Blackstone - used oil analysis

[Replacement]

I learned with my ecoboost quality oil was required. But honestly didn't spend a lot of time studying UOAs and then recent years the formulations were changing all the time. So i just stuck with high quality brands. Not much effort beyond that.

I don't run long intervals and don't drive so many miles a year requiring many oil changes.

If i need to save money this item isn't the knob for me. But i don't disagree that there are other good options and likely at a discount comparatively.

But appreciate the comments.

 

[Burla]

I learned with my ecoboost quality oil was required. But honestly didn't spend a lot of time studying UOAs and then recent years the formulations were changing all the time. So i just stuck with high quality brands. Not much effort beyond that.

I don't run long intervals and don't drive so many miles a year requiring many oil changes.

If i need to save money this item isn't the knob for me. But i don't disagree that there are other good options and likely at a discount comparatively.

But appreciate the comments.

So US oils went to spec SP and SQ, while euro oils stayed with SN+, so the US oils main concern is thin as those specs require pizthin oil, whereas sn+ has the same di protection from CA but also allows the oil to be thicker. So look at euro's, tbh that m1 esp 0w30 is hard to beat. Redline imo might be slightly better with those esters, but it would hurt to change that out early for me anyhow, when the most important thing is to have clean oil with di's. So m1 esp 0w30 on a short interval is a pretty good strategy for a di. gl

 

[TC]

Last two runs were the same oil or was that a mis type? 0w30 last time?

That is hella interesting 3 runs vrp and you can see the increased wear alum and copper with that product.

Interesting the lowest iron wear was the run after the biotech but then went back, and not the current biotech run. Possible theory that run still had some plating going on from the biotech run, but the actual biotech run didn't present because it takes time to plate, by the third vrp run "perhaps" the plate from the biotech run was washed off. Yes this would be not even a theory but a possible theory, as it does make sense with the current knowledge in syn thread. Of course it could mean nothing, but awful interesting that 4 iron wear. I cant wait to see the 0w30 SC as I believe it to have esters like biotech, lets see how iron wear is effected, maybe if will take another run after, so if you are going to keep running uoa's, you might want to commit to the 0w30 SC for at least 2 runs. Best oil on paper we know of that 0w30 SC.


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One variable I failed to mention, the first run on HPL PCMO, used Fram FE2, second run on HPL PCMO used Fram XG10060...last two runs on report.

 

[JHoward]

One variable I failed to mention, the first run on HPL PCMO, used Fram FE2, second run on HPL PCMO used Fram XG10060...last two runs on report.

Imho, that ain't gonna matter ... an oil filter trapping particulates vs the oil itself in the sump where the sample is taken? ... matters with an oil report, unless your sample is directly from the oil filter ... ?

 

[JHoward]

... in other words, an oil sample taken from the sump on an oil drain isn't going to show the same results? as to what may have been trapped in the oil filter, so an oil report is based on the sample taken from the "oil pan" during the oci drain ...

Absolutely, a good idea to use a quality top notch oil filter, but an sample collected from sump is what actually sets the wear numbers ...?

I tend overthink things ...

 

[Hemi395]

Not the Ram but this is the Grand Cherokee's first UOA. Its not going through coolant from what I can tell and its running perfect. Coolant isn't milky and neither is the oil.

Looking to get some opinions on this before I get too upset.....

 

[Burla]

How smart it was to get a uoa, and this is why you get uao's, sorry to hear it but better to know on this one.

test the exhaust gasses, easier then compression checks.

Easy Test for Blown Head Gasket

A quick easy way to determine if you have a blown head gasket using the BT500 Block Test kit.

youtu.be

 

[Burla]

Bro, only 50k miles on that?

 

[Hemi395]

Bro, only 50k miles on that?

yup, almost 52k now...

 

[06 Dodge]

yup, almost 52k now...

I use 2 different Archoil additives in my fuel and neither one rised the potassium levels in my oil, I list all fuel additive when I send in my UOA samples, my suggestion is to use a different/better oil lab like Polaris labs, they are a spin off from Cummins/Fleetguard, both Amsoil and Fleetguard UOA kits go to Polaris labs for testing and they cost less than Blackstone who still uses older test equipment... JMHO

 

[Different Drummer]

Not the Ram but this is the Grand Cherokee's first UOA. Its not going through coolant from what I can tell and its running perfect. Coolant isn't milky and neither is the oil.

Looking to get some opinions on this before I get too upset.....

