Poor Engine Braking

Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. If you click them and make a purchase, we may earn a small commission.

7Dave

Junior Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2020
Posts
3
Reaction score
0
Location
Wyoming
Ram Year
2019
Engine
5.7 Hemi
Hey all, forgive me if there's information on this subject somewhere already, I searched but if you search "engine" and "braking" or "compression" it tends to bring up about 8 trillion posts on unrelated topics.

My issue is this: I have a 2019 Ram, 5.7, ridiculously tall gears (3.21s I believe), and the thing doesn't engine brake worth a darn. I understand the gears are tall, so in some situations, like driving down the face of the mountains I live near, lower gears may help. However, in my feeble brain, my mechanical sense tells me that lower gears won't really change engine braking much when I can already downshift the transmission to the point where it's at high RPM, which means the effective ratio is already low enough. Lower gears would only change the transmission gear I might need to be in to achieve a certain RPM, they won't change the amount of force the engine can physically exert on the drivetrain to slow the vehicle. (input on this logic, or maybe lack thereof, is welcome)

I have another situation though that has been quite peculiar as well. When driving on trails in 4 Low, attempting to use the engine to control a descent, the truck will "modulate" my speed. Even on trails that aren't very steep, it will rapidly speed up, RPMs might go to 3,500-4,500, and then the truck will do...something...and it will slow back down to maybe 2,000 RPM (with zero throttle or brake input from me). It's pretty bizarre, I've never had a truck act this way. I can't decide if it seems that the torque converter is doing something (locking or unlocking? do these converters have a lockup function like the old ones?), or if it's a throttle control issue. It almost seems like it's the throttle opening itself, as when it starts to speed up like that, if I don't want it to be at 5 grand singing like it's going to explode, I'll apply brakes, and it feels like I'm fighting the truck, like it doesn't want to slow down. I've also noted that sometimes in hi range, the truck will drive itself up slight inclines, as if it's holding the throttle slightly open. Apparently it has a mind of its own. Anyone else notice strange things like this, or have I lost my mind at a younger age than previously thought possible?

Thanks guys!
 

Travelin Ram

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2020
Posts
1,840
Reaction score
3,007
Location
Somewhere in NA. Probably. We travel a lot.
Ram Year
2022
Engine
6.4
This seems to be a phenomenon with some new vehicles. My PW does exactly the same, at times when downhill compression braking it is varying either the throttle opening, valve timing, or MDS. It’ll speed up, then slow down of it’s own accord. Repeatedly on a long descent. Happens in high and low range.

I can only guess it’s some artifact of the engine management software, without a scanner to monitor engine parameters I cannot tell exactly what it’s doing.

My previous GM truck with cylinder deactivation did something similar, but it was not cyclical. It would grade brake just fine for a bit and then suddenly speed up and not recover. You had to apply the brakes.
 

grizzstang

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2017
Posts
1,845
Reaction score
2,882
Location
Calgary, Alberta Canada
Ram Year
2017
Engine
Hemi 5.7
Mine engine brakes pretty well but I have 392's and I turn the MDS off every time I drive, I also usually lock out 8th gear in town with the shift buttons.
 

NH RAM

Senior Member
Joined
May 14, 2020
Posts
416
Reaction score
404
Location
New Hampshire
Ram Year
2019 Tradesman 2500 Snow Chief
Engine
6.4
You should have better engine braking when you enable tow/haul mode. Usually if I tap the brake pedal it will cause a downshift. We also have the option to manually select a gear, which I've done before in inclement weather so I didn't get a surprise shift while going down a grade.
 
OP
OP
7

7Dave

Junior Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2020
Posts
3
Reaction score
0
Location
Wyoming
Ram Year
2019
Engine
5.7 Hemi
Thanks for the responses. I know I can use tow/haul or manually downshift, but it's the low range issue I'm experiencing that is the most troubling. I'm not a big fan of flying down steep mountain trails with my hair on fire and the brakes smoking...

So I'm wondering if maybe a tuner has messed with this issue before. I seem to remember watching a video a while ago about some tuner changing the clutch lockup in the transfer case... maybe this issue is related...
 

bm02tj

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2019
Posts
1,251
Reaction score
3,827
Location
B C Canada
Ram Year
2018
Engine
5.7
Watch the fuel economy bar as the ECM adds throttle when something in the emissions says to
I live on a hill and the truck will push me down the hill and I have to use the brakes until
it decides then it slows down
I have tried to get pass the clowns at FCA but get told that is the way it is
The general manager at dealer lives in my area and was surprised when he tried it
just about 4800 rpm in second gear then stands you on your nose then you shift to third and all is good
 

Travelin Ram

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2020
Posts
1,840
Reaction score
3,007
Location
Somewhere in NA. Probably. We travel a lot.
Ram Year
2022
Engine
6.4
Probably is something done to placate the emissions gods, maybe squirt some fuel in to heat up the cats or something. I’d like to find a tuner or someone with a high end scan tool that’s investigated.

In my configuration at least, there’s no option to engage tow/ haul in low range, it simply won’t do it.

When you’re locked in low range 3rd gear on a steep downgrade and the engine is repeatedly cycling between 2,000 and 4,000 rpm as the truck accelerates and decelerates with no input from you there’s certainly some digital voodoo going on in the PCM.
 

PoMansRam

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 30, 2018
Posts
2,089
Reaction score
2,554
Location
East Aurora NY
Ram Year
2019
Engine
Hemi
It would be interesting to know if it was something emissions related or NVH to help reduce driveline shock, thumps and bumps..

I live in a very hilly area and are used to toggling the gears down if need be, but I find my 2019 1500 classic w/ hemi and 3.21s to actually do a decent job jumping down a gear and compression braking for me. The TCM may have adapted to my specific driving though.
 

crackerjack1957

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2015
Posts
2,363
Reaction score
3,253
Ram Year
2014 Sport 1500 CC 4x4
Engine
Hemi 5.7...65RFE...4.56
If you want to keep the truck your only option is to be tuned.
 
OP
OP
7

7Dave

Junior Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2020
Posts
3
Reaction score
0
Location
Wyoming
Ram Year
2019
Engine
5.7 Hemi
I like the idea of watching fuel econ to see if it changes, that might give me some clues. I actually notice the issue most in 4 Low and 1st gear, when I'm trying to crawl down real steep grades, so I don't typically watch my fuel econ numbers in those situations, ha.

I'm thinking I might contact a couple tuners just to see if they have any theories/fixes. I'll keep you guys posted if I make any breakthroughs.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
210,828
Posts
3,058,563
Members
170,670
Latest member
joshhhh
Back
Top