Engine prestart oilers

[Area 51]

I think we'd all agree that a lot of engine wear happens upon startup, especially when your vehicle has sat for a while.
Why isn't it common for vehicles to have a system that pre-pressurizes oil delivery, so critical surfaces don't have to wait for lube? I've seen the pressurized tanks, such as Summit Racing has, but I never see them installed on road vehicles other than some commercial vehicles. It seems so advantageous, to me, that I wonder why everyone isn't installing these on their trucks. They aren't very expensive and diesel engines are very expensive. What am I missing? If I ever have an engine built, I think pre-oiling before every start would be a no-brainer.

I was thinking an electric pump, taking oil from the pan, with a toggle switch in the cab so I can control it while watching the oil pressure gauge would be best (as long as it doesn't suck any air and froth up the oil).

Yes, I did a search first.

 

[BenchTest]

I'm 1000% in agreement. I've said this for years. Why isn't this at least an available factory option for vehicles? Billions of hours of documentation has been put together documenting startup wear and what has been done to address it? Simple pressurized pump that fires up with key on (like the fuel pump) seems like an easy fix.

 

[KansasArt]

90% of the car/truck buying market wouldn’t have a clue as to what you’re describing. If it was offered as an option they would opt for leather seats vs a pre lube system. Plus I don’t think the auto industry would want to invest millions into the R&D for something that would extend the life of the engine, thereby possibly reducing the amount of future sales because the engine lasts longer. But I like your idea!

 

[Daw14]

I think we'd all agree that a lot of engine wear happens upon startup, especially when your vehicle has sat for a while.
Why isn't it common for vehicles to have a system that pre-pressurizes oil delivery, so critical surfaces don't have to wait for lube? I've seen the pressurized tanks, such as Summit Racing has, but I never see them installed on road vehicles other than some commercial vehicles. It seems so advantageous, to me, that I wonder why everyone isn't installing these on their trucks. They aren't very expensive and diesel engines are very expensive. What am I missing? If I ever have an engine built, I think pre-oiling before every start would be a no-brainer.

I was thinking an electric pump, taking oil from the pan, with a toggle switch in the cab so I can control it while watching the oil pressure gauge would be best (as long as it doesn't suck any air and froth up the oil).

Yes, I did a search first.

You can hold the fuel pedal to the floor , this activates clear flood mode.
Basically will not start but cranks , allowing oil pressure to build before it starts.
This may not work as well as a pressurized prelube system , but it is already there and paid for .

 

[RamDiver]

You can hold the fuel pedal to the floor , this activates clear flood mode.
Basically will not start but cranks , allowing oil pressure to build before it starts.
This play not work as well as a pressurized prelube system , but it is already there and paid for .

I use this method often when my truck has been sitting for days, or it is very cold.

I let off the accelerator after 2 or 3 seconds, and the truck starts instantly without any extra rattle noises.

.

 

[diymirage]

What if we build it into the shut off mode, kinda like a turbo timer ?

The engine shuts off and a return valve closes "locking" the oil in the top part of the engine

Then next time you hit the starter, the valve opens and oil flows down

Or perhaps make it so it pressurizes the filter ?

I don't know this is above my pay grade

 

[BenchTest]

You can hold the fuel pedal to the floor , this activates clear flood mode.
Basically will not start but cranks , allowing oil pressure to build before it starts.
This may not work as well as a pressurized prelube system , but it is already there and paid for .

When does that kill the starter? I'd say it's good for a truck that has sat for an extended period, but wouldn't use it as a pre-start ritual every time.

 

[BenchTest]

What if we build it into the shut off mode, kinda like a turbo timer ?

The engine shuts off and a return valve closes "locking" the oil in the top part of the engine

Then next time you hit the starter, the valve opens and oil flows down

Or perhaps make it so it pressurizes the filter ?

I don't know this is above my pay grade

There is a similar device for the 3.6L owners. A contraption that is added on to the oil filter housing (as they 3.6 uses an inverted filer cartridge setup). This keeps oil from draining back to the pan. I don't buy into it's usefulness but some like it. Baxter Performance unit.

