Maxtrac 2/4 Lowered - Sway Issue

[TripleG]

Installed a MaxTrac 2/4 lowering kit over two weekends.
Front Strut replacement - No issues other than it needed an alignment.
Rear Install (Spring, Shocks, sway bar link, & pan bar adapter) - n0 issues
Alignment - would not adjust enough for camber. Purchased & installed MaxTrac UCAs Aligned within specs.

ONE WEEK LATER:
Have a serious sway issue when travelling over 60mph.
Installed Bilstein's to see if it was the shocks, ride improved up to 75 mph. Sway came back.

Anybody have a similar issue? What was you remedy?

 

[Bigskyroadglide]

Rear control arm relocation brackets, typically from inez suspension ;

or Check both sets of your lower control arms in the rear. Bushings tend to become sub optimal somewhere between 30 and 100k miles. Typical replacement is core 4x4 or others, Clayton, freedom or even from ebay.

Most do brackets before control arms

I hope this helps

 

[TripleG]

No relocation brackets provided for the MaxTrac 2/4 lowering kit; it does not require them.
It uses shorten springs designed for the drop.



However, I did look at the CAs and the bushings seemed fine, no excessive wear, tear, or sponginess.
But I do have over 125K on them.

If I stay on this track ...
I may as well replace all the rear suspension.
Rear Upper & Lower CAs, Pan-hard Bar, & Sway bar.

Not complaining, but that was not my original goal.
I was going to get my Boss Motorsport 20" 308s refinished (recent find) and put some 31 x 10.5 tires on it.

Well, there is always Christmas.

 

[Wild one]

No relocation brackets provided for the MaxTrac 2/4 lowering kit; it does not require them.
It uses shorten springs designed for the drop.

View attachment 551995

However, I did look at the CAs and the bushings seemed fine, no excessive wear, tear, or sponginess.
But I do have over 125K on them.

If I stay on this track ...
I may as well replace all the rear suspension.
Rear Upper & Lower CAs, Pan-hard Bar, & Sway bar.

Not complaining, but that was not my original goal.
I was going to get my Boss Motorsport 20" 308s refinished (recent find) and put some 31 x 10.5 tires on it.

Well, there is always Christmas.

If you have sway at highway speeds,you'll want to do the relocation brackets,everything else is a band-aid,and doesn't do anything to correct the rear suspension geometery.When you lower these trucks,the rear suspension goes out of whack,and can actually try to steer the truck when you hit a bump,creating what most guys call sway in the rear. Look at how your rear location arms sit in relation to the ground,you want them puppies as close to parrellel with each other and the ground as possible, to bring the suspension geometery back into spec,so it doesn't try to steer the rear axle

 

[TripleG]

Wild One,

Is it possible that I may just need adjustable control arms to correct the geometry??

The only thing that bothers me about adding relocation brackets is that it is not part of the MaxTrac 2/4 lowering kit.
It had some great reviews, and other users have not reported adding relocation brackets to make it work.

I also want to make sure I am giving an accurate description of the issue.
I was told what I am experiencing is a sway, but I would more accurately describe it as a left to right bouncing effect.
Sort of like driving over alternating bumps. I can feel it a little at lower speeds, but it gets really noticeable at higher speeds.
Is this what people mean by sway? Like I said, I originally called it right>left or side to side bouncing.

I learn how to work on cars from my father, he fixed everything he ever own, but this is my first time changing the suspension.

The only reason I dropped it was to make it easier for me to get in and out of the vehicle.
(Retired Army Veteran)

 

[Wild one]

Wild One,

The only thing that bothers me about adding relocation brackets is that it is not part of the MaxTrac kit.
Other users have not reported adding relocation brackets to make it work.

I also want to make sure I am giving an accurate description of the issue.
I was told what I am experiencing is a sway, but I would more accurately describe it as a left to right bouncing effect.

