is starting to show rust bubbles in places on the body. And if you start digging around on the frame you can find places where the coating is bubbled away from the frame. If you dig through it there is rust underneath.

 

[White six four]

I was going to ask what ziebart protection is but the previous fellas answered it for me. I take it they don't spray it inside the holes of the frame.? And its just a one time application? Even if they did thats where most of the salt and other crap gets into and stays. Kind of like washing the salt of the exterior of your rig but not going underneath and a least rinsing out the drain holes in the rockers. Rust starts from the inside unless you have bare metal on the exterior.

 

[Burla]

They have a new wax one, I guess they know their old coating doesn't do what they wanted, so I guess they are riding coat tails of wool wax. I think the issue is how long these last, nothing is going to last long without risk, mind you painted steel wont last, so how can anything last in that environment. It is process not product, find a yearly process and do it first snow - fluid film or wool wax.

Corey has a great dyi process FF.

 

[Jeepwalker]

Trucks driven in salty winter areas will eventually rot along the entire bottom. That's what I've seen over my lifetime. It's just a matter of time. Unless they're protected with some sort of oil product inside.

On a Jeep I have, I put a piece of gorilla tape over every hole in the frame ...except a few drains, and caulked every seam (they always start rusting on the seams). That was about 15 years ago...and it still looks very good under there. The one thing I didn't do that I probably should have done was take an oil gun and squirt oil in various locations. If you do it a few times over the yrs, it eventually migrates and spreads around.

It would be a real good idea to do that on a new truck frame ....squirt oil through the frame holes.

Your mechanic is probably right: A good friend of mine bought a 2015 Chevy truck, the bottom of the frame was completely gone underneath the cab to the back where it kicks up to the axle. He got a great deal on it ...about a grand. The seller sold it for 'parts'. There was no way a mechanic could put it on a hoist. Basically the rest of the truck was in otherwise wonderful condition. He works at a weld shop and has access to a huge bending brake ..and shear. He cut the rusty bottom of, bent up pieces and redid the frame bottom and got a great DD out of it. The tragedy of it was how rotted away in less than 10 yrs.

 

[Wild one]

Take a set of ramps with you over to your local coin-op carwash,drive truck up on them,and wash the inside of the frame out at least a couple times a year,and the frames will live in a salt invested enviroment.

 

[CaptOchs]

I have a car wash plan. In summer I use it for my Charger. I switch it over to the truck in the fall when the Charger gets put away. It gets frequent washes and the Ziebart is reapplied yearly. I don't know why it rusted out so badly. So now I'm trying to decide if I should reapply Ziebart in the fall or let it go.

 

[White six four]

An automatic car wash does not "rinse" out the holes in the frame. Or the holes in the rockers. You'll have to do it manually if you want to do it right.

If ziebart is an undercoating there's no point in undercoating over rust. Find a place that sprays fluid film or the like. Do it yourself or pay to have a guy do it once or twice a year.

I fluid film my truck twice a year and only wash it once or twice all winter long. It gets hand washed on the rare occasional day it gets above freezing. There's been a winter or three it hasn't been washed at all. For being a 16 and being a Wisconsin truck the underside is very clean.

 

[Dusty]

They have a new wax one, I guess they know their old coating doesn't do what they wanted, so I guess they are riding coat tails of wool wax. I think the issue is how long these last, nothing is going to last long without risk, mind you painted steel wont last, so how can anything last in that environment. It is process not product, find a yearly process and do it first snow - fluid film or wool wax.

Corey has a great dyi process FF.

My son had his 2500 Rebel undercoated at Ziebart. They now use a black version of Woolwax.

What is applied to underbodies is called undercoating, not rustproofing to differentiate between the purpose. And, yes, Ziebart will not rustproof the inside of a frame. Unfortunately, most truck and car frames rust from the inside.

For those interested, 3M makes two products used by body shops to treat new or repaired panels: 3M Rust Fighter (08892) and 3M Cavity Wax Plus (08852). Judging from the odor and look of the product, they smell and appear almost the same. They are both thixotropic and provide a thick, non-porous barrier that resists long term hardening. I used some on my daughters eight year-old Hyundai and it's still tacky.

3M makes a installation kit with various length nozzle tubes for hard to reach places.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 137788 miles.

 

[Burla]

My son had his 2500 Rebel undercoated at Ziebart. They now use a black version of Woolwax.

What is applied to underbodies is called undercoating, not rustproofing to differentiate between the purpose. And, yes, Ziebart will not rustproof the inside of a frame. Unfortunately, most truck and car frames rust from the inside.

For those interested, 3M makes two products used by body shops to treat new or repaired panels: 3M Rust Fighter (08892) and 3M Cavity Wax Plus (08852). Judging from the odor and look of the product, they smell and appear almost the same. They are both thixotropic and provide a thick, non-porous barrier that resists long term hardening. I used some on my daughters eight year-old Hyundai and it's still tacky.

3M makes a installation kit with various length nozzle tubes for hard to reach places.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 137788 miles.

Another interesting move is to find the best" product for guys like me who don't see salt but just general rainy seasons. My guess in salt states the best way to deal with this whatever product you use just do it every year and wash off at the end of winter take off salt. But some of the lesser known products might be better for trucks that just see rainy seasons and no snow. I think this product has a lot of promise, it's a wax type deal likely with some good solvent that allows it to dry up. Are either of those 3m products dry up like that? I wouldn't mind not having to join Amsoil just for one product. For this area something like this might last many years 5 or better.

.

 

[Dusty]

They have a new wax one, I guess they know their old coating doesn't do what they wanted, so I guess they are riding coat tails of wool wax. I think the issue is how long these last, nothing is going to last long without risk, mind you painted steel wont last, so how can anything last in that environment. It is process not product, find a yearly process and do it first snow - fluid film or wool wax.

Corey has a great dyi process FF.

In the recent Ziebart literature they market their undercoating as a sound deadening process.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 137788 miles.

Another interesting move is to find the best" product for guys like me who don't see salt but just general rainy seasons. My guess in salt states the best way to deal with this whatever product you use just do it every year and wash off at the end of winter take off salt. But some of the lesser known products might be better for trucks that just see rainy seasons and no snow. I think this product has a lot of promise, it's a wax type deal likely with some good solvent that allows it to dry up. Are either of those 3m products dry up like that? I wouldn't mind not having to join Amsoil just for one product. For this area something like this might last many years 5 or better.

.

Neither of the 3M products I've used completely dry up. If you press your finger on a previously applied area (3-4 years, at least) it will move like pressing modeling clay. I believe the Rust Fighter version has an increased flowing agent.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 137788 miles.

 

[Burla]

In the recent Ziebart literature they market their undercoating as a sound deadening process.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 137788 miles.

Neither of the 3M products I've used completely dry up. If you press your finger on a previously applied area (3-4 years, at least) it will move like pressing modeling clay. I believe the Rust Fighter version has an increased flowing agent.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 137788 miles.

love it, thanks dusty

 

[20092500HEMI]

Had to take my Ram in to address some frame rot issues. NY salt!

Welder did say he rarely sees Rams. Most of the frame issues he has repaired are Ford and Chevys. He says the bodies rot, but typically the frames are solid.

This proves the Ziebart protection is pretty useless. Perhaps it trapped water causing the rust. Both issues are right between the gap by the cab and bed.

View attachment 572382View attachment 572380View attachment 572381View attachment 572379

Short version, on 3rd gen boxed frame they have no weep holes at the bottom of the frame. This might even cover the new generations. Add some drain holes at the bottom of the frame so the water,mud and salt can drain out. Easy test, stick your finger into a factory frame hole. If you feel a pile of rust, then you most likey will be losing the bottom 2 inches of the frame over time. Drill, drain holes, clean out the rust. You might at least slow the frame rot down.

 

[Bigskyroadglide]

This is the best stuff I've found, it's crazy expensive but works really well on frames.

Twice a year seems to make me happy. I'm usually covered with the stuff when finished. I'm probably overkillng cleaning but I don't have rust.

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[Gero]

I love these oil spray threads. Up here in the north, bare minimum that is needed is annual thin oil base rust proofing. Id take it 2 steps further and try and wash once every 2 weeks as well as remove all the plastic liners under each wheel and clean off the inner fenders and box. Try and do it every 2 years and hit it with an oil-based rust protection like krown or fluidfilm.

I found the dirt caked along the wheel well prevents rust proofing products from penetrating as well as the dirt will trap moisture and salt. I learned the hard way. Had it professionally repaired.

 

[Gemeni06]

I live in the Northern Adirondacks which is a high salt environment. Purchased a 2013 RAM Tradesman new and it's seen this environment since then. No rust thru on the frame. Just surface rust. I have an outside faucet on my house and rinse off the salt on all our vehicles when the temperature rises above freezing. Wife's 2009 XTerra has seen this same environment. More surface rust on the underbody than the RAM but no rust thru on the frame. I personally would never use any undercoating on any vehicle. From my experience, it has been unnecessary. As they say in the military, it it works don't XXXX with it.

 

[Gemeni06]

Forgot to add that I used Ziebart in the past on two older vehicles. Not to oversimplify things but the general principle back then was that it worked well until the coating became brittle and began to trap moisture, dirt and salt. Don't know the state of Ziebart today so can't comment on it.

 

[CaptOchs]

Forgot to add that I used Ziebart in the past on two older vehicles. Not to oversimplify things but the general principle back then was that it worked well until the coating became brittle and began to trap moisture, dirt and salt. Don't know the state of Ziebart today so can't comment on it.

That's what it's doing on the RAM. You crawl under there and you can see water dripping from a spot. The Ziebart is detached from the frame. If you pull away at it, you get more water out. I have a car wash plan. The car wash is about 1/4 mile away. Usually, I hit them up when on the way home. I also WFH. Sometimes the truck sits for weeks. It only has 89k on it for a 2013. It had 65k on it when I bought it over 5 years ago. lol.

I have a Charger that also has Ziebart. Since the frame is unibody it looks pretty good underneath for a 2010. The Ziebart is doing its job. I don't know what I'm going to do with the truck. Going to talk to them.