Bad lifter To end a bad summer

Your right, I can’t be 100 percent sure what it is until they tear into it. And I don’t know what caused it to fail yet but I will I update the post when I find out. I’m supposed to take it in Tuesday.

I hope it is just a one off for you and no damage or anything.

justintyme01 said:

Your right, I can’t be 100 percent sure what it is until they tear into it. And I don’t know what caused it to fail yet but I will I update the post when I find out. I’m supposed to take it in Tuesday.

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Hi justintyme01,

Sorry to hear of the trouble you are experiencing with your truck. If it would be of interest, we would be more than happy to have this documented and connect you with a case specialist for an additional layer of assistance as you work with your dealer. Please send us a PM to proceed in this manner.

Mark
Ram Social Care Specialist

justintyme01 said:

I’ve read a lot on here about bad lifters and other noises everyone’s truck makes but to top off a bad summer I end up with a bad lifter in my truck. I thought this issue was addressed by now. I only have 24,500 miles on my truck and it’s been exclusively maintained by the dealer.

I took a video of the cold start this morning and took the truck in. He confirmed that it sounded like a bad lifter and I’m supposed to drop it off next week but they might not have a loaner car for me.

I was hoping to hear from some of you that had this happen and hear what your experience was like during the whole process from the day you heard the noise until the warranty work was completed.

My truck is a 2018 that I bought new so I don’t see how any warranty work could be denied.

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Does yours sound like my truck?

WhiteStar said:

Does yours sound like my truck?

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Your ticking went away after a couple seconds from start up. Is that just an oil flow problem after sitting?

That's common valve train noise from sitting with modern synthetic. If it lasts longer you have an exhaust broken manifold bolt(generally).

Lifter failure is a little different metallic sound and will vary with engine RPM.

Haas said:

Your ticking went away after a couple seconds from start up. Is that just an oil flow problem after sitting?

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It's caused by poor machining tolerances that let the lifters bleed down. There should not be rattling when starting an engine. It isn't caused by using synthetic oil either. Having all that slack between the moving parts is what causes damage because they develop momentum before hitting each other instead of maintaining contact. Notwithstanding the valves are opening and closing out of sync until the lifter catches up. I'm sure that's good for emissions.


I just took this video of the loaner/rental truck the dealer gave me as mine is still at the dealership for the rattle. This truck has about 4000 miles on it. That's about how many mine had when I shot the video above.

The rental has been sitting overnight and is parked in the same spot. So all things are equal.
But this one doesn't rattle like a can of ball bearings.

I had my oil changed at the dealer (lease truck but I plan to buy it), and on rare occasion since then I will get the exact same start condition / sound as whitestar. I am thinking the oil they are using has big part in this. I'm in that catch 22. I like to have the vehicles serviced by the dealers during warranty period so as to off-set any "warranty" issue, i.e. if it was supposed to have part X inspected at XXXX miles and the dealer did not inspect when it was in for "service" then its there fault not mine and they fix it.

To boot, I quit doing oil changes over 10 years ago when it just was not longer cost effective. The time I spend on an oil change, picking up oil, returning used oil, cost of oil, etc. it was cheaper for my to have it done.....Particularly as it is not my favorite thing to do, and I usually end up with oil somewhere I did not want it, i.e. driveway or on me.

WhiteStar said:

Does yours sound like my truck?

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Yes it was very similar to that, it lasted about 1 minute the first time and about 20 seconds the second time but it isn’t consistent.

being common on these hemi engines does not mean it should do it. i have a 14 5.7 that i purchased with 67k miles on it. dealer maintained (so 5w20). i had a slight tick at start up thay would go away as it warmed up. i switched to Redline 5w30 and a royal purple 20820 filter. tick immediately went away at start up. after about 1400 miles the engine quieted down considerably. im about 7100 miles into that change (doing another change soon), still ZERO start up tick. my truck has say for 9.5 days at one point while i was on vacation, first start ZERO start up tick. others are seeing the same results.

is this all coincidence? you can keep drinking the dealers kool aid about it being normal. or be proactive yourself. so which one is it: the ticking motor is normal / better, or the non ticking motor is better?

