8 speed transmission fluid

[texasfan88]

M truck has the 8 speed auto and although Mopar says the fluid is "lifetime" and ZF says you should change it every 50,000-75,000 miles, I was wondering which one to go by. I currently have 60,000 miles on my truck, have never towed anything with it and keep up with other maintenance on it religiously. Because of this, is it even necessary for me to think about changing out the transmission fluid? The process seems extremely expensive and since I'm not going to keep the truck forever and the transmission has no issues whatsoever, I'm just trying to weigh out the cost and the benefits.

 

[grizzstang]

I am going to go off what ZF recommends as they built it. IMO there is no such thing as a lifetime fluid.

FCA just doesn't care if your trans eats itself when you are outside of the warranty period.

That being said if you plan on dumping the truck before the trans dies then I guess you can save that money.

 

[bobeast]

I intend to change mine when the time comes. "You took to much care of your truck"; said no-one ever.

 

[texasfan88]

Thanks for the responses. Perhaps what I'll do is just take care of it like I always do and then possibly look into what it would cost to use the Valvoline ATF maxlife fluid, which I hear meets the same requirements as the ZF8 Lifeguard for a fraction of the cost, if I start experiencing any issues.

 

[16RamHemi]

I have spoken with 2 very knowledgeable people about these transmissions. Jay Greene and Bill at Paramount performance. Both said they now recommend everyone to use the Mopar fluid.

If I were at 60k and was not planning to own the truck beyond 100k and didn't tow or beat the trans, I would ride it out. It's really not that hard or expensive if you do it yourself. Just a certain procedure that needs to be followed.

Warning to anyone doing this: be sure to measure the clearance between the exhaust and pan. Some have plenty of room, and some are very tight (mine). I nearly couldn't get stock pan out.

 

[Burla]

The spec reads the cSt must be below 6.4 and not shear down which is why they use pao fluid. Maxlife cSt starts 5.91 and will even shear lower as it isn't pao. If you opt for maxlife, id do what Sean from his eco diesel channel did, shorten future intervals.

 

[Burla]

Redliine d6 cSt stays at 6.1 and is pao based

 

[Wild one]

Redliine d6 cSt stays at 6.1 and is pao based

The bigger issue with using the non-Mopar fluids are the transmissions are exhibiting more slip Burla.Tuners are starting to find this out when the 8 speeds are tuned.If it was me,i'd suck it up and buy the Mopar fluid,it's a short term pain,compared to having to replace the tranny if it cooks itself to death.The damn things aren't all that cheap,i speak from s'perience,lol.

 

[joshuaeb09]

The bigger issue with using the non-Mopar fluids are the transmissions are exhibiting more slip Burla.Tuners are starting to find this out when the 8 speeds are tuned.If it was me,i'd suck it up and buy the Mopar fluid,it's a short term pain,compared to having to replace the tranny if it cooks itself to death.The damn things aren't all that cheap,i speak from s'perience,lol.

I noticed that trend too and since I'm running tranny tunes on both I'll probably use Ravenol or the ZF fluid when it comes to doing mine... screw paying the Mopar markup on the same damn thing.

 

[texasfan88]

Ok wow, so I guess I really overestimated how much this costs. I was reading figures of upwards of $1000 or more but perhaps that's what the dealer charges. All the parts I would need would be about $350 in total, which is not that bad for something that doesn't need to be done all that often, if I do decide to do it. The only downside is that I have no way to get my truck on a level surface and so I have no choice but to take it to a shop. I'll just ask around to see what they would charge in labor costs to have it done. I just saw BoostedMotorsport's video on this and, assuming that it was the first time he changed the transmission fluid in that truck, that fluid still looked really good even after 90,000 miles on it.

 

[Wild one]

Ok wow, so I guess I really overestimated how much this costs. I was reading figures of upwards of $1000 or more but perhaps that's what the dealer charges. All the parts I would need would be about $350 in total, which is not that bad for something that doesn't need to be done all that often, if I do decide to do it. The only downside is that I have no way to get my truck on a level surface and so I have no choice but to take it to a shop. I'll just ask around to see what they would charge in labor costs to have it done. I just saw BoostedMotorsport's video on this and, assuming that it was the first time he changed the transmission fluid in that truck, that fluid still looked really good even after 90,000 miles on it.

John/Boosted missed one important point in his video.You have to level the transmissions pan rail to get an accurate read on the tranny fluids level after the change.To level the tranny pan rail entails jacking the rear of the truck up in the air a fair ways,other then that Johns video is very good.

Read the very first highlighted paragraph.These are the instructions that came with my brand new 8 speed when I had to replace it,and are the correct instructions for the procedure.

https://www.ramforum.com/threads/2017-8-speed-transmission.143008/page-3#post-2029422

 

[16RamHemi]

So i was able to get my truck into the shop last night. I serviced my trans last summer. I jacked the rear end up to level the trans. I followed the recommended procedure. I then drove the truck to get it up to the 180 or so to open the bypass valve. then rechecked. I have been experiencing a low rpm slip in 2nd and 3rd gear. I have never had any temp issues or other issues with the trans. I constantly watch my temps. trans never got over 192. A couple weeks ago i was able to get into the shop to check my level. Turns out i was low. For some reason, i thought i was overfilled. I did not have extra fluid with me. So last night was able to fill up my trans where it needed to be. I also added a little extra (at the recommendation of Bill @ Paramount). Now driving my truck the low rpm slip is much much less. It is still there under some situations (low rpm with a hill). But much better. Time will tell if any damage was done.

