New Cummins HO vs Non-HO spec

[Rick Ram-jet]

Doing my homework on upgrading to a diesel dually prior to buying a 5th wheel....
Looking for 1st hand/real world feedback from those who have had the pre-HO motor and now have the new HO version! Does the new HO make that much difference?

Thank you in advance for the feedback... cheers, RRJ

 

[Tom Williams]

I believe the HO Cummins has 1000ft/lbs of torque.

 

[dodgeramfan]

Just bought mine . Dually HO for my 5er but it only has 300 miles on it . Things a monster . Can’t wait to pull with it . I opted for the 373 gears . I’m not real sure on these tires though. Probably putting Michelin’s on her soon . It’s a Laramie .


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[dodgeramfan]

Doing my homework on upgrading to a diesel dually prior to buying a 5th wheel....
Looking for 1st hand/real world feedback from those who have had the pre-HO motor and now have the new HO version! Does the new HO make that much difference?

Thank you in advance for the feedback... cheers, RRJ

They are rated at 1000 and 850 foot lbs of torque. My 5th wheel weighs in at 13000 lbs . My truck is rated for almost 34k . I’m coming out of a 2018 6.4 hemi that pulled her surprisingly well but 6-10 mpg wasn’t cutting it . And she really worked to pull it . I’m thing either Cummins engine will be wonderful.


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[Rick Ram-jet]

dodgeramfan, she`s a beast, can`t wait for some towing feedback!
Also, I`m with you on the Nexen tires, Michelin`s are the way to go!

Anyone else have any apple to apple towing comparisons?

 

[Walter Conrad]

Is the HO worth the extra $2000.00 option. NO!!, unless you are into chest thumping.
The HO version is the set up for 30000lb goose neck HOT SHOT trailers, any 5th wheel recreational trailer you are likely to
purchase will be handled with ease with the SO. There aren't many that are rated over its 24,000lb tow rating.
The other thing you will be dealing with is the rough and very annoying shift strategies built into the
Aisan tranny when unloaded. The 68rfe is buttery smooth around town. The 68fre has gotten a bad rap
mostly from tuners that don't know what they are doing.
And the Nexen Tires are performing just fine
Averaging 18.5 mpg empty, 12-12.5 towing and about 400mpg def

2020 SO Cummins 4:10 axle
currently i am pulling a 41' KZ Durango Gold 16000lb gvw

 

[mtofell]

very annoying shift strategies built into the
Aisan tranny when unloaded. The 68rfe is buttery smooth around town.

There was a write-up that was really down on the DRW/Aisin combo for anything but all out towing. I can't remember but it may have been the Ike Gaunlet guys. Basically, the truck is a beast when hauling 30,000# but it's harsh and kind of a PITA as a daily driver.

 

[Rick Ram-jet]

There was a write-up that was really down on the DRW/Aisin combo for anything but all out towing. I can't remember but it may have been the Ike Gaunlet guys. Basically, the truck is a beast when hauling 30,000# but it's harsh and kind of a PITA as a daily driver.

To be expected from a set-up with such a high haul/tow rating, based on my research so far...
The Ram is said to be much more livable when NOT towing compared to the Ford dually!

Apparently the Ford has quite an unpleasant ride when empty...

That said, I`m looking at several months of cross country travel with a 5th wheel/toy hauler 40+ft and probably around 15 to 18k+.

 

[Walter Conrad]

To be expected from a set-up with such a high haul/tow rating, based on my research so far...
The Ram is said to be much more livable when NOT towing compared to the Ford dually!

Apparently the Ford has quite an unpleasant ride when empty...

That said, I`m looking at several months of cross country travel with a 5th wheel/toy hauler 40+ft and probably around 15 to 18k+.