I have a 2018 that I purchased in April 2018. 5.7l hemi. It's has a cold start tap on occasion especially after sitting a few days. Dealer handed me Star case S1209000017. Chrysler claims its air trapped in the MDS lifters. I think it's ********. My truck has only 2300 mi. It started the first week I had it. From my understanding and talking to others, they usually give you the run around and most dealers do nothing until the lifters and cam are destroyed. Owned a GC back in 2005 . Had nothing but problems. I swore off Chrysler and last April I figured I would give it another chance. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, Shame on me. It's been doing it once in a while since delivery. It FCA doesn't recognize and support this problem, I can absolutely state that this is the last Chrysler product I will ever own. It's ashame because I really like the truck. It's good looking and has a nice ride.

16RamHemi said:

being common on these hemi engines does not mean it

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16RamHemi said:

is this all coincidence? you can keep drinking the dealers kool aid about it being normal. or be proactive yourself. so which one is it: the ticking motor is normal / better, or the non ticking motor is better?

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Exactly!

I picked my truck up yesterday after they had it for 6 days saying "Unable to duplicate". I then asked to speak to the Service Manager who tried to tell me the noise was normal and proceeded to grab 3 sets of keys and told me to come with him out on the lot. He starts the first truck, no clatter. He then starts the 2nd truck, smooth no noise. He then starts a 3rd truck! Again smooth no lifter rattle. I look at him and said if mine sounded like these 3 trucks I wouldn't be here. All of the truck he started were 5th Gens. I wonder if these have better lifters than the Classics or 4th gens?

He then told me they repair 10 Hemi engines a week for lifter,cam failures! That would be about 500 engines a year at one dealer! And they have to use aftermarket lifters because of the national backorder.

So when I get in my truck to drive off and start it, the lifters rattle. Here's a video from today that I took after getting it back from the dealer yesterday.
How could they not duplicate this?!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTjiDtIIIZQ

NJRAMGUY said:

I have a 2018 that I purchased in April 2018. 5.7l hemi. It's has a cold start tap on occasion especially after sitting a few days. Dealer handed me Star case S1209000017. Chrysler claims its air trapped in the MDS lifters. I think it's ********. My truck has only 2300 mi. It started the first week I had it. From my understanding and talking to others, they usually give you the run around and most dealers do nothing until the lifters and cam are destroyed. Owned a GC back in 2005 . Had nothing but problems. I swore off Chrysler and last April I figured I would give it another chance. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, Shame on me. It's been doing it once in a while since delivery. It FCA doesn't recognize and support this problem, I can absolutely state that this is the last Chrysler product I will ever own. It's ashame because I really like the truck. It's good looking and has a nice ride.

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STAR Case Number: S1209000017
Release Date: 11/05/2012
Symptom/Vehicle Issue: Clatter / Tick Noise From Engine

Diagnosis:
If the customer complaint is loud clatter / ticking type noise after engine has not been started for several days, or noise is detected during PDI, there is a possibility that air has been trapped in the Hydraulic Lash Adjuster. Please follow these guidelines when evaluating engine noise related to lifters (HLAs) in Hemi engines

Hemi Lifter Purge Guideline
1. Warm engine to standard idle conditions.
2. Listen to the engine for 30 to 60 seconds with the hood up and the engine cover removed.
Note: Engine noise may be in the form of a clicking, chatter, or clattering noise. If noise is present, de-aeration of the lifters maybe required.
3. Run the engine between 2000 and 3000 RPM for three to five minutes.
4. Return the engine to standard idle speed for 30 to 60 seconds.
5. Evaluate noise if noise is present repeat the run an additional 4 cycles.
6. If noise is present, take the vehicle on a typical drive cycle.
Note: The typical drive cycle will be about 10-15 miles of combined highway and city driving.
Note: Avoid marshaling maneuvers (quick start /stop operation) during evaluation.

