Crazy electrical

[Nathanv]

Not likely.

More likely is a pinched wire, short circuit or broken/damaged connector that was caused during the cam replacement.

Your truck is a network of several dozen computers, and when something made of cheap plastic gets damaged by an elbow resting on it, the weight of a cylinder head pushing against it or a dropped tool landing on it, **** gets wrapped around the axle.

You should resign yourself to a couple hours spent with a flashlight and mirror, inspecting everything within arms reach of that cam/lifter job.

So even if the battery gets it running I still got wires messed up alright well I’ll lyk

 

[Ken226]

So even if the battery gets it running I still got wires messed up alright well I’ll lyk

Yea, I think that the weak battery happened to cause this problem at the same exact time your cam failed, is unlikely.

More likely is that a short circuit somewhere drained down the ancient battery and provided the last nail in its coffin. Replace the battery and start looking for wire/connector damage.

That code gives a good indication of which wires and connectors should be looked at first. Especially considering that it is famous for getting damaged due to being barely long enough to reach the runner actuator.

 

[Nathanv]

Yea, I think that the weak battery happened to cause this problem at the same exact time your cam failed, is unlikely.

More likely is that a short circuit somewhere drained down the ancient battery and provided the last nail in its coffin. Replace the battery and start looking for wire/connector damage.

That code gives a good indication of which wires and connectors should be looked at first. Especially considering that it is famous for getting damaged due to being barely long enough to reach the runner actuator.

I honestly think I can get this done myself everything is making sense now it’s been in the dealer for a month and “they can’t figure it out” it’s so bs they haven’t looked at any of the wiring at all or anything so I will try that thank you so much for all the help hopefully it’ll be running next week

 

[Nathanv]

With that new information, I would strongly recommend that the battery be load tested first.

You need to get the truck started before you can investigate the DTCs and limp mode.

Also, how deep of a battery discharge are we speaking of?
Anything under 9.5 VDC, it's likely toast.

.

So I am now being told that the ecm is dropping off and they think the ecm is bad. They said they have a power supply thing they hook up to act as a good battery I told them to try a new battery just to see but they are saying the ecm is bad

 

[RamDiver]

So I am now being told that the ecm is dropping off and they think the ecm is bad. They said they have a power supply thing they hook up to act as a good battery I told them to try a new battery just to see but they are saying the ecm is bad

So, were they able to get the truck into an operational state with their power supply?
I wouldn't be concerned that they substituted the battery with a power supply.

I am concerned that they have taken more than a month to reach this conclusion and am very suspicious of their competency.

The intermittent behaviour of this fault suggests wiring/connectors or grounding issues rather than an ECM failure. Solid state devices don't often become intermittent, they're usually go or no go.

I would want a written guarantee that I won't be charged if the replacement ECM doesn't cure the issues. And what is the cost estimate for their evaluation to date and to replace the ECM?

.

 

[62Blazer]

Agree with the above post.....it whatever repair or replacement part the dealer puts in does not fix the problem, you should not pay for it. I just see posts all the time when somebody states a dealer or shop charged them $2k but it didn't fix the problem.
If everything worked fine before the cam/lifter or whatever work was performed, and now there is an issue, it's most likely due to the work that was just done. In this case I would suspect some wiring got pinched or broken, a connector is loose, or maybe the sensor itself was not installed correctly (assuming it was disturbed during the other work). It's quite the coincidence when something fails just sitting there while other work is being performed.
You said the grounds were corrected, but I have to ask how exactly was that confirmed? Was wiring integrity and continuity checked on everything?
In regard to the battery and being drained by the aftermarket stereo.....if it drained the original battery (assuming it was in decent shape) it will drain the new battery. If you put a "bigger" battery in it you can go longer before it goes dead, but it will still eventually get drained. In this situation a bigger battery is like installing a bigger gas tank......you don't get anymore power or anything, you can just drive longer before it's empty.

 

[Nathanv]

So, were they able to get the truck into an operational state with their power supply?
I wouldn't be concerned that they substituted the battery with a power supply.

I am concerned that they have taken more than a month to reach this conclusion and am very suspicious of their competency.

The intermittent behaviour of this fault suggests wiring/connectors or grounding issues rather than an ECM failure. Solid state devices don't often become intermittent, they're usually go or no go.

I would want a written guarantee that I won't be charged if the replacement ECM doesn't cure the issues. And what is the cost estimate for their evaluation to date and to replace the ECM?

.

They have said if it doesn’t work I will not be charged I’m currently at 2400 for everything they have done and parts hopefully that won’t go any higher They said the ecm is dropping off the network and they can almost “gaurentee” it’s the issue. I do kind of believe it because maybe a bad ground did the job

 

[RamDiver]

They have said if it doesn’t work I will not be charged I’m currently at 2400 for everything they have done and parts hopefully that won’t go any higher They said the ecm is dropping off the network and they can almost “gaurentee” it’s the issue. I do kind of believe it because maybe a bad ground did the job

A bad ground is highly unlikely to toast a module.

If it were me and I had the time, I'd get it home and verify wiring, connectors and grounds.
Stealerships are too often just part swappers.

Does that $2400 include the recommended repairs, and will they guarantee in writing with a 12-month warranty?

.

 

[Nathanv]

A bad ground is highly unlikely to toast a module.

If it were me and I had the time, I'd get it home and verify wiring, connectors and grounds.
Stealerships are too often just part swappers.

Does that $2400 include the recommended repairs, and will they guarantee in writing with a 12-month warranty?

.