 

[diymirage]

There is a similar device for the 3.6L owners. A contraption that is added on to the oil filter housing (as they 3.6 uses an inverted filer cartridge setup). This keeps oil from draining back to the pan. I don't buy into it's usefulness but some like it. Baxter Performance unit.

I remember those, the whole idea is to basically get the same operation as the old canister filter with the anti drain back valve , right ?

 

[BenchTest]

I remember those, the whole idea is to basically get the same operation as the old canister filter with the anti drain back valve , right ?

Yeah, more or less. You're retaining oil into a spin on filter and "check valve" instead of having the factory element style (which is inverted above the engine valley, between the heads) drain all the oil out after the engine shuts off.

 

[Gr8bawana]

I think we can all agree that pre start-up oiling would be advantageous. But how much difference would there be over the life of the engine? Say 500k miles or more.
Would it even be a measurable amount?
These engines already have a very long lifespan as they are.
I think you're looking for a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

 

[diymirage]

I think you're looking for a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

Which engine are we talking about here?

There are plenty of hemis that didnt make it into the 6 digits

 

[Ritchie_Rich]

But, how would “pre oiling” have changed that?

 

[BenchTest]

I think we can all agree that pre start-up oiling would be advantageous. But how much difference would there be over the life of the engine? Say 500k miles or more.
Would it even be a measurable amount?
These engines already have a very long lifespan as they are.
I think you're looking for a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

Ever heard a Pentastar fire up after it's been sitting for more than a couple of hours? RATTLE RATTLE RATTLE for 2-5 seconds. That problem exists.

 

[Ritchie_Rich]

Ever heard a Pentastar fire up after it's been sitting for more than a couple of hours? RATTLE RATTLE RATTLE for 2-5 seconds. That problem exists.

More like a second or less. And, it takes days, not a couple of hours.
We own one. 14 years, 150k miles and still going strong.

 

[DILLIGAF]

Ever heard a Pentastar fire up after it's been sitting for more than a couple of hours? RATTLE RATTLE RATTLE for 2-5 seconds. That problem exists.

Stop using garbage oil , Redline 5w30 doesn't do that in my pentcrap

 

[BenchTest]

More like a second or less. And, it takes days, not a couple of hours.
We own one. 14 years, 150k miles and still going strong.

Ok. Guess the cross sample of about 70) 3.6 Pentastar engines that I had in my fleet wasn't a big enough sample.

It doesn't take long for the oil to run back to the pan. We usually ran them to the 200-225K mark before rotating them out of the fleet. I don't know what the long-term outcome is of the startup rattle.

@DILLIGAF - You can run your Gucci oils in your vehicle. Oil drained back to the pan is oil drained back to the pan. Doesn't make a $hit what brand it is if it's not on the top end to hydraulicly fill the void between metal spaces, rattling is going to occur. Does the Gucci oil do a better job of protecting metals at startup? Sure. That's what you're paying for. A void is a void, hence the rattle. If the system wasn't setup in a fashion where all the oil runs back to the pan at shutdown, there wouldn't be a startup rattle. @Ritchie_Rich there are plenty of examples of this online.

 

[DILLIGAF]

Yeah I know how it works my guy and also the reason I'm using R.L 5w30 and I will also be upgrading to the Baxter and aluminum oil cooler on my JK once my POS plastic ones sh!ts the bed.

But saying that it doesn't matter what oil you use in these POS pentcrap shows your lack of reading comprehension on the UOAs

 

[Ritchie_Rich]

It doesn't take long for the oil to run back to the pan. We usually ran them to the 200-225K mark before rotating them out of the fleet. I don't know what the long-term outcome is of the startup rattle.

So, you’re saying it’s detrimental to the engine, but yet you run those engines 200k-225k miles with no idea how much further they could go?

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense to me. LOL

In the 70’s, small block Chevys and Fords did the same thing. Never had a problem with them either.

 

[BenchTest]

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