Blackstone zf8 fluid analysis at 160K miles

[stenerson]

I posted a couple of threads last fall mostly for advice regarding the zf8 fluid change on my 2018 Ram 1500 3.6 4x4. (thanks for helpful tips). I promised I'd send the used fluid for testing analysis to see how ugly it would be at this high mileage. Just for context I had a relatively gentle 160K miles, no towing, very little city driving. (I'm at 172K now, I replaced with Amsoil SS fuel efficient ATF) Here's an image of the blackstone report.

 

[Burla]

Big wow, thanks for doing this and sharing this. You can compare your report to others at BITOG.

There is an example over there of a transmission first oil change was at 450k miles or something like that.

 

[stenerson]

There is an example over there of a transmission first oil change was at 450k miles or something like that.

Dang! And I thought I was bad. LOL!

 

[Burla]

Dang! And I thought I was bad. LOL!

You will like this one, 40k interval in same trans.

Mind you that is severe duty.

.

 

[TC]

Thank you for posting your UOA for high mileage OE tranny fluid. I've been curious as to how long the fluid is "good". Changed mine at 142K over a year ago, saved a sample, may as well send it in and post back with results.

 

[stenerson]

Thank you for posting your UOA for high mileage OE tranny fluid. I've been curious as to how long the fluid is "good". Changed mine at 142K over a year ago, saved a sample, may as well send it in and post back with results.

I saved mine from last fall and finally sent it in. I did the drops on a napkin test I've seen online that test if fluid is burnt. It was unburnt and clean.
Chris Fix testing on Napkin

 

[Burla]

I saved mine from last fall and finally sent it in. I did the drops on a napkin test I've seen online that test if fluid is burnt. It was unburnt and clean.
Chris Fix testing on Napkin

He is right about smell, if it smells burnt you are in trouble. But many manu's including ram are now using black clutch plates, so even after 12k miles and one year transmission fluid can now be black, but totally fine. In fact it can be black but have that new strong sulfur new smell.

 

[stenerson]

He is right about smell, if it smells burnt you are in trouble. But many manu's including ram are now using black clutch plates, so even after 12k miles and one year transmission fluid can now be black, but totally fine. In fact it can be black but have that new strong sulfur new smell.

I was surprised at how relatively odor free that zf8 lifeguard fluid is. Unlike the typical red hydraulic ATF fluids.

 

[QwikKota]

That's insane.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Who knew that lube for lifetime didn't define the meaning of "lifetime".

After 40 years in technical biz, I've found it to mean "for the life of the warranty period."

 

[andymax]

Back around 2019 or so I changed the fluid in the ZF 8speed in my Jeep Grand Cherokee ecodiesel. Had 166K miles at the time. Sent it in and got very similar results, which surprised me at the time. I think I posted the Blackstone analysis on an Ecodiesel forum back then, I'll have to see if I still have it

Anyway, this gives me even greater confidence in these ZF's. My current 2019 Hemi Ram has 173K miles and I've changed the fluid only once. Probably time to order a new filter from PPE.

 

[Slinge]

Curious if you also changed pan and filter ?
If not...makes me think maybe I'll go the easier road and just do a drain and fill !

 

[06 Dodge]

If the claims that the trans fluid is good for 100K or more then why did ZF tell/teach Ram techs when learning about their trans that the fluid should be changed every 60K?

 

[Jeepwalker]

If a guy changed it once, say at 80k, and then again at, say, 175k miles, that means about 1/3 of the fluid that wasn't removed initially will have 175k miles. Fluid which was left over after the initial 'Typical' drop-pan-&-new-filter change.

It's good to know the results at high mileage

Thanks!

 

[Jeepwalker]

On my vehicles which have a dipstick & fill-tube, I usually pump all the old fluid out of the torque converter during tranny fluid changes ..till it runs clear (100% new fluid). Not so easy on the ZF w/o a machine.

But the analysis shows it's probably just fine to do the easier and safer pan-drop method.

 

[EdGs]

Who knew that lube for lifetime didn't define the meaning of "lifetime".

After 40 years in technical biz, I've found it to mean "for the life of the warranty period."

When the trans fails, it's "lifetime" is up.

 

[andymax]

Curious if you also changed pan and filter ?
If not...makes me think maybe I'll go the easier road and just do a drain and fill !

Yes, Ive never done a drain and fill. This hemi is the first for me with the PPE replaceable filter so I'll be doing this relatively soon.

 

[stenerson]

Who knew that lube for lifetime didn't define the meaning of "lifetime".

After 40 years in technical biz, I've found it to mean "for the life of the warranty."

It's a numbers game. The average light duty pickup truck in the US is driven approximately only 12,200 miles per year.
IMHO if you don't tow with these trucks most will easily make it to 200K plus without having to fuss with changing fluids. I've heard mopar mechanics say that with the zf trannys there's been a big reduction in transmission work. They are pretty reliable.

 

[Wild one]

It's a numbers game. The average light duty pickup truck in the US is driven approximately only 12,200 miles per year.
IMHO if you don't tow with these trucks most will easily make it to 200K plus without having to fuss with changing fluids. I've heard mopar mechanics say that with the zf trannys there's been a big reduction in transmission work. They are pretty reliable.

There's lots of facebook pages dedicated to swapping the 8 speed into everything these days,it's the LS of transmission swaps.The Euro guys are alot farther ahead on developing programs and stand alone controllers for it,compared to the north american market

 

[Wild one]

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