@Wild one regarding the "more slip" with other fluids.....do you think thats what im seeing? Im willing to swap back. Things are really adding up to use the mopar fluid. If slip is being seen with other fluids, and pros in the industry and recommending going back to mopar, and im experiencing some slip....writing is kinda on the wall to go back to the mopar fluid. You may not recall, but you have replied to many of my comments and threads of this issue i have been seeing. Fluid is cheaper than a trans.

One last question....what do you think my odds are that i did any damage running low for nearly 7 months?

 

[texasfan88]

Ok so, I just got back from the local mechanic shop to get an accurate estimate on a transmission fluid and filter change service and this what they came back with. The cost of the parts (pan and filter assembly and 9 quarts of ATF fluid) + labor, taxes, and shop fees would be right at $587.28 OTD. From the pricing I've seen on Amazon, I don't think I would be saving that much money if I purchased the parts myself and then just paid the shop for labor charges, especially since I am insistent on using strictly OEM spec parts. They also recommend, for most transmissions, 30,000 mile service intervals. However because the 8 speed is unique, a 60,000 mile service interval is recommended. The only thing I'm concerned with is that this shop uses a brand of ATF fluid called Motul. I've personally never heard of this brand but the guy I was talking to said that it meets the required specs for ZF and FCA and there is some part number to verify this. Does anyone know where to find and verify this information? It's about $10 a quart cheaper than the ZF fluid and as long as it meets all the required specifications, that's all that matters but I'd like to be certain and not put in something that's going to destroy my transmission later on. I certainly don't mind paying an extra $90 or so for the ZF fluid to be absolutely certain that I'm using the correct stuff. Lol to be honest with all of you, all of this concern is making me wonder if changing out the fluid is even worth it.

 

[Gohawks]

I can't speak about Motul and automobile transmission fluids, but Motul is huge and highly respected in the motorcycle industry.

 

[16RamHemi]

Ok so, I just got back from the local mechanic shop to get an accurate estimate on a transmission fluid and filter change service and this what they came back with. The cost of the parts (pan and filter assembly and 9 quarts of ATF fluid) + labor, taxes, and shop fees would be right at $587.28 OTD. From the pricing I've seen on Amazon, I don't think I would be saving that much money if I purchased the parts myself and then just paid the shop for labor charges, especially since I am insistent on using strictly OEM spec parts. They also recommend, for most transmissions, 30,000 mile service intervals. However because the 8 speed is unique, a 60,000 mile service interval is recommended. The only thing I'm concerned with is that this shop uses a brand of ATF fluid called Motul. I've personally never heard of this brand but the guy I was talking to said that it meets the required specs for ZF and FCA and there is some part number to verify this. Does anyone know where to find and verify this information? It's about $10 a quart cheaper than the ZF fluid and as long as it meets all the required specifications, that's all that matters but I'd like to be certain and not put in something that's going to destroy my transmission later on. I certainly don't mind paying an extra $90 or so for the ZF fluid to be absolutely certain that I'm using the correct stuff. Lol to be honest with all of you, all of this concern is making me wonder if changing out the fluid is even worth it.

If you have read all prior posts, you would see that pros involved with tuning and building these transmissions are recommending customers to go back to the zf8 fluid. Take that for what it's worth. Not worth the $90 imo. I plan on draining out the redline d6 I put in and put zf8 back in. As I have a little slip and others have noticed some slip with other compatible fluids.

Being worth it imo comes down to how long you plan on keeping it and what the history is. That price isn't bad IF it is done correctly (they properly level the trans and go through the correct procedures). So do you trust them? Can you watch?

 

[chrisbh17]

Ok so, I just got back from the local mechanic shop to get an accurate estimate on a transmission fluid and filter change service and this what they came back with. The cost of the parts (pan and filter assembly and 9 quarts of ATF fluid) + labor, taxes, and shop fees would be right at $587.28 OTD. From the pricing I've seen on Amazon, I don't think I would be saving that much money if I purchased the parts myself and then just paid the shop for labor charges, especially since I am insistent on using strictly OEM spec parts. They also recommend, for most transmissions, 30,000 mile service intervals. However because the 8 speed is unique, a 60,000 mile service interval is recommended. The only thing I'm concerned with is that this shop uses a brand of ATF fluid called Motul. I've personally never heard of this brand but the guy I was talking to said that it meets the required specs for ZF and FCA and there is some part number to verify this. Does anyone know where to find and verify this information? It's about $10 a quart cheaper than the ZF fluid and as long as it meets all the required specifications, that's all that matters but I'd like to be certain and not put in something that's going to destroy my transmission later on. I certainly don't mind paying an extra $90 or so for the ZF fluid to be absolutely certain that I'm using the correct stuff. Lol to be honest with all of you, all of this concern is making me wonder if changing out the fluid is even worth it.