Don't know if this will give you any insight but I will offer it up.
My 2017 RAM has the same engine as your jeep. Mine is what is often referred to as the PUG or second generation of the Pentastar. I am guessing that yours is also as I see you are using the Jeep recommended 0W-20 oil.
I used 5W-20 pure synthetic initially ( recommended by owners manual ) and have flip flopped a couple of changes with 5W-30 full synthetic. I now have 92,000 miles on the truck with 5,000 miles on the present oil. Just returned from a winter in Florida. Miles are pretty much all highway. Truck is running fine with all engine parameters remaining unchanged. i.e. coolant temp., oil temp and pressure. Mileage remains good @ 24-25 MPG. ( 2 wheel drive with 3.21 gears) Engine is quiet and exhaust appears normal.
I get UOA every other oil changed. UOA averages about every 10,000 miles.
The narrative on my UOA ( also Blackstone) reads almost identical to yours with the exception that my sodium was coming in high and my potassium is always low or normal. Though the sodium was not as excessively over like you potassium is. Wear metals are always good on the low side. My sodium actually started to come down a little on the last UOA. Changing the oil / filter at or just under 5,000 mile intervals combined with the otherwise good UOA has kept me from going into a panic over the high sodium.
I am more suspicious of the o-ring seals where the oil cooler marries to the coolant system in the design of the Pentastar oil cooler than I am of a head gasket. You have the same oil cooler set up on your Pentastar powered jeep. Initially I could not discern any change in coolant level. Recently I have noticed a slightly lower level. I have never added coolant.
I will soon be looking at a coolant change and will most likely investigate the oil cooler & coolant interface at that time.
I do like the device Burla posted. Looks like a worthwhile test to perform. I may give it a go if I can locate the kit.
Good luck. I hope your high potassium turns out to be a result of something not too consequential.

 

[Burla]

That is a great post, my early thought as well but I did not know the pentastars engine at all. Corey isn't seeing exhaust gases, so it would be great if it was something else.

 

[Hemi395]

Don't know if this will give you any insight but I will offer it up.
My 2017 RAM has the same engine as your jeep. Mine is what is often referred to as the PUG or second generation of the Pentastar. I am guessing that yours is also as I see you are using the Jeep recommended 0W-20 oil.
I used 5W-20 pure synthetic initially ( recommended by owners manual ) and have flip flopped a couple of changes with 5W-30 full synthetic. I now have 92,000 miles on the truck with 5,000 miles on the present oil. Just returned from a winter in Florida. Miles are pretty much all highway. Truck is running fine with all engine parameters remaining unchanged. i.e. coolant temp., oil temp and pressure. Mileage remains good @ 24-25 MPG. ( 2 wheel drive with 3.21 gears) Engine is quiet and exhaust appears normal.
I get UOA every other oil changed. UOA averages about every 10,000 miles.
The narrative on my UOA ( also Blackstone) reads almost identical to yours with the exception that my sodium was coming in high and my potassium is always low or normal. Though the sodium was not as excessively over like you potassium is. Wear metals are always good on the low side. My sodium actually started to come down a little on the last UOA. Changing the oil / filter at or just under 5,000 mile intervals combined with the otherwise good UOA has kept me from going into a panic over the high sodium.
I am more suspicious of the o-ring seals where the oil cooler marries to the coolant system in the design of the Pentastar oil cooler than I am of a head gasket. You have the same oil cooler set up on your Pentastar powered jeep. Initially I could not discern any change in coolant level. Recently I have noticed a slightly lower level. I have never added coolant.
I will soon be looking at a coolant change and will most likely investigate the oil cooler & coolant interface at that time.
I do like the device Burla posted. Looks like a worthwhile test to perform. I may give it a go if I can locate the kit.
Good luck. I hope your high potassium turns out to be a result of something not too consequential.

Wow great info and thank you for posting!

So you're thinking its the o rings where the oil cooler mates to the block that are seeping coolant into the oil? Given I'm not seeing any evidence of a head gasket leak, this really seems like it could be the issue....

 

[Different Drummer]

That is a great post, my early thought as well but I did not know the pentastars engine at all. Corey isn't seeing exhaust gases, so it would be great if it was something else.

How are your wife and the Cross getting along. I am still looking for something that sits higher than the Admiral's Prius Prime but I also need to be able to get my long legs into it.

 

[Burla]

How are your wife and the Cross getting along. I am still looking for something that sits higher than the Admiral's Prius Prime but I also need to be able to get my long legs into it.