It's the Aisan trans that is the PITA not the suspension. when running empty it's the upshift of the trans that wants to rip your head off. plus anything under 24k gross weight the SO/68rfe will handle with ease. With the HO you also screw yourself out of 500lb of payload capacity. You claim you will be pulling 18k, both will work, the choice is yours. You may want to reread my previous post.
i use this combo at least 6 months of the year traveling the lower 48

 

[HDGoose]

I went from a 2013 RAM 2500 diesel 3.73 gears to my 2020 RAM 3500 HO dually with 4.10 gears. The 2500 did fine in the mountains and any play towing 12k toyhauler. the 3500 HOmmakes me watch the speedometer because it will quickly get over 80mph dragging the trailer.

That's my observation. When I bought mine the price difference between the HO and the SO was $2k.

Either truck will do well for up to a 20k 5ver.

Test driving the trucks back to back you'll probably choose the SO. If you could test drive with 10k plus, you'll choose the HO.

 

[Walter Conrad]

I went from a 2013 RAM 2500 diesel 3.73 gears to my 2020 RAM 3500 HO dually with 4.10 gears. The 2500 did fine in the mountains and any play towing 12k toyhauler. the 3500 HOmmakes me watch the speedometer because it will quickly get over 80mph dragging the trailer.

That's my observation. When I bought mine the price difference between the HO and the SO was $2k.

Either truck will do well for up to a 20k 5ver.

Test driving the trucks back to back you'll probably choose the SO. If you could test drive with 10k plus, you'll choose the HO.

Unless you did the swap yourself a 2013 Ram 2500 6.7 Cummins was not available with a 3.73 axle ratio only a 3.42. There is a big difference in pulling power between a 3.73 and a 4.10 and an even bigger one between a 3.42 and a 4.10, so your comparison is kind of moot. Also if the truck is to be a daily driver while the addition of weight will somewhat tame the harsh shifting of the Aisin trans, it will take more than 10,000lbs that you suggest and most likely the OP will be running 80% of the time empty. I will admit that the HO/Aisin is rated to pull more weight but is it better suited for the job of pulling 15-18k as the OP stated. I think not. When optioned out the same the difference will be negligible. My Observation

 

[HDGoose]

Unless you did the swap yourself a 2013 Ram 2500 6.7 Cummins was not available with a 3.73 axle ratio only a 3.42. There is a big difference in pulling power between a 3.73 and a 4.10 and an even bigger one between a 3.42 and a 4.10, so your comparison is kind of moot. Also if the truck is to be a daily driver while the addition of weight will somewhat tame the harsh shifting of the Aisin trans, it will take more than 10,000lbs that you suggest and most likely the OP will be running 80% of the time empty. I will admit that the HO/Aisin is rated to pull more weight but is it better suited for the job of pulling 15-18k as the OP stated. I think not. When optioned out the same the difference will be negligible. My Observation

I no longer have the sticker, so I guess you are correct.

I am sure that my 2500 was reading 1800 at 70 while my 3500 shows 2000.

 

[dodgeramfan]

Is the HO worth the extra $2000.00 option. NO!!, unless you are into chest thumping.
The HO version is the set up for 30000lb goose neck HOT SHOT trailers, any 5th wheel recreational trailer you are likely to
purchase will be handled with ease with the SO. There aren't many that are rated over its 24,000lb tow rating.
The other thing you will be dealing with is the rough and very annoying shift strategies built into the
Aisan tranny when unloaded. The 68rfe is buttery smooth around town. The 68fre has gotten a bad rap
mostly from tuners that don't know what they are doing.
And the Nexen Tires are performing just fine
Averaging 18.5 mpg empty, 12-12.5 towing and about 400mpg def

2020 SO Cummins 4:10 axle
currently i am pulling a 41' KZ Durango Gold 16000lb gvw
View attachment 230954

That’s a gorgeous rig! If I may ask. What’s your pin weight and how’s your dually handle the 5th wheel as far as squat and cross winds?


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[Joseph Crawford]

There was a write-up that was really down on the DRW/Aisin combo for anything but all out towing. I can't remember but it may have been the Ike Gaunlet guys. Basically, the truck is a beast when hauling 30,000# but it's harsh and kind of a PITA as a daily driver.

