Gearing opinions

[rjames78]

So I’ve just recently learned that I can stuff 37” tires under my leveled ram1500.

However I am now reluctant to do so because I am also learning
Of the lack of gearing options for the front end on the 12 and up models.

I have read up on the earlier diff swap to the newer models and have a couple of questions:

1 I am concerned about the durability of the earlier diff style compared to the newer and wonder if the trade off is worth it for deeper gears? Especially since there is no selectable locker option that I can find..

2 If the swap isn’t worth it from a durability stand point and I decide to stick with 35” does a swap to a 392 from my 355 make sense?

I’m hoping some with real world experience involving these scenarios will chime in on this.

I am setting this up as an expedition/overland truck so durability is a very big concern for me.



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[rjames78]

While I’m at it may as well ask about rear locker options and again real world experience please.


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[kurek]

I am setting this up as an expedition/overland truck

Are you talking about expedition/overland like parking at the edge of a parking lot near some trees and taking pictures while your medium sized dog sits in the drivers' seat and your photogenic girlfriend/wife does yoga on the roof of the vehicle at sunrise?

Or do you mean actual travel deep into the bush without the instagrams?

If it's the first one just do 37's on what you have now and screw gearing, that cuts into glare factory LED bar and vinyl wrap graphics money.

If it's the second one big tires aren't of much help and can be a bigger hindrance. Example I was pulling a trailer through Canada a few years ago and it had tires in a size not normally imported into Canada. Didn't think that one through far enough. Are there going to be 37's in stock in Las Delicias or Fairbanks? What's going to happen to your fuel range on big tires? How much extra fuel are you willing to carry and how are you going to make that safe and convenient? Are you more likely to get unrecoverably stuck because your tires are too small or because you snapped a CV axle trying to turn a tire bigger than the truck was engineered for?

After considering all the options I ended up putting 33" tires on my lifted Ram (285/70R17) and the purchase price wasn't a factor. Not saying you have to follow my lead on that - I'm just encouraging you to think through completely what you're planning to actually use the vehicle for and what changes in tire size actually do, other than cosmetics.

 

[kurek]

While I’m at it may as well ask about rear locker options and again real world experience please.

Post-2013 Rams have low speed traction control and that in combination with the factory anti-spin diff has provided effective traction for every situation I've ever had my Ram in. It might run into its limits on feature trails (think Dusy-Ershim) but there's really no point in worrying about that because Rams are simply too big to fit through trails like that. If you're building a Ram for trails like that you're really building a tube buggy that happens to have a Ram cab suspended somewhere in the middle of it.

There are no aftermarket locking diffs available for 4th gen Rams and I don't know if the 5th gen e-locker can be adapted. Not worth it in my opinion considering how well the BLDS and anti-spin work together. Better to spend that money on gas actually going out and exploring.

 

[rjames78]

Are you talking about expedition/overland like parking at the edge of a parking lot near some trees and taking pictures while your medium sized dog sits in the drivers' seat and your photogenic girlfriend/wife does yoga on the roof of the vehicle at sunrise?

Or do you mean actual travel deep into the bush without the instagrams?

If it's the first one just do 37's on what you have now and screw gearing, that cuts into glare factory LED bar and vinyl wrap graphics money.

If it's the second one big tires aren't of much help and can be a bigger hindrance. Example I was pulling a trailer through Canada a few years ago and it had tires in a size not normally imported into Canada. Didn't think that one through far enough. Are there going to be 37's in stock in Las Delicias or Fairbanks? What's going to happen to your fuel range on big tires? How much extra fuel are you willing to carry and how are you going to make that safe and convenient? Are you more likely to get unrecoverably stuck because your tires are too small or because you snapped a CV axle trying to turn a tire bigger than the truck was engineered for?

After considering all the options I ended up putting 33" tires on my lifted Ram (285/70R17) and the purchase price wasn't a factor. Not saying you have to follow my lead on that - I'm just encouraging you to think through completely what you're planning to actually use the vehicle for and what changes in tire size actually do, other than cosmetics.

I mean disappear for a week -ten days at a time using my converted bus as a base camp. However that’s a valid point nowadays lol.

And more complete linex coverage as opposed to wrap and kc round leds as opposed to light bar and only one row ha


But u do make some good points, acquiring tires isn’t a priority As plans will be to carry two spares.

I have plans for a 30 gal reserve tank with another 10 gallons in spare cans.