I like it a lot more than I thought to be honest, to my utter surprise I am knocking on the door of 40 mpg's, I'm sure aided by my wife's commute which is a 50mph highway and not a freeway or city. If there is a knock it is the cvt, but it is actually very easy to service. The only other thing is when the seats fold down you cant lay down like the old rav 4, but they are taking that out of vehicles for some reason. I have used this plenty in the rav 4. The other thing is not very powerful, but my guess this is good for the cvt and mpg's and I'm 60 now so my glory days are long gone, I'm a putter now. I didnt look at the entire field as it wasn't for me but the wife and she had a short list as in 2, either suburu or Toyota. I looked at a couple others only to guide her away from to get her to understand di turbo is no good. I am 6'4 with a bad back and long legs, by far the best aspect of the cross is comfortable for me, I would highly suggest a long test drive if you are having concerns. IMO the most comfortable of every car I tested in this process.

 

[Different Drummer]

Wow great info and thank you for posting!

So you're thinking its the o rings where the oil cooler mates to the block that are seeping coolant into the oil? Given I'm not seeing any evidence of a head gasket leak, this really seems like it could be the issue....

Well, that is what I have been thinking. There also seems to be an issue on the Pentastar with the oil filter housing cracking and leaking oil. However, I think that issue results in an external leak of oil into the valley where the actual cooler / filter housing assembly resides. Your and my potential issue, if an issue at all is allowing coolant to enter the oiling system. One area where the two systems come in close proximity to each other is the oil cooler. Our coolers utilize liquid ( the engine coolant) to transfer heat as opposed to air flow like a cooler installed in front of a radiator.
I have not studied the system in depth and along with it being too cold and me being too old it will probably be a while before I crawl under the hood and start turning wrenches. Because I finally saw a loss of coolant the issue will get closer to the top of my priority list.
You are using Blackstone so you probably get the newsletter that they send out via email. A couple of months ago one of their employees had the same issue with a UOA on his girlfriends car. ( Maybe it was his, I don't remember) He was addressing the issue by doing shorter mileage intervals on the oil changes. Pretty much what I have been doing.
I do like that kit Burla posted. I hesitate to get it and have another use just once item to clutter up my tool box! LOL

 

[Burla]

Yeah Corey get your RAM on report of the month.

 

[Different Drummer]

I like it a lot more than I thought to be honest, to my utter surprise I am knocking on the door of 40 mpg's, I'm sure aided by my wife's commute which is a 50mph highway and not a freeway or city. If there is a knock it is the cvt, but it is actually very easy to service. The only other thing is when the seats fold down you cant lay down like the old rav 4, but they are taking that out of vehicles for some reason. I have used this plenty in the rav 4. The other thing is not very powerful, but my guess this is good for the cvt and mpg's and I'm 60 now so my glory days are long gone, I'm a putter now. I didnt look at the entire field as it wasn't for me but the wife and she had a short list as in 2, either suburu or Toyota. I looked at a couple others only to guide her away from to get her to understand di turbo is no good. I am 6'4 with a bad back and long legs, by far the best aspect of the cross is comfortable for me, I would highly suggest a long test drive if you are having concerns. IMO the most comfortable of every car I tested in this process.

Don't want to hijack the thread but have a couple of comments.
I am 6'2" but most of that is legs. ( short torso). My problem is not necessarily the leg room in regards to extension but rather the way my right leg leans or flops to the right and hits the console. The contact point is right on the shin bone and after a very short time it gets quite uncomfortable. Seems like every car manufacturer now puts that full length floor console in their vehicles. Oddly, the Prius does not have it and I am reasonably comfortable in regards to the long leg problem.
I know from your previous posts that you are not a fan of CVT. Neither am I. Having said that I did quite a bit of research on the CVT that Toyota uses in the EV and HEV vehicles they produce. I believe it is different than the CVT in the IC only model. I am pretty impressed with the design. Additionally I have experience with it driving the Admiral's Prius Prime and that experience reinforces what I have researched. I have no interest in a pure EV but the HEV Prius has been an absolute reliable and trouble free vehicle. It is perfect for what she needs and believe it or not we only fuel it twice a year. One fill up in late June and one fill up in late November. In fact one of my worries is the fuel going bad so I always add some stabilizer. I actually enjoy driving it! We ( her and I ) just wish it was not so low to the ground. Also, road noise seems excessive, but I seem to hear that about many of Toyota's vehicles.
I believe it is the Mazda CX-50 HEV that uses the Entire Toyota drive train. I am trying to locate one to try on. Also still trying to find a cross to try on.

 

[tron67j]

Just got my analysis back, a bit nervous on this one. Should next change include one quart of Redline now? And stick with 0w-40? Think not, but not sure what to use, thoughts?

 

[Hootbro]

Just got my analysis back, a bit nervous on this one. Should next change include one quart of Redline now? And stick with 0w-40? Think not, but not sure what to use, thoughts?View attachment 583444

Something is wearing there. You have a lot of idle hours possibly?