New electric Ram

[Docwagon1776]

Autoevolution is just click-bait BS. They create their own renderings then pretend they are relevant.

 

[GTyankee]

I live 20 miles inland from San Diego Ca
This town could be called a San Diego Suburb, the towns West of me are so close together, they may as well be called San Diego
On the other hand, driving East from my town, houses are spaced much further apart, with horse ranching & a few Avocado Ranches & then everything fades away to nature for 100 miles before there is a small city & then the next city is Yuma Arizona 60 miles away.
Between those 2 areas, there are only Farms & many of them are abandoned.

What i am leading up to, i don't know of a single charging station, where the public is allowed to use.

I have heard of 1 station closer to downtown San Diego, it is suppose to have every modern fuel in todays vehicles, including that water fuel, whatever that is called

 

[GTyankee]

Belt Sander Drag Race

Shop Class on Guion Street

www.youtube.com

 

[mcarey]

I hope the day will never come that I have to own any EV. EV's will sink our economy, as we do not have the electrical grid that is sufficient enough to provide the amount of electricity for even 50% of all people to own a EV.

You know fairly rudimentary math actually suggests otherwise. Assuming every vehicle in the US today was magically changed to an EV over night, the one real problem that could happen would be if they all were to be charged at exactly the same time. Current grid capacity would be absolutely be exceeded - similar to how we see issues when everyone fires up their ACs or whatever. However, we also know that isn't a reality because well... magic isn't real, and statistically there is no chance that all ~270 million vehicles would be charging at the same time for a tremendous amount of reasons.

That said, we know that in 2020, the US grid generated 4,007TWh of electricity. Using average mileage and kWh figures (12,000 miles, 0.3 kWh), one would need ~3,600kWh per year. So again, if magically all US cars were instantly EVs, they would need a total of ~1000TWh of power per year. Which is just about 25% of what we produced in 2020.

Could the grid effectively generate and serve that additional power, I'm not sure, but again this is all with done with the pretense of magically having every vehicle in the country be an EV over night which we know is not a reality. I'd imagine some decent management would need to be in place, and upgrades would definitely have to be done to handle the additional consumption; though I am far from an EE. However it's easily safe to say that it is a far, far, stretch from not being "sufficient enough to provide the amount of electricity for even 50% of all people to own a EV", and is very likely capable of dealing with a majority of EVs, if not all. Today.

I live 20 miles inland from San Diego Ca
This town could be called a San Diego Suburb, the towns West of me are so close together, they may as well be called San Diego
On the other hand, driving East from my town, houses are spaced much further apart, with horse ranching & a few Avocado Ranches & then everything fades away to nature for 100 miles before there is a small city & then the next city is Yuma Arizona 60 miles away.
Between those 2 areas, there are only Farms & many of them are abandoned.

What i am leading up to, i don't know of a single charging station, where the public is allowed to use.

I have heard of 1 station closer to downtown San Diego, it is suppose to have every modern fuel in todays vehicles, including that water fuel, whatever that is called

chargehub.com should be able to show you all the stations around you. They definitely are still quite less frequent than your normal gas station in many places, that's for sure. But at the same time, you'll also be living at "gas station".

 

[Evguy1]

EV's can be programed to charge at any time of the night witch is a benefit to the power grid because they use off peak power to use some of that surplus overnight power. They can also be used as a power source to help take up peak power loads with (V2G) Vehicle to Grid capacity that many of the new EV's have. So you come home and plug your car in, the power company can pull power from your car and thousands of others to help with peak loads. Then as the load gets lower the power company starts to charge your car at the lower nigh rate. I know many of you conspiracy theorists will not like the idea of the power company having control of your car like that.

 

[mcarey]

I actually think that "for the betterment of all" functionality is pretty bad ass, personally.

 

[tron67j]

The assumption above is that the vast majority volume of EV owners have a dedicated charging spot they can connect to every day and night. While l, conceptually, think the idea of using cars for surge capacity is interesting, there are certainly concerns with how this works on so many levels. For example, do you pay to charge an empty car to full, they get to suck the power, then you pay again to charge it back up again? How about the millions of people that park on roads, in public garages, etc. The point is that any action taken has multiple reactions. As electric demand goes up, is everyone on board with more nuclear power to provide the demand? Solar (inefficient still), hydro (dams create problems), and wind (unreliable for on-demand) have no where near the capacity to support the possible future. Can one argue on any of these points? Sure can and probably have science behind it. But there is no scaling up currently in progress to meet the theorized future of us all electrically zipping along. And, to call out the storage problem, no scalable solution to recycle the millions of batteries already shot plus increased load from EVs is even in planning. Sure, ideas such as use batteries from cars at the end of life as power storage for homes is discussed. But I Imagine it will be a tough sell to get people to accept a mostly used item as their power source when they will have to shoulder the cost for hardware to use it, buy it, and then recycle it.

