Making simple upgrades while under warranty without voiding it...

[corneileous]

I have a new truck and going through the same decisions on what mods I want to do and how. So far other than a full tint job and other appearance/non mechanical, I have not done anything. I don't have extended warranty but they did throw in a limited maintenance contract which is mainly the first 7 oil changes.



I'm wanting to lower it, change the wheels/tires, and put in some decent gears - 3.92 LS vs the stock 3.21 open. Per the service person, the gears regardless of who does it, would void the warranty because of going into the control module to correct the speedo.



I agree, this will probably be my last new truck, just too much of a pita dealing with these people. But, here I am in this situation and don't want to necessarily void the warranty if I can help it. Maybe just do the things that I know won't interfere and start shelving parts for later.

See, that’s just it. From the way a service writer explained it to me was that like, you won’t know what will void your possible future warranty claim until you find out from a tech that said your “modification(s)” is what caused the problem and that warranty won’t pay for the repairs. It’s like, you won’t know that bridge even exists until all of the sudden it shows up outta the blue that your CAI for example that you put on, came back to take a bite outta your backside.

That was the way I took it at least.


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[Ram13BH]

Your best bet to avoid most problems with warranty issues is let the dealer do the work. That’s what I get from reading the warranty paperwork.



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This is true for the most part, but even work at the dealership can cause warranty claim issues if the change/upgrade performed is proven to have caused the problem.

The protection afforded all consumers that is referred to in this thread is covered federally in The Magnuson-Moss Act if you want to Google it.

We do a lot of lift kits and modifications at the dealership where I work and we have to tell people all the time even though we are doing it there is no guarantee they will not have a warranty hassle at some point. It is less likely with Mopar parts installed by us, but in no way a promise of hassle free living.

I bought my truck used and found out after I bought it that the previous owner had evidently had a programmer of some type in it. I had an emissions issue and my own dealership refused to repair it under warranty because my ECM showed 13 non-Chrysler reprogram attempts. I had to fight to get it done but finally won and didn't have to pay.

Moral of the story; be educated and armed with the correct information to push back if someone tries to give you a hassle over mods. They must PROVE the mod caused the issue!!

 

[Ram13BH]

See, that’s just it. From the way a service writer explained it to me was that like, you won’t know what will void your possible future warranty claim until you find out from a tech that said your “modification(s)” is what caused the problem and that warranty won’t pay for the repairs. It’s like, you won’t know that bridge even exists until all of the sudden it shows up outta the blue that your CAI for example that you put on, came back to take a bite outta your backside.

That was the way I took it at least.


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You took it correctly...doing mods CANNOT void any warranty in it's entirety just because you do it, but at the point of an issue it can allow the dealer to refuse coverage of individual issues as they occur.

 

[H1Chester]

Pretty much how I have understood the Magneson Moss Act is you can pretty much do anything you want to your vehicle short of anything requiring a tune. As soon as you tune your motor your powertrain warranty is gone.

Otherwise they specifically MUST PROVE what you have done to your vehicle has been detrimental to the cycle of operation of your vehicle.

So throw on ALL of those bolt ons: short tube headers, y pipe, cat back, intake, pully, throttle body, thermostat, suspension upgrades, rear end gearing, etc.

Long tube headers, camshaft, supercharger/turbo = tune required = warranty gone.

The Magneson Moss Act protects us.

 

[corneileous]

Pretty much how I have understood the Magneson Moss Act is you can pretty much do anything you want to your vehicle short of anything requiring a tune. As soon as you tune your motor your powertrain warranty is gone.

I bought the lifetime warranty on mine so making use of a performance programmer is something that’ll remain in the past.

Besides, unless you do all that stuff with the cam, forced air and all, a tune is pretty much useless unless you’re using it for a specific purpose like I did on my old truck which was to turn off that redundant MDS.

Otherwise they specifically MUST PROVE what you have done to your vehicle has been detrimental to the cycle of operation of your vehicle.

Somethin’ tells me that that’s something that could very well be not as easy as it sounds, depending on whatever it is. It’s their word against yours. It’d probably take a very good and most likely a very expensive lawyer to win against them at which in my opinion would really make me start thinkin’ how important said mod was all the sudden.

So throw on ALL of those bolt ons: short tube headers, y pipe, cat back, intake, pully, throttle body, thermostat, suspension upgrades, rear end gearing, etc.

I wish it were that easy but unless that service writer I mentioned a few posts up that I talked to that started this whole mess, didn’t know what the hell he was talking about and was using scare tactics to dissuade people from modifying their vehicles, I’m not even sure I wanna find out.