I have no idea man I’m just wanting it to run at this point I haven’t had this pickup for 3 months now and I’ve been driving a grandma car and I’m getting annoyed with this entire problem

 

[RamDiver]

I have no idea man I’m just wanting it to run at this point I haven’t had this pickup for 3 months now and I’ve been driving a grandma car and I’m getting annoyed with this entire problem

I understand your frustration.

As mentioned above, we see a steady flow of members paying out big $ to stealerships with great promises of solutions only to embark on a long and tedious journey of dissatisfaction.

It's your money to gamble, things might work out. Many of us wouldn't gamble on the odds of success.

We will support your decision, either way.
I wish you the best of luck in your truck adventure.

.

 

[Nathanv]

I understand your frustration.

As mentioned above, we see a steady flow of members paying out big $ to stealerships with great promises of solutions only to embark on a long and tedious journey of dissatisfaction.

It's your money to gamble, things might work out. Many of us wouldn't gamble on the odds of success.

We will support your decision, either way.
I wish you the best of luck in your truck adventure.

.

Thank you I’ll make sure to keep this updated

 

[Ken226]

So I am now being told that the ecm is dropping off and they think the ecm is bad. They said they have a power supply thing they hook up to act as a good battery I told them to try a new battery just to see but they are saying the ecm is bad

I'm curious as to exactly what that means.

If they removed the PCM from the truck and bench tested it with a standalone power supply, with nothing else attached, and it was still intermittently dropping coms with the scan tool, then I'd be inclined to accept that a mosfet had failed in the PCM.


But if they left it in the truck and connected to the trucks harness connectors, the external power supply could be meaningless. A short in the harness would pull the voltage down to a level below what the PCM needs to stay online, even if the power supply was external. Especially when you consider than many of the power feeds inside the PCM are shared circuits. Something pulling down voltage on the intake runner actuator circuit could easily shut down other systems, or even the PCM itself.


Just an afterthought, but the ASD relay powers both the PCM and the short runner actuator:




It's worth a few minutes of time to swap the ASD relay out and try it. I remember another member a year or so back who did a cam/swap and had similar symptoms to what you are having. He ended up finding that his ASD relay had a bad (high resistance) connection on the contactor. When It started drawing current, the voltage dropped to a level that was shutting down the PCM. When he replaced the ASD relay, everything started working again.

I'll look and see if i can find the thread.



Edit: It was this thread:

No Crank. Never ending 2011 5.7L RAM issues

Yes, I can connect to Engine computer with Alpha. I can connect to Body Computer with alpha and do all kinds of stuff. I can connect to the RF Hub and I even programmed a key that will lock/Unlock the doors. I can retrieve the 4 digit PIN. I can poll the computer and get all kinds of information...

www.ramforum.com

 

[Nathanv]

I'm curious as to exactly what that means.

If they removed the PCM from the truck and bench tested it with a standalone power supply, with nothing else attached, and it was still intermittently dropping coms with the scan tool, then I'd be inclined to accept that a mosfet had failed in the PCM.


But if they left it in the truck and connected to the trucks harness connectors, the external power supply could be meaningless. A short in the harness would pull the voltage down to a level below what the PCM needs to stay online, even if the power supply was external. Especially when you consider than many of the power feeds inside the PCM are shared circuits. Something pulling down voltage on the intake runner actuator circuit could easily shut down other systems, or even the PCM itself.


Just an afterthought, but the ASD relay powers both the PCM and the short runner actuator:

View attachment 570024


It's worth a few minutes of time to swap the ASD relay out and try it. I remember another member a year or so back who did a cam/swap and had similar symptoms to what you are having. He ended up finding that his ASD relay had a bad (high resistance) connection on the contactor. When It started drawing current, the voltage dropped to a level that was shutting down the PCM. When he replaced the ASD relay, everything started working again.

I'll look and see if i can find the thread.

They said they checked wiring and found nothing shorted

 

[Nathanv]

I'm curious as to exactly what that means.

If they removed the PCM from the truck and bench tested it with a standalone power supply, with nothing else attached, and it was still intermittently dropping coms with the scan tool, then I'd be inclined to accept that a mosfet had failed in the PCM.


But if they left it in the truck and connected to the trucks harness connectors, the external power supply could be meaningless. A short in the harness would pull the voltage down to a level below what the PCM needs to stay online, even if the power supply was external. Especially when you consider than many of the power feeds inside the PCM are shared circuits. Something pulling down voltage on the intake runner actuator circuit could easily shut down other systems, or even the PCM itself.


Just an afterthought, but the ASD relay powers both the PCM and the short runner actuator:

View attachment 570024


It's worth a few minutes of time to swap the ASD relay out and try it. I remember another member a year or so back who did a cam/swap and had similar symptoms to what you are having. He ended up finding that his ASD relay had a bad (high resistance) connection on the contactor. When It started drawing current, the voltage dropped to a level that was shutting down the PCM. When he replaced the ASD relay, everything started working again.

I'll look and see if i can find the thread.



Edit: It was this thread:

No Crank. Never ending 2011 5.7L RAM issues

Yes, I can connect to Engine computer with Alpha. I can connect to Body Computer with alpha and do all kinds of stuff. I can connect to the RF Hub and I even programmed a key that will lock/Unlock the doors. I can retrieve the 4 digit PIN. I can poll the computer and get all kinds of information...

www.ramforum.com

Talked tot he service manager he said that they tried a new asd relay and had no change

 

[Tominator223]

Low battery causes relay chatter. In the equipment i often work on . