Blackstone - used oil analysis

[knightjp]

Another from my Ram 1500 w/ 5.7. I forgot to do one last oil change - so the last comparables are from roughly a year ago.

What was the combo? Just straight PUP 5w30 or did you put any additive like Lubegaard?

 

[emjohn4]

What was the combo? Just straight PUP 5w30 or did you put any additive like Lubegaard?

I've been running M1 0w20 and M1 filters for the first 75k miles; switched to castrol 5w30 + MOS2 with SRT filters for about the next 25k miles, and running PUP 5w30 + MOS2 with Royal Pruple filters for about the last 30k miles.

Somewhere in this thread about 3 (?) years ago...Burla compared the numbers and it did show the wear went down betwen the Castrol and PUP.

 

[knightjp]

Liquimoly MOS2?
Would be nice to see those numbers. Which Castrol did you run? GTX/ Magnatec or Edge? I'm guessing that PUP did better than Castrol, otherwise you would be running that.

 

[emjohn4]

Liquimoly MOS2?
Would be nice to see those numbers. Which Castrol did you run? GTX/ Magnatec or Edge? I'm guessing that PUP did better than Castrol, otherwise you would be running that.

There are a few posts after this one (linked below) that have the analysis. It was the Castrol Edge; and the PUP is doing better than the Castrol (but the wear was fine with Castrol as well). FWIW - It was at 110k miles I switched to PUP from Castrol; I think I implied it was 100k earlier. My bad!

Blackstone - used oil analysis

EDIT- double roast me because I'm an idiot and didn't attach the pdf the first time Roast me: The Mobil HM was what I had on hand last time, this time I have 7qt of Mobil EP and another Fram XG2. Currently sitting at 5k on this change, will be changing it in the next couple days. Moving...

www.ramforum.com

 

[Burla]

Another from my Ram 1500 w/ 5.7. I forgot to do one last oil change - so the last comparables are from roughly a year ago.

Still looks excellent, did the truck work harder some towing or more city driving? The numbers are still great nothing to worry about. I would try biotech over mos2 and it is oil soluble moly and generally more desirable. Everything seams good though.

 

[Sasquatchtdg]

Heavy sigh...

 

[Hootbro]

Heavy sigh...
View attachment 537935

So even the Redline Jesus Juice of motor oils could not save it. Sad to see.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Unsure about this - OCI is double what many members recommend.

 

[ramffml]

I keep on remembering Truck Central who is almost at 250k miles with 2000 idle hours running PUP 5w-20 and changing when the oil indicator tells him too, lots of heavy towing thrown in as well. No issues to date. Have to admit reports like the one above confirm my belief that you either get a bad lifter from the factory or you don't and high quality oils can only mitigate that so much.

It's not going to change my belief that we absolutely should still be running oils like HPL/Redline/Mobil 1 0w-40.

@Sasquatchtdg how long were you running Redline 5w-30? Looks like your iron started climbing right after 100k miles? Given the consistency in the other ingredients it looks like you were running this since at least 84k miles?

 

[ramffml]

Isn't the iron in that report high for all those UOA samples from Sasquatchdg? I've never been higher than 27 ppm and my latest was 12 ppm, but less mileage too. Just wondering if the 33 ppm is typical of a hemi at that mileage, blackstone is saying an avg of 21 is typical.

 

[Burla]

Isn't the iron in that report high for all those UOA samples from Sasquatchdg? I've never been higher than 27 ppm and my latest was 12 ppm, but less mileage too. Just wondering if the 33 ppm is typical of a hemi at that mileage, blackstone is saying an avg of 21 is typical.

Agreed. Seams to be headed in the wrong direction, if this isnt a hemi tick engine I might consider a change? Unusual for sure. Did truck work harder this time? Towing maybe?

It is very impressive to see that oil over many years, formula looks very predictable.

 

[HEMIMANN]

I keep on remembering Truck Central who is almost at 250k miles with 2000 idle hours running PUP 5w-20 and changing when the oil indicator tells him too, lots of heavy towing thrown in as well. No issues to date. Have to admit reports like the one above confirm my belief that you either get a bad lifter from the factory or you don't and high quality oils can only mitigate that so much.

It's not going to change my belief that we absolutely should still be running oils like HPL/Redline/Mobil 1 0w-40.

@Sasquatchtdg how long were you running Redline 5w-30? Looks like your iron started climbing right after 100k miles? Given the consistency in the other ingredients it looks like you were running this since at least 84k miles?

Yep - we don't know for sure as Ram won't say anything.

But member sharing has been crucial in reducing issues, so I appreciate this place more than any other.

I should have noted above the Moly (MoDTC) remained very strong in the UOA (i.e. - not depleted), so the antiwear protection of the oil was not compromised.

More problematic is the oil flow itself @ 10,000 OCI with Hemi engines and it's limited oiling. Changing oil that late risks contaminants and deposits slowing oil flow to critical components that are poorly oiled in the 1st place. Esp. thru small orifices such as the pilot solenoid orifices to VVT and MDS. This is why I harp on 5,000 OCI's in this engine no matter what oil is used.

 

[ramffml]

Here is a direct comparison of iron in Tyler's truck vs mine. Guess the iron he saw the first few times is normal after all, hard to gauge that when the data isn't normalized so I did that for his truck and mine and calculated iron levels per 1000 miles.

Mine is higher at times even with the same oil (RL 5w-30) but with a much younger engine so that is expected? Mine appears to be trending down now with age.

I'm curious @Sasquatchtdg if you hear any ticking? Anything else you can share like if you tow, idle, or use MDS etc?

 

[Burla]

Here is a direct comparison of iron in Tyler's truck vs mine. Guess the iron he saw the first few times is normal after all, hard to gauge that when the data isn't normalized so I did that for his truck and mine and calculated iron levels per 1000 miles.

Mine is higher at times even with the same oil (RL 5w-30) but with a much younger engine so that is expected? Mine appears to be trending down now with age.

I'm curious @Sasquatchtdg if you hear any ticking? Anything else you can share like if you tow, idle, or use MDS etc?

View attachment 537953

Very helpful to see it like this thanks. Pretty interesting your first 5w30 redline run? Young engine but still good low wear.

If I were sasquach I might be looking at super class 0w40 oils like you did m1 perhaps with some lubeguard. Before I did I might be inclined to do a cheap oil flush, any cheap oil on walmart shelf, even use the old filter and just toss it after 50 miles and come with new filter and 0w40 near 12 cSt. Just to verify, wear is not only increasing but it is seriously increasing, hopefully something simple but I doubt any oil could stop what is coming. Something started at about 123k, usual suspect is dropping a valve or valve spring but not sure that would show up as iron? I know it is crazy to talk about 1ppm change, but chromium did tick up, something to look at next time, chromium is in a lot of those springs and rings, see metals here. pdf Boroscope that combustion chamber see if any carbon near rings??

If it is a spring or a ring, those thin metals just have a life and nothing you can really do. Interesting is at what point do you crack it open? At least get eyes on valve springs? Save the engine perhaps.

I changed my mind, sometimes you can do something, if it is piston rings often you can rehad those if you get the carbon off them, just maybe?

 

[HEMIMANN]

Piston rings show high chrome first.

 

[Burla]

Piston rings show high chrome first.

Carbon can be diamond like and if rings are caked the carbon itself can cause iron scuffing. Might want to sea foam engine run some pea? But I would be boroscoping that chamber and see what the condition is.

 

[mdc1990zr1]

So even the Redline Jesus Juice of motor oils could not save it. Sad to see.

10K mile OCI says it all. A few of those long OCI's and the wear will become evident somewhere. Redline won't put metal back onto worn engine parts.

 

[Travis8352]

PUP is a good oil. But I haven't seen any 0W-40 yet that won't shear down appreciably in 5,000 miles. It's just too wide a viscosity range.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/2020-jeep-grand-cherokee-srt-6-4l-hpl-super-car-0w-40-9-795km.369745/

HPL supercar 0w40 holds viscosity well

 

[knightjp]

I can easily recommend M1 0W40. It worked great and warm idle, the engine was so quiet. Dare I say it, I think it sounded smoother than with Redline.
I just didn't like one thing about it - the way the engine lifters ticked for 2 - 3 seconds at the initial start, just after an oil change.
By comparison, Liquimoly Molygen 5W30 with the Hydraulic Lifter Fluid additive sounded just the same and didn't have that tick.
I wish I could get PUP 0w40 here.
All we get is Shell Helix Ultra 0w40. Not sure if its exactly the same thing. Some say it is and some say it is different formula.

 

[Sasquatchtdg]

Nothing out of the ordinary for the use of my truck. Mostly 22miles one way back and forth to work. Has been through road trips to the mountains of Tennessee and North Carolina, the traffic of Orlando, up to Jamestown, Virginia. My idle to driving hour ratio (if correct) isn't extreme.

I got the truck early 2019 with 54k miles on it. Since then it has been using Redline oil and Royal Purple oil filters until most recently I used Wix Gold because it was easier to find. This change I have the SRT filter.

Never had to add any oil between changes. Oil pressure ranges from 40s to 60s depending on weather. Most of the time its in the 50s.
Only used 89 or higher octane gas.

I currently have the lower end "Hemi tick", the broken manifold bolts, that goes away after warm up.

The top end has had a light sewing machine sound coming from the passenger's side. This never changed with redline.

My concern now is whether I cut my losses and sell the truck and move on. Or invest $5k into it getting the top end redone, exhaust manifolds fixed, etc.

The truck is paid off so... I lean towards the cam it up and keep rolling as long as the bottom end is fine.