Most outfits like Maxtrac doesn't include them,as only Inez have the brackets. Just because another identical truck with the same lowering kit doesn't sway at highway speeds,doesn't mean your truck won't.There's really no ryhm or reason to why 1 truck doesn't sway,but the next virtually identical truck does sway.
I run the older Illicit relocation brackets,and you can drive my truck with 1 hand at 155 mph,other then telephone poles going by like a picket fence,and the road looking mighty narrow,you'd never know you were above 150 mph

 

[Wild one]

Wild One,

Is it possible that I may just need adjustable control arms to correct the geometry??

Adjustable control arms "do not" correct the rear suspension geometery,they just band-aid the pinion angle,but don't address the root cause of the issues created by lowering a coil sprung 4th gen truck.
Look at how your rear location arms sit,they'll be angled upwards,and that's the issue that needs to be corrected,they need to come back down and be as close to parrellel as possible

 

[TripleG]

Understood, just a little hesitant to experiment. Cutting stuff off and adding other stuff ... much different than swapping parts.

 

[Wild one]

Understood, just a little hesitant to experiment. Cutting stuff off and adding other stuff ... much different than swapping parts.

Don't worry you're not the only guy,lol.I was one of the first guys to install Illicits rear relocation kit years ago,and i actually bought another complete rear end housing to do the cutting and modifying on,just in case they didn't pan out,my original uncut diff is still sitting in my shed,where it's been for the last 9 years,lol

 

[TripleG]

Now that is funny, I was thinking of buying a used one for the same reason. "Great minds ...."

 

[Wild one]

Now that is funny, I was thinking of buying a used one for the same reason. "Great minds ...."

If you do end up springing for another complete diff,try to get one from a 13+ truck,as the early 11 and 12 ZF diffs have the abs sensor mounted on the front of the diff,nothing a few minutes with a die grinder doesn't cure though.
I ran into that when i bought a 2011 diff to do the modding on

 

[TripleG]

@Wild one
Just a follow-on thought, if the issue is sway, why not upgrade the sway bar?
Go from the 16mm oem to a 22 or 25mm bar (7/8 or 1").
An if it needs different adjusting positions for lifting, would it be the same for lowering?

Just thinking out somethings before committing to a cut and grind.

 

[Wild one]

@Wild one
Just a follow-on thought, if the issue is sway, why not upgrade the sway bar?
Go from the 16mm oem to a 22 or 25mm bar (7/8 or 1").
An if it needs different adjusting positions for lifting, would it be the same for lowering?

Just thinking out somethings before committing to a cut and grind.

Swaybar has nothing to do with the rear end wanting to steer the rear of the truck at high speeds.
It might say "Swaybar" but the bar is designed to keep both tires on the pavement and reduce body roll,it actually has nothing to do with preventing the truck from wagging it's rear like a dog at higher speeds

 

[TripleG]

So maybe I am not able to communicate the problem well.
I would not describe the issue as the the rear end trying to "steer."
It does not feel like the rear is puling left or right while driving.
Something like that I would call tracking.

The problem I have is a like bouncing left to right that gets more prominent the faster I drive.
It feels like the whole vehicle may flip-over or bounce off the road.

That is what I was calling sway - as in swaying left to right continuously.
While the whole vehicle is still tracking straight.
It stops momentarily when hitting a dip or bump that affects both rear wheels.

I dropped the front first and then the back the next weekend. Driving it during the week to work.
It did not start until I dropped the rear, so I was thinking I must have missed something, or something else needs to be changed.

Appreciate any thoughts on this.

PS - One of my wheel studs broke and the rest of the whell nuts were loose on one side, this was after I tightened and torqued then about two weeks ago to check the springs seating. and see what I would need to do to add the IHC bracket if I decided to go that way.

 

[Wild one]

So maybe I am not able to communicate the problem well.
I would not describe the issue as the the rear end trying to "steer."
It does not feel like the rear is puling left or right while driving.
Something like that I would call tracking.

The problem I have is a like bouncing left to right that gets more prominent the faster I drive.
It feels like the whole vehicle may flip-over or bounce off the road.

That is what I was calling sway - as in swaying left to right continuously.
While the whole vehicle is still tracking straight.
It stops momentarily when hitting a dip or bump that affects both rear wheels.

I dropped the front first and then the back the next weekend. Driving it during the week to work.
It did not start until I dropped the rear, so I was thinking I must have missed something, or something else needs to be changed.