As to snapping cvs that is why I’m asking after the overall durability issues between the two diffs.
I can have custom rcv cvs built if I become concerned about them being the weak link.

And I’m hoping my travels take me where internet isn’t an option.
I only know how to look at Instagram not sure how to use it and am not particularly interested in doing so.

All I described above is my style but I don’t begrudge others tastes.
I have Seen many good looking wraps and I love turning night into day but this project is more about function than form to me.


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[rjames78]

Post-2013 Rams have low speed traction control and that in combination with the factory anti-spin diff has provided effective traction for every situation I've ever had my Ram in. It might run into its limits on feature trails (think Dusy-Ershim) but there's really no point in worrying about that because Rams are simply too big to fit through trails like that. If you're building a Ram for trails like that you're really building a tube buggy that happens to have a Ram cab suspended somewhere in the middle of it.

There are no aftermarket locking diffs available for 4th gen Rams and I don't know if the 5th gen e-locker can be adapted. Not worth it in my opinion considering how well the BLDS and anti-spin work together. Better to spend that money on gas actually going out and exploring.

Thanks for your input I appreciate it!


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[rjames78]

And definitely not looking g to build a hardcore crawler just looking for a nice balanced rig but would love lockers for sure.


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[Puba08]

Your looking to do this on a Ram??????? I can understand a Tacoma but a Ram is too big.


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[rjames78]

Are you talking about expedition/overland like parking at the edge of a parking lot near some trees and taking pictures while your medium sized dog sits in the drivers' seat and your photogenic girlfriend/wife does yoga on the roof of the vehicle at sunrise?

Or do you mean actual travel deep into the bush without the instagrams?

If it's the first one just do 37's on what you have now and screw gearing, that cuts into glare factory LED bar and vinyl wrap graphics money.

If it's the second one big tires aren't of much help and can be a bigger hindrance. Example I was pulling a trailer through Canada a few years ago and it had tires in a size not normally imported into Canada. Didn't think that one through far enough. Are there going to be 37's in stock in Las Delicias or Fairbanks? What's going to happen to your fuel range on big tires? How much extra fuel are you willing to carry and how are you going to make that safe and convenient? Are you more likely to get unrecoverably stuck because your tires are too small or because you snapped a CV axle trying to turn a tire bigger than the truck was engineered for?

After considering all the options I ended up putting 33" tires on my lifted Ram (285/70R17) and the purchase price wasn't a factor. Not saying you have to follow my lead on that - I'm just encouraging you to think through completely what you're planning to actually use the vehicle for and what changes in tire size actually do, other than cosmetics.

Oh and no yoga girlfriend, women prefer would most likely dent the roof, however I do have a medium sized dog.


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[rjames78]

Medium size dog in question.


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[kurek]

Ram is too big.

The marketing and photography angle of "Overland!" fetishizes Class 6 trucks (Earthroamer XV, LMTV conversions) but that sort of highlights why I am always careful to encourage people to think about what they actually want to accomplish and build based on need not image. Unless image is the need.

The photography/instagram angle is valid. It sells lots of video and camera equipment, employs lots of fit young women and handsome men with cool sounding accents, and houses lots of medium sized dogs. Behind the scenes quite a few prominent social media Overlanders function a bit like boy bands with investors and talent working together to cultivate an advertising campaign that's a lot more targeted and has a lot more reach than conventional advertising did. In that sense it's real - it's real business. That's OK.

The considerations one has to make when building are if they want to look great in pictures for others or make it happen in the real world for themselves and to not confuse the two because often they have incompatible paths.

On the topic of what's "too big" I'll speak of my own experience - versatility is king and that versatility includes some not-instagrammy realities like whether your vehicle will fit inside a parking garage because cities are travel destinations too. Or how much of a security camera's view of your truck is blocked by the truck itself when you park in a sketchy place on your way to your destination. How many commas are going to be in your fuel budget. How smooth and comfortable your highway ride will be because how you feel after 14 hours rolling plays heavily into your performance in driving and decision making at whatever you left the house to do. How available replacement parts (odd sized tires... like mentioned above) are and how often you might break them. What kind of equipment you have to get unstuck and how likely you will be to be able to use it. Whether you or others in your party are strong enough to perform self-recovery (you ever send a couch potato up a hill with a spool of winch cable in tow?).. will you fit on the ferry? Will you fit on the end of the ferry that's leaving now, or do you have to wait 4 hours for the next one?