The Magneson Moss Act protects us.

Sounds to me like these manufacturers found a way to circumvent that....


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[H1Chester]

I bought the lifetime warranty on mine so making use of a performance programmer is something that’ll remain in the past.

Besides, unless you do all that stuff with the cam, forced air and all, a tune is pretty much useless unless you’re using it for a specific purpose like I did on my old truck which was to turn off that redundant MDS.


Somethin’ tells me that that’s something that could very well be not as easy as it sounds, depending on whatever it is. It’s their word against yours. It’d probably take a very good and most likely a very expensive lawyer to win against them at which in my opinion would really make me start thinkin’ how important said mod was all the sudden.


I wish it were that easy but unless that service writer I mentioned a few posts up that I talked to that started this whole mess, didn’t know what the hell he was talking about and was using scare tactics to dissuade people from modifying their vehicles, I’m not even sure I wanna find out.




Sounds to me like these manufacturers found a way to circumvent that....


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Never had an issue in the Chevrolet community. Granted I did not do a cam swap on my Camaro until my powertrain warranty expired. However prior to the warranty expiring I took my Camaro to the dealer for service when the car had bolt ons that didn't "require" a tune. The Chevrolet service department didn't bat an eye. Actually they thought it was cool. A tune is NOT useless for just bolt ons. A tune with just bolt ons would only make those bolt ons even more efficient. I will do everything possible to my truck short of tuning it with a programmer or a custom dyno tune until the warranty is up. Legally, they CAN NOT deny warranty repairs for bolt ons prior to tuning aka re-programming the cycle of operation of your engine. If they tried, they would lose because they MUST prove that the bolt on you are doing is actually damaging your engine. When in fact the bolt on you are doing is more than likely improving the performance of your engine.

A lot of people seem to be freaked out by warranty and bolt ons. I have never had an issue with bolt ons and warranty. Magneson Moss protects you.

 

[corneileous]

Never had an issue in the Chevrolet community. Granted I did not do a cam swap on my Camaro until my powertrain warranty expired. However prior to the warranty expiring I took my Camaro to the dealer for service when the car had bolt ons that didn't "require" a tune. The Chevrolet service department didn't bat an eye. Actually they thought it was cool. A tune is NOT useless for just bolt ons. A tune with just bolt ons would only make those bolt ons even more efficient. I will do everything possible to my truck short of tuning it with a programmer or a custom dyno tune until the warranty is up. Legally, they CAN NOT deny warranty repairs for bolt ons prior to tuning aka re-programming the cycle of operation of your engine. If they tried, they would lose because they MUST prove that the bolt on you are doing is actually damaging your engine. When in fact the bolt on you are doing is more than likely improving the performance of your engine.

A lot of people seem to be freaked out by warranty and bolt ons. I have never had an issue with bolt ons and warranty. Magneson Moss protects you.

So in other words, in all of your bolt-on mods, you never once had a problem that required warranty work, to find out whether or not the service department deemed your bolt-on aftermarket part as the problem thus rendering your warranty useless? This is what I mean. I fully understand that bolting on an exhaust or a CAI to name a couple isn’t going to outright void your warranty. I fully understand that the Magnuson Act protects us from that but what I’m simply saying is it doesn’t cover us if the service shop says that said mod is what created the problem; unless yes, they prove that said part is in fact the cause but how do you be 100% sure that you can protect yourself from that warranty denial even with legal help when you know damn well that there is no way possible that a bolt-on cat-back exhaust kit caused whatever problem that you’re dealing with? When in fact that they’re just most likely trying to use your bolt-on accessory as an excuse to make you pay for it?

Maybe for some things, different brands of tuners, is good for just simple bolt on stuff but the reason I said what I said was because I’ve never fully thought the Diablo Sport Trinity T-1000 tuner I had on my old truck which was a 2008 Hemi Ram, was worth the money I spent on it. I mean don’t get me wrong, it beefed it up a little bit but we’re not talking much. As I said before, about all it was good for really was just to turn that MDS off. It was pretty much a waste. I couldn’t even leave it plugged in all the time kinda like it was designed to do because it interfered with my TPMS and my Key Fob communication with the truck.

We have very good reason to be freaked out. Vehicles are a lot more expensive to work in these days that a lot of people don’t wanna screw with the possibility of someday voiding a warranty claim. I sure as hell don’t because I paid nearly 4 grand for a lifetime warranty. lol.

Who knows. I may never have a problem but I really don’t want to find out that hard way that my aftermarket part caused a problem that warranty says, sorry pal.


