Engine Long crank issue when warm restart 5.7L - No Codes

[LumberJakl]

So, I've been dealing with this issue for a year now, and no mechanics could figure out why its doing this:

After when the engine has been running and gets warm after driving it, once you shut off the engine and let it sit for 30 minutes it does this:

November 22, 2021

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No Check engine lights
Fuel pressure has been verified and good
All Sensers were replaced (MOPAR Camshaft & PCV, NTK Crankshaft)
All Spark plugs and coils replaced (NGK)

I am stumped on this one... The truck starts up every time with no issues when it's cold, or when you only shut off the engine for 5-10 minutes
Any Ideas?

 

[Rlaf75]

Fuel pressure is good when its cranking that long and not starting? Start looking at the relays

 

[LumberJakl]

Fuel pressure is good when its cranking that long and not starting? Start looking at the relays

The unusual thing is, it still starts every time when when it has this issue but yes: The fuel pressure is still good as per the mechanics diagnosis
Thanks, I'll probably order up a new set of relays and change them out

 

[Tach_tech]

Seems like leaking fuel injectors. Did they do a leak down test? Could also be a leaking purge solenoid. Both of those things can cause extended cranks with a hot engine that’s sat for 30 minutes to a couple hours. It causes a rich situation in the engine.

Next time it does put the gas to the floor, it will enter clear flood mode and shuts off the injectors and should allow the engine to start.

 

[2010RamBigHorn]

This is exactly what my truck has done for over a year now. I have replaced the exact parts even down the to the OEM Camshaft Sensor and the NTK Crank Sensor. Have you been able to find a fix for this issue yet?

 

[LumberJakl]

This is exactly what my truck has done for over a year now. I have replaced the exact parts even down the to the OEM Camshaft Sensor and the NTK Crank Sensor. Have you been able to find a fix for this issue yet?

No, not yet... Next route I will be taking is replacing all O2 Sensors and the EVAP system, probably in the next month or so

 

[Tach_tech]

No, not yet... Next route I will be taking is replacing all O2 Sensors and the EVAP system, probably in the next month or so

O2 sensors are not going to cause your issue. Have you done a leak down test of the injectors?

 

[2010RamBigHorn]

I replaced my evap purge valve, O2 sensors about a year ago, and replaced my injectors with the most recent part number. I got the injectors used however from a guy who upgraded to higher flows so they had around 7,000 miles on them at the time they were pulled.

 

[2010RamBigHorn]

I have a quick update on the starting issue with my truck. I decided that I'd check the terminals and wiring on my TIPM today just to check the condition of both since my truck now has around 246,800 miles on it. I only noticed some slight corrosion on a couple of pins. I cleaned the contacts and noticed that someone had professionally spliced a wire (heat shrink and all) but everything else looked pretty good. I took it for a drive. It started quickly on the first crank as it usually does on the first start of the day (this was afternoon here in WV at about 92 degrees). I drove it about 30 minutes away and parked it. Sadly, It cranked a good 5-7 seconds before roughly starting up and then running fine as always. So I am back to square one it seems.

 

[Tach_tech]

There are fuel pump relay kits that bypass the factory relay and utilize a external relay. They’re fairly cheap and easy to install. Could always get one, install it and see if it helps.

I’ve dealt with intermittent fuel pump relay issues on the TIPM trucks and it can be a nightmare to diagnose properly.

 

[GTyankee]

You my want to have the battery Load tested, just for giggles

 

[Lee Peterson]

My truck does the same thing every once and awhile since I put a TYC fuel pump in. It seems to lose prime, if I cycle the key twice it normally wont happen.

 

[2010RamBigHorn]

There are fuel pump relay kits that bypass the factory relay and utilize a external relay. They’re fairly cheap and easy to install. Could always get one, install it and see if it helps.

I’ve dealt with intermittent fuel pump relay issues on the TIPM trucks and it can be a nightmare to diagnose properly.