All the above is not from an anti-electric person. I just want realistic answers to all these issues before I contribute to a growing set of problems. Kind of a "devil I know" status right now, staying with ICE.

 

[mikeru]

I actually think that "for the betterment of all" functionality is pretty bad ass, personally.

Careful, you're dangerously close to getting political with that post.

 

[ChaosMike]

The assumption above is that the vast majority volume of EV owners have a dedicated charging spot they can connect to every day and night. While l, conceptually, think the idea of using cars for surge capacity is interesting, there are certainly concerns with how this works on so many levels. For example, do you pay to charge an empty car to full, they get to suck the power, then you pay again to charge it back up again? How about the millions of people that park on roads, in public garages, etc. The point is that any action taken has multiple reactions. As electric demand goes up, is everyone on board with more nuclear power to provide the demand? Solar (inefficient still), hydro (dams create problems), and wind (unreliable for on-demand) have no where near the capacity to support the possible future. Can one argue on any of these points? Sure can and probably have science behind it. But there is no scaling up currently in progress to meet the theorized future of us all electrically zipping along. And, to call out the storage problem, no scalable solution to recycle the millions of batteries already shot plus increased load from EVs is even in planning. Sure, ideas such as use batteries from cars at the end of life as power storage for homes is discussed. But I Imagine it will be a tough sell to get people to accept a mostly used item as their power source when they will have to shoulder the cost for hardware to use it, buy it, and then recycle it.

All the above is not from an anti-electric person. I just want realistic answers to all these issues before I contribute to a growing set of problems. Kind of a "devil I know" status right now, staying with ICE.

I do see a big issue with the cars that are parked on the street like people who live in cities as you said. I hope someone has some sort of idea for that. For me it would be no issue as I could easily have chargers around my house and might incentivize me to get some solar panels on the garage roof. So would be an easy thing for me to switch to for the daily drivers. As others have said I'd be more interested in an EV that doesn't look like they are trying too hard to be ultra futuristic, I like how Audi has kept the Etrons looking basically like their ICE equivalents.

 

[mcarey]

The assumption above is that the vast majority volume of EV owners have a dedicated charging spot they can connect to every day and night. While l, conceptually, think the idea of using cars for surge capacity is interesting, there are certainly concerns with how this works on so many levels. For example, do you pay to charge an empty car to full, they get to suck the power, then you pay again to charge it back up again? How about the millions of people that park on roads, in public garages, etc. The point is that any action taken has multiple reactions. As electric demand goes up, is everyone on board with more nuclear power to provide the demand? Solar (inefficient still), hydro (dams create problems), and wind (unreliable for on-demand) have no where near the capacity to support the possible future. Can one argue on any of these points? Sure can and probably have science behind it. But there is no scaling up currently in progress to meet the theorized future of us all electrically zipping along. And, to call out the storage problem, no scalable solution to recycle the millions of batteries already shot plus increased load from EVs is even in planning. Sure, ideas such as use batteries from cars at the end of life as power storage for homes is discussed. But I Imagine it will be a tough sell to get people to accept a mostly used item as their power source when they will have to shoulder the cost for hardware to use it, buy it, and then recycle it.

All the above is not from an anti-electric person. I just want realistic answers to all these issues before I contribute to a growing set of problems. Kind of a "devil I know" status right now, staying with ICE.

Definitely can't answer all of your questions, and they are good ones. Fun to think about, in my opinion. But I can swing some ideas at a few...

The street parking, IMO, is definitely the toughest one to tackle. In the UK, where street parking is incredibly common they've been looking at having these little pylon-esque things, similar to a parking meter really, that you can plug into. Coolest part, to me, is that they actually go underground when not in use. Obviously that has it's own run of problems wether it's weather related, or idiots putting things on top of them, but neat concept to not have tons of pylons everywhere. Though, I've never in my life heard complaints about parking meters be discussed in my life. I've also seen implementations using street light poles as well. But that too has problems to some degree. My parents house had no sidewalk, or street light, in front of it. Nor a garage. And that was common on their entire road, and the neighborhood really. I do have a guy up the road who has a Tesla, 3 Chevy Volts, and a 3500 dually in his house. He runs cords to the EVs outside, straight off the side of his house. Looks a bit nutty I suppose, but it works just fine. Another common solution being seen currently, for people who simply cannot charge at home, is they charge publicly. Being at the grocery store, public charging stations in town, work, etc. There are options, many of them also free at the time being too. But I do see that being somewhat of an infrastructure hurdle, especially in towns like say Boston.

Public garages is an easy one. They all have power, and parking spots.

Generating more electricity.. I'm personally on board with nuclear, but that is definitely a touchy subject across the board. And I think we should also be pushing for better tech and more focus regarding renewables. Even if they aren't the most efficient methods at this time.

