issues after plug change

[firepuppet66]

So, 2009 Ram 1500, 5.7L Hemi, 206,000KM (128,000miles). Changed the spark plugs using OEM copper nickel type, factory gapped around 0.40 to 0.42". Engine started up nicely, running smooth, no noticeable running problems BUT check engine light popped up, code P0137 O2 sensor. Stopped at the dealer where I bought the plugs and inquired. Advice was that sometimes happens, clear the code and see. Did. Popped up once more, cleared it and took it for a good spin. It has not returned yet however the fuel mielage calculator says I am getting WORSE gas mileage! It was running combined city hwy around 16.8L/100km (14mpg U.S.) and could get down near 14 (16.8 mpg U.S.) and now is showing 20 to 25 at start up and 18.5 after a run (13 U.S. mpg approx.) I should mention I just had the drivers side exhaust manifold replaced by the dealer and they treated me alright price-wise. The truck is quiet now. So what gives? Maybe the cpu is still recalibrating?

 

[Mister Luck]

Did you use anti-seize when installing ?

 

[firepuppet66]

Yes I did as recommended by just about every you tube plus the dealer.

 

[Mister Luck]

How much you use is critical and can be the issue
I suggest removing all the plugs and wiping them off with a shop towel you only need to use anti-seize as a barrier, and not a coating, if you can see the anti-seize you have used too much you should only be able to feel it on the threads of the spark plug.

While you have the spark plugs out you can test them for continuity and resistance with a multi-meter set on ohms.

 

[Mister Luck]

If cleaning your spark-plugs doesn’t work you may need to remove residual anti seize from the combustion chamber.
You could use something like sea foam indirectly or in the gas tank

If that doesn’t work,
when the engine is cold check the engine’s cooling system with a pressure tester to see if it holds pressure to insure the code isn’t contamination from coolant in your exhaust system it could be caused by a hairline crack in your aluminum cylinder head or a head gasket.

The guys that replaced the exhaust manifold find any broken manifold bolts they need to remove below the surface of the cylinder head ? (broken off in the cylinder head)

 

[firepuppet66]

Interesting. I'm not sure what too much anti-sieze would do. Now, I did not heavily coat them but you could see the film on the threads. I torqued the plugs in properly. I hate the thought of pulling them all out mainly because my leg muscles did not like being cramped into the engine bay! However I suppose I could do a few at a time. The plugs were not all that hard to remove and install. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Mister Luck]

Interesting. I'm not sure what too much anti-sieze would do. Now, I did not heavily coat them but you could see the film on the threads. I torqued the plugs in properly. I hate the thought of pulling them all out mainly because my leg muscles did not like being cramped into the engine bay! However I suppose I could do a few at a time. The plugs were not all that hard to remove and install. Thanks for the reply.

It’s least expensive and although time consuming if it does correct the issue you probably won’t have to go down the other rabbit hole.

Too much anti-seize contaminates the electrode because it has metal dust imbedded in the grease and your spark plug is trying to ignite , it acts as a resistor.
The code is the burning of the grease coating the o2 sensor down stream in the exhaust flow or something else like coolant.

 

[crash68]

Did you pull the battery cable while changing the plugs? I'd guess the ECM and probably TCM is still recalibrating itself. Keep tabs on fuel economy over the next couple of tanks if there isn't ani codes being thrown. Colder weather and fuel quality can effect fuel economy.
If there was that much anti-sieze on the plugs you would probably not have a smooth running engine and most likely misfire codes.

 

[Octane]

Interesting. I'm not sure what too much anti-sieze would do. Now, I did not heavily coat them but you could see the film on the threads. I torqued the plugs in properly. I hate the thought of pulling them all out mainly because my leg muscles did not like being cramped into the engine bay! However I suppose I could do a few at a time. The plugs were not all that hard to remove and install. Thanks for the reply.

Disconnect battery cable for 10 minutes.Reconnect and drive normally for 2 to 3 days,let the computer relearn.After a few days,check fuel economy/ performance.Changing spark plugs alone, shouldn't ever give negative performance/ mpg.

 

[Wild one]

Did you check the springs that are inside the rubber boots and coil contacts over for corrosion. The springs and the contact inside the coil tower are famous for corroding,you can buy new rubber boots with new springs from Rock Auto,and a few minutes with a Dremel and a carbon steel brush will work wonders for cleaning up the screw head contact that conducts current to the top of the plugs. You'd have to get really sloppy with the anti-seaze before it'd cause you any issues.
Did you by chance get carried away with di-electric grease,di-electric grease is an insulator,and should only be applied very sparingly to the bottom of the porcellin part of the plug,so it doesn't insulate the top of the plug.

These are what i use to clean up the coil contacts under the springs

Amazon.com

 

[firepuppet66]

All good suggestions. I did not disconnect the battery at that time. That is worth a try. I did look in a few boots and the springs looked OK but I did not check them all. I did put a blob of dielectric grease at the opening of each boot as I had seen in a few you tube vids on the topic. I think I'll try the battery disconnect and cpu re-learn then just drive for a while and see what happens. The engine is running smooth as silk, no misfires or stumbling. Interesting suggestion from Mister luck that vapourized anti-sieze might set off an O2 sensor. So there it is for now. I'll post in a few days what happens and thanks for the help!