WoW, Spooky. This touches a tender nerve with me.

Before I begin ..............Just a cheap-o trial thing, put a Wix or Motorcraft oil filter on her. These are the two I know of that have good silicon anti drain back seals. If you already have one change it just in-case its defective.
Would it not be great if its only the oil not being held in the engine when shut down. Install, run it a while, let her sit and try again.

I don't want to be distasteful but my past and recent personal experience with dealership service has me never to darken their doors again. Warranty is one thing but if you are close to it expiring don't be surprised if you get stall tactics.
Like you said, how could they not duplicate that.


To date I am a multi-craft industrial maintenance technician. Sine my teens I have done my own auto repair work. On the job I am responsible for multi-million dollar equipment.

This is my lead into what I experienced recently alone. I got the P0741 is a diagnostic trouble code (DTC) for "Torque Converter Clutch Circuit Performance or Stuck Off".
Lots of times a filter service will fix this so I got lazy ans decided to let MOPAR service handle it while I took a lady to lunch.. I don't know what they did but they did not pull the pan and told me I need to replace the trans.

No thanks and I decided to get a 2nd opinion before looking into to suing them, and they called saying the same thing wanting to know right now so they could either replace the pan or continue. I declined.
I crawled back under there and the pan had not been dropped. Folks I paint stick marked things first.

Good Bye MOPAR dealer service. I was contacted by a customer care after complaining and told them they need to perform sting operation and not to contact me again.

The trans is still running strong, no more codes, the NAG1 is known for doing this occasionally, mostly when pulling a long incline right before a lock/unlock when desired slip and actual are more than 255rpm for a given time.

Good Luck

WhiteStar, That's exactly what my truck is doing but only on occasion. I changed to synthetic right after break in. I am using a WIX filter. I did discover one thing that seems to help. I don't know if it is ultimately good for the engine but either is the rattle. I rev up to 2500-3000 rpms before shutting off and there is no rattle at startup. Even after 5 days. I do think you are onto something with the gen 5s. Time will tell.

WhiteStar, That's exactly what my truck is doing but only on occasion. I changed to synthetic right after break in. I am using a WIX filter. I did discover one thing that seems to help. I don't know if it is ultimately good for the engine but either is the rattle. I rev up to 2500-3000 rpms before shutting off and there is no rattle at startup. Even after 5 days. I do think you are onto something with the gen 5s. Time will tell.

try the royal purple 20820 (big one) oil filter. my truck has sat 9.5 days straight. first start up was peefect. no noise. filter is kinda hard to find and pricey compared to others. but worth it imo.

NJRAMGUY said:

WhiteStar, That's exactly what my truck is doing but only on occasion. I changed to synthetic right after break in. I am using a WIX filter. I did discover one thing that seems to help. I don't know if it is ultimately good for the engine but either is the rattle. I rev up to 2500-3000 rpms before shutting off and there is no rattle at startup. Even after 5 days. I do think you are onto something with the gen 5s. Time will tell.

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I'll have to try that. Did they expect you to do the Star case S1209000017? If air is trapped in a lifter where there should be oil that sounds like a design defect to me.

WhiteStar said:

I'll have to try that. Did they expect you to do the Star case S1209000017? If air is trapped in a lifter where there should be oil that sounds like a design defect to me.

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Exactly!! What other engines have air that gets trapped in a lifter? None that I've ever heard of. That sounds like an excuse that went to all dealers, to tell their customers, so that they can buy time.

NJRAMGUY said:

WhiteStar, That's exactly what my truck is doing but only on occasion. I changed to synthetic right after break in. I am using a WIX filter. I did discover one thing that seems to help. I don't know if it is ultimately good for the engine but either is the rattle. I rev up to 2500-3000 rpms before shutting off and there is no rattle at startup. Even after 5 days. I do think you are onto something with the gen 5s. Time will tell.

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The 5th Gen rental they gave me never did it for the 6 days I had it.
This was the first of the 3 trucks the service manager started to try and prove that "they all do it".