Motul is actually a pretty well known and well regarded brand.

However, I would find out exactly what Motul product they are using. This one (https://d23zpyj32c5wn3.cloudfront.net/images/product_descriptions/technical_data_sheets/48940/ATF_VI_(GB).pdf?1571835099) seems to be the only one with the Lifegard 8 approval (8=8 speed, Lifegard is ZF's genuine fluid)

Also make 100% sure they are following the factory drain/fill procedure because its not a simple drain and refill.

Personally, I would spend the extra $$$ and get the Mopar fluid. If thats a DEALER charging ~$600 its actually not horrible, but the fact they are using Motul indicates its not a dealer. But at every 60K miles, I dont see much worry in spending extra to get the genuine fluid. Its not like you will dump it again in a year. In fact I kinda sorta wonder if, after the initial drain/refill, further drain/refills are even necessary, or at least if you can stretch it out for more mileage before the next one.

 

[texasfan88]

Motul is actually a pretty well known and well regarded brand.

However, I would find out exactly what Motul product they are using. This one (https://d23zpyj32c5wn3.cloudfront.net/images/product_descriptions/technical_data_sheets/48940/ATF_VI_(GB).pdf?1571835099) seems to be the only one with the Lifegard 8 approval (8=8 speed, Lifegard is ZF's genuine fluid)

Also make 100% sure they are following the factory drain/fill procedure because its not a simple drain and refill.

Personally, I would spend the extra $$$ and get the Mopar fluid. If thats a DEALER charging ~$600 its actually not horrible, but the fact they are using Motul indicates its not a dealer. But at every 60K miles, I dont see much worry in spending extra to get the genuine fluid. Its not like you will dump it again in a year. In fact I kinda sorta wonder if, after the initial drain/refill, further drain/refills are even necessary, or at least if you can stretch it out for more mileage before the next one.

Thanks! Currently I'm in no major hurry to get this done so I won't even really worry about it until I hit around 75,000 miles or so (currently at about 60,000) and I definitely be sure to verify that everything is good. I think all of us here know that just because a shop recommends a service interval at a certain mileage, doesn't necessarily mean that it absolutely has to be done at that time. It all depends on how the vehicle is used.

 

[chrisbh17]

Thanks! Currently I'm in no major hurry to get this done so I won't even really worry about it until I hit around 75,000 miles or so (currently at about 60,000) and I definitely be sure to verify that everything is good. I think all of us here know that just because a shop recommends a service interval at a certain mileage, doesn't necessarily mean that it absolutely has to be done at that time. It all depends on how the vehicle is used.

I have MaxCare Lifetime on my truck and am conflicted about the trans fluid. But if I were to replace the fluid (or pay to have it replaced), 60K would be the number no matter how I drove it.

ZF makes the trans (and the fluid) and they recommend 60K. There is no severe vs normal service interval, they just say 60K. I believe them a whole lot more than I believe FCA, but in my case *technically* ever changing the trans fluid could be seen as a reason to void my MaxCare warranty.

I have to talk it over with my dealer first, to see what they think about Lifetime warranty vs fluids that are "lifetime".

 

[texasfan88]

If you have read all prior posts, you would see that pros involved with tuning and building these transmissions are recommending customers to go back to the zf8 fluid. Take that for what it's worth. Not worth the $90 imo. I plan on draining out the redline d6 I put in and put zf8 back in. As I have a little slip and others have noticed some slip with other compatible fluids.

Being worth it imo comes down to how long you plan on keeping it and what the history is. That price isn't bad IF it is done correctly (they properly level the trans and go through the correct procedures). So do you trust them? Can you watch?

I do trust them but I didn't think to ask if I can watch to verify they're doing is correct. I'm in no hurry to get this done at the moment so I'll be sure to ask them if I can watch them perform the procedure when the time comes. If I'm paying nearly $600 for something, I have absolutely zero problem with asking them this and if they say no, I'll just go somewhere else. The good thing that the mechanic told me, however, is that the service is backed up by a $4000 parts and service guarantee so IF anything goes wrong after they change out the fluid and filter, I pretty much have nothing to worry about.

 

[QwikKota]

I have MaxCare Lifetime on my truck and am conflicted about the trans fluid. But if I were to replace the fluid (or pay to have it replaced), 60K would be the number no matter how I drove it.

ZF makes the trans (and the fluid) and they recommend 60K. There is no severe vs normal service interval, they just say 60K. I believe them a whole lot more than I believe FCA, but in my case *technically* ever changing the trans fluid could be seen as a reason to void my MaxCare warranty.

I have to talk it over with my dealer first, to see what they think about Lifetime warranty vs fluids that are "lifetime".

FCA is not going to void your warranty if you get it done at the dealer. If you do it elsewhere and they us Mopar fluid and OEM parts, how would they know?

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