Sadly I have not seen a bypass kit for a 2010 model Ram. The earlier and later models had them but 2009-10 were a differently designed TIPM to the best of my knowledge.

 

[GTyankee]

I once had a 1967 Mustang Fast Back
I had bought it from a private seller
It had the 289 cu inch engine & it ran like a champ

I had to drive a family member on a 70 mile trip to see a specialist in Muscular Dystrophy twice a month.
After driving that 70 miles, that Mustang would not start without getting a jump start, or until the engine was completely cooled off.
One day i stopped at a Battery Rebuilder to see if the shop could check it out.
It turns out that the original owner had installed a incorrect sized battery, it was just to darn small.
I had that shop install the largest battery option that they had for that Mustang.
After that, there was no starting problems

 

[2010RamBigHorn]

After all of the other parts that I have done so far, I bought a Delphi fuel pump for my Ram to see if that will fix the issue on mine. I just have to find the time to install it. Ironically, one of my good friends who drives a 12' or 13' Ram asked if I had any starting troubles with my Ram and proceeded to tell me that his truck now has the same symptoms as mine. He only has around 60-70k miles on his truck so far.

 

[2010RamBigHorn]

Has anyone had any luck with fixing this issue so far? I ended up returning the fuel pump as I had read others with this issues had already replaced their fuel pumps which had no effect. I am running out of ideas on this one.

 

[Tach_tech]

Has anyone had any luck with fixing this issue so far? I ended up returning the fuel pump as I had read others with this issues had already replaced their fuel pumps which had no effect. I am running out of ideas on this one.

What have you done so far?

 

[2010RamBigHorn]

What have you done so far?

Thanks for the response. So far I have replaced the following:
spark plugs (OEM, cleaned coil contacts and replaced one coil that looked rusty)
coil boots
crank position sensor (oem)
cam position sensor (OEM)
purge valve (mopar),
fuel injectors (OEM, not new ones, but only had 7,000 miles on them)
coolant temperature sensor (OEM in new Mopar Water Pump)
Map Sensor (OEM)
Upstream and downstream Oxygen Sensors (NTK)

Other things replaced that aren't related to the issue since the issue predated the change:
PCV Valve (OEM)
Oil Pressure Sending unit (OEM)

I did have catalytic converter codes (P0420, P0430 I believe) so I installed non-foulers on each pipe to move the 2 rear, downstream Oxygen sensors out of the line a bit which has removed those codes. Keep in mind that I didn't do all of these part replacements at once and some were for other reasons, but all of these have been in the last 2 years and the starting issue occurred both before and after their replacement. It always starts like a champ in the morning after sitting overnight, but after I drive about 15 miles for work and park for a couple of hours, it cranks for a long time on the first cranking attempt. It usually fires up in the first second or two on the 2nd turn of the key switch however. Turning the key off and back on before attempting to start doesn't seem to have much effect on it. It also seems to have more trouble with this on hotter days and it should be noted that it has never failed to start on the 2nd attempt. Thank you to anyone who has any ideas or thoughts to share on this. My truck has 255,500 miles on it and I love the old truck, but this issue and the shudder/shaking that I get at 35 mph have driven me crazy for the last couple of years.

 

[Tach_tech]

When it just cranks, have you tried the clear flood mode by pressing the gas to floor? This turns off the injectors to help clear a flooded engine which can happen from leaking injectors. Could also be the relay which is internal to the TIPM, they do make bypass kits.

 

[2010RamBigHorn]

When it just cranks, have you tried the clear flood mode by pressing the gas to floor? This turns off the injectors to help clear a flooded engine which can happen from leaking injectors. Could also be the relay which is internal to the TIPM, they do make bypass kits

I’ll give that a try this week to see what effect it has on my issue. I’ve tried pumping the throttle which resulted in the lightning bolt throttle body icon staying on for the trip but it still started hard and even sputtered a bit during the start.