Appreciate any thoughts on this.

PS - One of my wheel studs broke and the rest of the whell nuts were loose on one side, this was after I tightened and torqued then about two weeks ago to check the springs seating. and see what I would need to do to add the IHC bracket if I decided to go that way.

If it's moving around at speed,and gets worse the faster you drive,the only real cure is the relocation brackets,as the locating arms aren't in the proper place to maintain their geometery. The upper arm basically gets shorter when you move it up,so it starts trying to pull the rearend ahead ,which in turn causes the rear end to start trying to steer the assend of the truck. It's a very common problem on the trucks when you lower the rear,and the only real fix is to relocate the arms back down to where they run parrallel to each other and the ground. Get ahold of Matt Fikac at Moes,he'll get you straightened out,and you can also talk to him,as i don't think you're really believing me,otherwise you'd have already done the relocation brackets Upgrading to a hellwig swaybar and adjustable locating arms are only band-aid fixes,sure they'll help,but they don't address the root causes of your issue,which is the fact your locating arms run uphill instead of parrallel with each other and the ground. Look at your upper locating arm close,then imagine how it moves and basically gets shorter when the diff goes up.

 

[TripleG]

Will discuss will Moe rep.

 

[Wild one]

Will discuss will Moe rep.

Matts a good guy,and he specializes in nothing but the trucks,so he knows them inside and out.

 

[TripleG]

Just read where some people are saying that the rear control arms misalignment causes "wheel hop" and that may be the more accurate description for what I am experiencing then "swaying." Also found a no-cut relocation bracket by Trekline Motorsports. I am curious about it. As you may know I am hesitant, but willing to cut. HOWEVER, if there is a no cut solution, I am all ears. Have to fix the issue within the next month, wife will not share her ride past that. I welcome others thoughts on this.


Here is the link for any interested parties:

09 - 18 Ram 1500 4 Link Rear Bracket Relocation Kit (No-Cut) for 4" Drop

Trekline Motorsports, Inc. provides Lift Kits, Lowering Kits and Leveling Kits for a wide range of Chevrolet, Dodge, Toyota, Nissan and Ford Trucks and SUVs.

treklinemotorsports.com

 

[Wild one]

Just read where some people are saying that the rear control arms misalignment causes "wheel hop" and that may be the more accurate description for what I am experiencing then "swaying." Also found a no-cut relocation bracket by Trekline Motorsports. I am curious about it. As you may know I am hesitant, but willing to cut. HOWEVER, if there is a no cut solution, I am all ears. Have to fix the issue within the next month, wife will not share her ride past that. I welcome others thoughts on this.


Here is the link for any interested parties:

09 - 18 Ram 1500 4 Link Rear Bracket Relocation Kit (No-Cut) for 4" Drop

Trekline Motorsports, Inc. provides Lift Kits, Lowering Kits and Leveling Kits for a wide range of Chevrolet, Dodge, Toyota, Nissan and Ford Trucks and SUVs.

treklinemotorsports.com

View attachment 553906

Somebody copied Stevens relocation brackets. My buddy was making those identical brackets several years ago,he was always trying to find somebody to manufacture them,but i don't know if he ever did. But those are copycats of his brackets. They never impressed me,but if they're cheap enough give them a whirl.

 

[Geawiel]

I had this exact same issue recently, after doing the Belltech 2/4 kit.

I first replaced the rear shocks with the QA1 single adjustable shocks. When they were cranked to 12 out of 18 it was pretty manageable. The faster I got, the less it wobbled.

I did the torsion bar relocation kit from IHC and still had a bit of a wobble, though significantly less noticeable. It would start for a split second and correct itself just as fast as it started.

I had a loose bolt on the stabilization bar (the one that connects to the back of the axle) relocation bracket. It's the only vertical bolt on the bracket. I can't get a socket on it to torque it down because there's too much **** in the way. I cranked it down again, after finding it loose again, and it helped. I then had the bracket welded in place. That virtually eliminated it.

I have the single adjustable down at 7 out of 18 now and only feel a very slight wobble over really bad bumps.