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[H1Chester]

Sorry you feel that way man. I'm not freaked out at all. I've never had an issue, nor will I. I've stayed away from extended warranties because every consumer report group or consumer protection group has said they're a rip off and a waste of money. Good luck with your truck.

 

[corneileous]

I’m just a cautious person, what can I say. This is my first brand new vehicle and it wasn’t cheap. It’s got a lot of high-tech gadgetry on it that’s probably very expensive to fix if something ever happens.

For the record, I’m not freaked out, I just don’t want to press my luck. Too many horror stories so leaving my truck virtually stock is fine by me.

I’ve gotten extended warranties on every vehicle I’ve owned and they’ve been nothing but a blessing but they’ve all been non-manufacturer warranties, just an extended warranty they sell you when you buy a used vehicle.

Thanks for the blessing, I’m hoping nothing goes wrong for a very long time.


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[grizzstang]

I will never own a programmer again. My last truck had an expensive programmer and was custom tuned. One time switching from my performance tune to my towing tune it malfunctioned and bricked my PCM. Luckily the dealer was able to reprogram a stock tune on it and get it running but it cost me several hundred dollars for a tow and 2 hours labor. I ended up reloading the custom tow tune (because I spent a fortune on the programmer) and never changed it again. The dealer told me sometimes they are not able to recover the PCM after this happens and then it needs to be replaced, no thanks. This truck has plenty of power anyway. The only mechanical mod beyond the rear coil spring replacement I have already done will be shorty headers when the bolts snap off the OEM exhaust manifolds and the warranty is done.

 

[BIG RED HEMI]

I will never own a programmer again. My last truck had an expensive programmer and was custom tuned. One time switching from my performance tune to my towing tune it malfunctioned and bricked my PCM. Luckily the dealer was able to reprogram a stock tune on it and get it running but it cost me several hundred dollars for a tow and 2 hours labor. I ended up reloading the custom tow tune (because I spent a fortune on the programmer) and never changed it again. The dealer told me sometimes they are not able to recover the PCM after this happens and then it needs to be replaced, no thanks. This truck has plenty of power anyway. The only mechanical mod beyond the rear coil spring replacement I have already done will be shorty headers when the bolts snap off the OEM exhaust manifolds and the warranty is done.

I just installed a Diablo tuner, but I purchased the modified PCM instead of having my original one sent it to be modified. It's more expensive that way, but If I need warranty work done I just swap the PCM's and bring it in.

 

[corneileous]

I just installed a Diablo tuner, but I purchased the modified PCM instead of having my original one sent it to be modified. It's more expensive that way, but If I need warranty work done I just swap the PCM's and bring it in.

I always wondered how that worked. I take it your odometer information isn’t stored on your computer?

I’m just curious but wouldn’t the Chrysler computer at the dealer shop see something out of the ordinary about inconsistencies with a huge gap from when the original was last accessed?

That computer swapping just sounds fishy.


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[BIG RED HEMI]

I'm not sure what the PCM tracks as far as mileage or date last accessed, but I'm hoping that won't be an issue. I haven't had to take it in yet for anything warranty related yet.

 

[corneileous]

I'm not sure what the PCM tracks as far as mileage or date last accessed, but I'm hoping that won't be an issue. I haven't had to take it in yet for anything warranty related yet.

Yeah I dunno. I have no idea how that would work and probably never will because considering the very, very minute changes I got on my old truck with my DS Trinity, I just can’t see the justification of spending that kinda money on a new tuner and a computer for the very little change in performance. It’s just not worth it to me.


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[grizzstang]

On my Ford the mileage was definitely in the PCM but I am not sure how the Ram works.

Don't get me wrong, I liked the programmer and the difference in performance with the custom tune was very noticeable but it is not worth the risk for me anymore.

 

[corneileous]

Don't get me wrong, I liked the programmer and the difference in performance with the custom tune was very noticeable but it is not worth the risk for me anymore.

See that was me, and that was even on the 91 octane performance tune for a CAI and a cat-back exhaust. The rare times I’d get to run the 93 octane performance tune- didn’t get to play much with that tune because living in my neck of the woods in Oklahoma, nobody sold 93 octane gas so every time for a while going to Texas I’d fill up and retune but, in all honesty, I couldn’t tell a difference between the two so I quit retuning.

But at least I can add tho, if I would’a known that having the tuner plugged into the truck all the time was gonna cause radio interference issues with the key fob communications with the truck and mess with the signals from my wheel sensors to the TPMS brain I coulda saved about a total of close to 300 bucks by only getting the In-Tune model over the Trinity and not buying the replacement A-pillar cover for one with a gauge hole and a gauge-hole mount.



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