The list is absolutely endless and the more realistic you are when analyzing it the less time and money you'll spend working around the problems you'll encounter.

My opinion and experience tells me something like a stock Power Wagon is at the upper limits of how big a vehicle can really be without becoming a pretty significant burden in a lot of North America. A 1500 with a little bit of lift is still going to fit in most parking garages and generally interface with the infrastructure of the world without much difficulty.

There are trails it's too bulky to fit through, a fullsize is the wrong vehicle for those kind of trails. Not really any getting around that.

Sorry if that came across lecture-like, it's all conversation and I don't have an emotional investment in what everyone else does with their own vehicles.

 

[kurek]

Medium size dog in question.


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That's a pretty relaxed looking dude, maybe you should start an instagram?

 

[Puba08]

I learned long ago, if your looking to play on rocks, then buy a Jeep, if your looking to hit the trails, then buy a Toyota, if you looking to spend money then buy a Range Rover. I get driving in the desert with a 1500, or going camping, in the mountains, mudding or basic off-roading. Just can’t seem to grasp wheeling with a 1/2 ton. I know it can be done, just don’t understand why you wouldn’t go for something dedicated and smaller to do so. My 1500 is my daily driver and Home Depot hauler. Cant imagine wheeling it on the weekend, breaking something and then being SOL on Monday.


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[RedSRT4Me]

Are you talking about expedition/overland like parking at the edge of a parking lot near some trees and taking pictures while your medium sized dog sits in the drivers' seat and your photogenic girlfriend/wife does yoga on the roof of the vehicle at sunrise?

#Blessyogapants

 

[rjames78]

The marketing and photography angle of "Overland!" fetishizes Class 6 trucks (Earthroamer XV, LMTV conversions) but that sort of highlights why I am always careful to encourage people to think about what they actually want to accomplish and build based on need not image. Unless image is the need.

The photography/instagram angle is valid. It sells lots of video and camera equipment, employs lots of fit young women and handsome men with cool sounding accents, and houses lots of medium sized dogs. Behind the scenes quite a few prominent social media Overlanders function a bit like boy bands with investors and talent working together to cultivate an advertising campaign that's a lot more targeted and has a lot more reach than conventional advertising did. In that sense it's real - it's real business. That's OK.

The considerations one has to make when building are if they want to look great in pictures for others or make it happen in the real world for themselves and to not confuse the two because often they have incompatible paths.

On the topic of what's "too big" I'll speak of my own experience - versatility is king and that versatility includes some not-instagrammy realities like whether your vehicle will fit inside a parking garage because cities are travel destinations too. Or how much of a security camera's view of your truck is blocked by the truck itself when you park in a sketchy place on your way to your destination. How many commas are going to be in your fuel budget. How smooth and comfortable your highway ride will be because how you feel after 14 hours rolling plays heavily into your performance in driving and decision making at whatever you left the house to do. How available replacement parts (odd sized tires... like mentioned above) are and how often you might break them. What kind of equipment you have to get unstuck and how likely you will be to be able to use it. Whether you or others in your party are strong enough to perform self-recovery (you ever send a couch potato up a hill with a spool of winch cable in tow?).. will you fit on the ferry? Will you fit on the end of the ferry that's leaving now, or do you have to wait 4 hours for the next one?

The list is absolutely endless and the more realistic you are when analyzing it the less time and money you'll spend working around the problems you'll encounter.

My opinion and experience tells me something like a stock Power Wagon is at the upper limits of how big a vehicle can really be without becoming a pretty significant burden in a lot of North America. A 1500 with a little bit of lift is still going to fit in most parking garages and generally interface with the infrastructure of the world without much difficulty.

There are trails it's too bulky to fit through, a fullsize is the wrong vehicle for those kind of trails. Not really any getting around that.

Sorry if that came across lecture-like, it's all conversation and I don't have an emotional investment in what everyone else does with their own vehicles.

No not at all I genuinely appreciate the input, i truly am trying to build this truck into more what I need as opposed to what I want and i find myself overdoing things sometimes and it’s exactly Input like that I need to reign me back in.

Thanks again for your honesty, I agree with much of what u said.


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[rjames78]

That's a pretty relaxed looking dude, maybe you should start an instagram?

Lol thanks he is definitely pretty chill.
I tell people he’s a terrible dog ( never barks , would lick you to death if u broke into my house etc ) but he’s the greatest companion.