 

[firepuppet66]

And the winner is....? Disconnect the battery. Yup, that did it. Just back from a good spin and she's back down to 15L/100km so about 16mpg U.S., 19 mpg Canadian Imperial. Not great but normal for a 4x4 crew cab. Thank you all for your ideas on that. Still throwing an O2 code on and off. No coolant leaks. Might just need some new ones. I'll have to see which one is acting up.

 

[Tominator223]

Check that gap

 

[1999 White C5 Coupe]

Yes I did as recommended by just about every you tube plus the dealer.

http://www.jagrepair.com/images/AutoRepairPhotos/NGK_TB-0630111antisieze.pdf

 

[Wild one]

http://www.jagrepair.com/images/AutoRepairPhotos/NGK_TB-0630111antisieze.pdf

Yea i'm not so sure about NGK's ideas. This metal plating they're going on about that breaks away from the plug on removal,just where do you think it ends going when you crank a new plug back in those same holes.I've also fought more siezed plugs in aluminium heads then you can count,i'm sticking with anti-seaze.When used sparingly and with some common sense,you won't have any issues.Personally i think NGK is over dramatizing things just a wee bit

"NGK recommends only using spark plugs with metal plating on all aluminum head applications to prevent damage to the head and plug. Metal shell plating acts as a “lubricant” which breaks away from the main body of the spark plug during removal, preventing damage to the spark plug and or threads in the cylinder head."

 

[Mister Luck]

And the winner is....? Disconnect the battery. Yup, that did it. Just back from a good spin and she's back down to 15L/100km so about 16mpg U.S., 19 mpg Canadian Imperial. Not great but normal for a 4x4 crew cab. Thank you all for your ideas on that. Still throwing an O2 code on and off. No coolant leaks. Might just need some new ones. I'll have to see which one is acting up.

This is interesting considering disconnecting the throttle body would be necessary for this to to be the solution…

 

[Mister Luck]

And the winner is....? Disconnect the battery. Yup, that did it. Just back from a good spin and she's back down to 15L/100km so about 16mpg U.S., 19 mpg Canadian Imperial. Not great but normal for a 4x4 crew cab. Thank you all for your ideas on that. Still throwing an O2 code on and off. No coolant leaks. Might just need some new ones. I'll have to see which one is acting up.

Going back to your spark-plugs and the anti-seize
I wasn’t this aware of the technical implications….
I mean it’s just anti-seize ? right ?
Spark plug are made with zinc and nickel plating to protect them from the steel corroding and galling inside the aluminum cylinder head.. and though spark plugs aren’t changed as much 100,000 miles still sounds crazy but that’s what some manufacturers attest.
Take it into consideration that platings are surface applications and thin at best, still need to be protected.
Through experience and recommendations you learn not to screw anything into a dry hole.

There is the technical issue of torque values being adjusted.
In the larger picture there is a greater concern than in the past for spark plugs to ground properly because of the increased voltage made through coil on plug and wasted spark ignition systems.

The alternative with all different choices in formulas in anti-seize is to use the ones that have a higher electrical conductivity.
The first choice most assume are formulas containing copper since copper has greater conductivity than most metals, some write in caution from using it in conjunction with a part inserted into the combustion chambers …

“Copper is recognized as a powerful “pro-oxidant.” The contamination of lube oil with copper anti-seize during the assembly of gear boxes, bearing housings, and hydraulic systems creates a situation that may compromise machine performance due to lube oil breakdown acerbated by copper contamination.”

What is recommended is to use anti-seize thread lubricants using combination of nickel and graphites for conductivity and tolerance to high heat exposure

Project Farm Video on Anti-Seize Comparisons
https://youtu.be/Kj-kmIbSQvk?si=wHWTzq9wpw9z_DHc

Nickel-Graf from Anti-Seize Technologies
Amazon.com: Anti-Seize Technology 13005 Nickel and Graphite Anti-Seize Compound Paste, 5 oz., Gray : Automotive

NASA test studies on Graphites and Aluminum Alloys

processed 6061-t6 aluminum: Topics by Science.gov

You must use the right spark plug lubricant

You must use the right spark plug lubricant when changing spark plugs or your engine will suffer.-----------------------------Subscribe:https://www.youtube.c...

youtu.be

Same formula as the Champion aerospace just in a larger size container

McMaster-Carr

McMaster-Carr is the complete source for your plant with over 595,000 products. 98% of products ordered ship from stock and deliver same or next day.

www.mcmaster.com

 

[Octane]

And the winner is....? Disconnect the battery. Yup, that did it. Just back from a good spin and she's back down to 15L/100km so about 16mpg U.S., 19 mpg Canadian Imperial. Not great but normal for a 4x4 crew cab. Thank you all for your ideas on that. Still throwing an O2 code on and off. No coolant leaks. Might just need some new ones. I'll have to see which one is acting up.

The computer resets and relearns and adapts to a certain extent to your driving style.Can remedy issues sometimes.A good reboot,is better than a good kick in frustration,to the fender,with your boot!

 

[Oaktownraid]

Thanks for the link to Project Farm. Informative.

 

[firepuppet66]

great info supplied here.