As far as battery recycling scenarios, there are definitely a ton of companies racing to be the one to nail lithium ion recycling. And I'm sure someone will, because the amount of money they are going to make (not to mention the positive environmental impact as well) will be astonishing. There are already automakers paying companies to store their old batteries, in anticipation of future reuse. But yes, to date, that is something that is not solved perfectly. Or we just ship em to India, like the majority of our scrap, and let them pick the pennies out of it (kidding, though there is likely some reality there). I also think the used EV batteries in-home is slick, assuming the price is right. I'd love to have stored power at my house in case of an emergency. Obviously gotta pay to rig it up, but generators aren't free either.

I do want to add that I'm glad you asked all these things in your post, because to me, this is the most exciting part of the shift to increasing EV ownership. There is a ton of change that needs to be addressed if this takes off. And it is kind of fun to discuss.

 

[mcarey]

I'd be more interested in an EV that doesn't look like they are trying too hard to be ultra futuristic, I like how Audi has kept the Etrons looking basically like their ICE equivalents.

I've been saying it for years, but the lack of a grille really makes things look flat out weird. I get it from a functional point of view, as no airflow is needed and it's more aero friendly, but the grille is almost just part of standard car design. I do agree though. I wish they could just kinda cool it with the wackiness. Like even with the F150, do you really need a lightbar across the entire front? Though, I do see way too many guys bolting on lightbars to their vehicles nowadays anyways, so maybe there is some demand for that look.

 

[GTyankee]

Heck, the power company has already taken over homes with Solar Panels around San Diego

Solar started out as a great thing for home owners, they did not have to buy electricity from the power company.
NOW, the power company charges so much just to be connected to their line, that it almost is not worth it.

The only way to win with Solar now is to go completely OFF GRID

The San Diego Power Company has so much power from the Solar & Wind Farms, that they give excess power away to other States, rather than reduce the publics electric bill.

People ask me why i get irritated

I think
Pretty soon the States will be declaring Emanate Domain to get property so that there can be room for Charging Stations

 

[mcarey]

The San Diego Power Company has so much power from the Solar & Wind Farms, that they give excess power away to other States, rather than reduce the publics electric bill.

Sounds like more EVs will be no problem there!

That is frustrating though. My bills go up every year, regardless of my consumption, and the service seemingly only gets worse.

 

[GTyankee]

mcarey, the thing is, we have all this power from Solar Power & Wind Power, but there is no property available to have Charging Stations. So that means the State & the Power Company will have to partner up & force ppl to sell their land

 

[Evguy1]

So that means the State & the Power Company will have to partner up & force ppl to sell their land

Up here the charging stations are in Gas stations, Malls, doughnut shops, coffee shops, public parking lots, even along beach parking. I have not heard of anyone having to sell there property to install charging stations. Business see it as a draw for customers that have nothing else to do for 15 minutes or longer. On the way home tonight I noticed new charging stations going in at a gas station along the highway not that I would ever use them since it always cheaper to charge at home.

 

[tron67j]

I do see a big issue with the cars that are parked on the street like people who live in cities as you said. I hope someone has some sort of idea for that. For me it would be no issue as I could easily have chargers around my house and might incentivize me to get some solar panels on the garage roof. So would be an easy thing for me to switch to for the daily drivers. As others have said I'd be more interested in an EV that doesn't look like they are trying too hard to be ultra futuristic, I like how Audi has kept the Etrons looking basically like their ICE equivalents.

Those Audi Etrons are very cool!

 

[tron67j]

I

Up here the charging stations are in Gas stations, Malls, doughnut shops, coffee shops, public parking lots, even along beach parking. I have not heard of anyone having to sell there property to install charging stations. Business see it as a draw for customers that have nothing else to do for 15 minutes or longer. On the way home tonight I noticed new charging stations going in at a gas station along the highway not that I would ever use them since it always cheaper to charge at home.

I was reading about a Shell station in London that opened as more a destination than using the gas station model of hurry up, fill up, quick food that is no good for a body, and shoot out. Perhaps this makes long distance trips more about the trip than just "getting there". South of the Border rebirth!

 

[GTyankee]

I can see having charging stations at mall

They would get priority parking next to the Handicapped Parking
Usually someone going to the mall is going to be in there for an hour or more

Then they could bring back Drive In Theaters & every other row could have chargers

 

[Evguy1]

I can see having charging stations at mall

They would get priority parking next to the Handicapped Parking
Usually someone going to the mall is going to be in there for an hour or more

Yes typically mall charging stations are level 2 while the ones at the gas stations are level 3 which are the fast chargers. We usually take 15-20 minutes to fill up at a level 3 station but the new cars and stations do it much quicker.

 

[Evguy1]

I just found this tidbit online. I know other cars and stations are getting this fast as well.
The Tesla Supercharger network is a different beast. These are proprietary Tesla charging devices that can add up to 320kms (200 miles) of range in just 15 minutes. The Supercharger network is exclusive to Tesla owners – at least, for now – and the network stretches from coast to coast in Canada.