I disagree on the harsh shifting.! I have a2020 HO Asian and I don’t even know when it shifts empty or loaded unless I watch the tac. I came from a 2018 so 68,and I can say there isn’t a lot of difference in the 2 trucks. I didn’t like how the 68rfe trans always felt like it was slipping when it shifted.

 

[KuenningWayne]

Doing my homework on upgrading to a diesel dually prior to buying a 5th wheel....
Looking for 1st hand/real world feedback from those who have had the pre-HO motor and now have the new HO version! Does the new HO make that much difference?

Thank you in advance for the feedback... cheers, RRJ

After owning both a 14 standard with the 68rfe trans and a 2020 with the aisin. The transmission upgrade is well worth the extra money. I put 3 new transmissions in my 14 cause the 68rfe is riddled with issues. I had the new 8 speed in my 19 power wagon but I never towed with it. In my opinion if you're going to tow with it the aisin trans is worth the extra money

 

[Warner R Rohr]

I just purchased a 3500 with HO but it is not a dually; does it make much difference in performance and ride

 

[John Jensen]

I have a 2020 3500 HO & Aisin and find it to be an excellent truck. I have to disagree with Walter's negative comments about the Aisin. Empty or towing it performs great and I don't have ANY of the issues he refers to. The Aisin is the strongest most reliable tranny out there.

 

[Walter Conrad]

I have a 2020 3500 HO & Aisin and find it to be an excellent truck. I have to disagree with Walter's negative comments about the Aisin. Empty or towing it performs great and I don't have ANY of the issues he refers to. The Aisin is the strongest most reliable tranny out there.

You possibly need to reread my comments. I never said the Aisin trans had issues. What I said was that Aisin had rough/harsh shift strategies that are noticeable when unloaded compared to the 68rfe. I also said the SO/68rfe made for a better daily driver. I also stated that the 68fre gets a bad rap from tuners that don't know what the are doing. I never said the HO/Aisin would not perform well, I said when equipped the same towing the OP's 15-18k trailer, the difference would be negligible.

 

[Walter Conrad]

That’s a gorgeous rig! If I may ask. What’s your pin weight and how’s your dually handle the 5th wheel as far as squat and cross winds?


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Thank you!!
GVW as you are looking at it ready to go is 15680, the pin weight is 3460, 12220 on the axles. This trailer is well balanced with the heavy appliances over the axles. Residential refrigerator on the street side, washer & dryer on the curb side. The axles are well placed on the trailer to give an average 22% weight shift to the pin (3460)and minimal tail swing. It also has a unique feature of the entry door being in the curb side slide. Unfortunately KZ no longer manufacturers this model (G384RLT), it's replacement (G383RLQ) however is even better IMHO.
As far as drivability when loaded onto the truck, the truck has the standard dually suspension plus dr3500ca timbrens on the rear. While I have not measured the squat it is minimal, the secondary leaf springs do not engage but the timbrens do. The ride is smooth and comfortable more so that my 2013 3500 SRW, and I notice zero interference from cross winds or pushing from passing semi's, buses or class A motor homes. but to be honest I really didn't notice anything with my 3500 SRW. Head and tail winds are another story.
The truck has the puck system and the hitch I use is a 21k Demco Premier with puck adapter and the trailer king pin is a 21k TrailAir Air Ride running 95psi air pressure.

Hope this helps

 

[John Jensen]

.

You possibly need to reread my comments. I never said the Aisin trans had issues. What I said was that Aisin had rough/harsh shift strategies that are noticeable when unloaded compared to the 68rfe.

That's not quite what you said. Here's what you said:

"The other thing you will be dealing with is the rough and very annoying shift strategies built into the
Aisan tranny when unloaded.'

And, "It's the Aisan trans that is the PITA not the suspension. when running empty it's the upshift of the trans that wants to rip your head off."

I interpret what you said as being issues. Issues that I have not experienced, empty or loaded.

And, I notice Joseph Crawford (post 14) also disagrees with your comments.

I don't mean to start an argument but you accused me of misreading your posts.