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[rjames78]

I learned long ago, if your looking to play on rocks, then buy a Jeep, if your looking to hit the trails, then buy a Toyota, if you looking to spend money then buy a Range Rover. I get driving in the desert with a 1500, or going camping, in the mountains, mudding or basic off-roading. Just can’t seem to grasp wheeling with a 1/2 ton. I know it can be done, just don’t understand why you wouldn’t go for something dedicated and smaller to do so. My 1500 is my daily driver and Home Depot hauler. Cant imagine wheeling it on the weekend, breaking something and then being SOL on Monday.


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Honestly I find the short box single cab set up have the best solution for all my needs.
I’m a big dude 6’ 3 “ 325
Plus my dog
Plus the gear I want to transport

And I don’t recall asking that particular question.
Thanks tho I guess.




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[ram1500rsm]

I'm possibly part of the minority that takes the truck out to the dirt and have absolutely no issue banging metal from time to time. I have a couple of groups i go out offroading with, Jeep group and a Tacoma group, everybody has a bunch of mods in their rigs and everybody is fiendly so is all about having fun and helping each other out while on the trails. Sure 1500's are NOT rock crawlers, and i'm not looking to make mine a rock crawler either but i do more than just basic trails with it. At times i wish i had a 2500 with live axels as i'm actually more in a little more hardcore trails but i've found myself enjoying the fast offroad stuff in the desert now days so i have no complaints.

Most of our mountain trails here in Socal have rocks here and there and they're not all King of the hammer trails... Just have to pay attention of your lines and don't mind pin stripes or wheel scracthes from the rocks and body damage which is also possible at times. Sometimes you have to go forward before you can make the u-turn. i swear of god i don't get in much more trouble because i don't have a winch hahaha.

I like to do trails with nice ruts in between to make things interesting and i do actually enjoy doing 3 wheeling at times to show off a big phucking full size truck can actually move out under this conditions. Sometimes if you're not paying attention your rock sliders will let you know you went to close to some rocks hahaha. Rock sliders are a plus around here unless you don't mind some crushed rocker panels.

Then we have a big desert to go fast and enjoy the fun of washes and hoops when is not summer. I feel 1500's can do great in this conditions as this is where the IFS can shine if you have the proper parts.

All in all i'm more tha happy with the truck performance offroad and i'll do it again no questions asked. I'm running 37 KO2's now and before that i was running Falken AT3W's in 315/70/17's. The last were about 5lbs heavier per corner compared to the KO2's. I'm getting better MPG's with the KO2's go figures.

Our front LCA's can take really good abuse, and if you're responsible with the skinny pedal i guess you can make your CV's and tie rods last, my truck has 80k miles still on the original front LCA's, tie rods, CV's etc, etc.

Tacos are better suited for most aggresive offroad compared to a RAM 1500 ,even more if you had a Jeep Wrangler. and the offroad aftermarket for both platforms is huge as opposed to what we have with the RAM's. I've had both before and the reason i don't have either option now days anymore is because i wanted the space the 1500 CC's have as a i have a family of 5, my oldest kid is 6ft tall and Tacos have fairly small rear seats even in the CC version, same with the Jeeps. I guess i wouldn't mind trading the RAM for a Gladiator but i have no reason to want one that bad yet. My experience with the RAM has been great so far and no Jeep or Taco can drive as comfy and have as much power as my 4th gen 1500 Hemi does. I had Icon stage 5 in the Taco and a very flexy Jeep Wrangler unlimited prepped for some nice rocky terrain so i can tell you if you had 3.92's, at least factory LSD and 44-45 transfer case, your RAM 1500 can go places you can't imagine doing if you don't grab some Guevos to check them out

Have fun.

 

[rjames78]

Thank you once again exactly the input I was looking for!
I’m going to have to put u on a consultant salary pretty quick ha


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[ram1500rsm]

Thank you once again exactly the input I was looking for!
I’m going to have to put u on a consultant salary pretty quick ha


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Haha tell me about it.
This hobby can get expensive fairly quick.
You can run Nitto MT or Toyo MT tires in 35x12.5 and be close to what a 37x12.5 KO2 will look like height wise. Problem asides from height is weight. Keep weight as light as possible for a better driving experience. This was one the reasons i went with BFG KO2 in 37x12.5x17. My wheels are just 25lbs each, tires are 69lbs.

Fun fact i get 18mpg (fwy only at 68-70mph), 9-10mpg city. My truck has an HPT tune done by me.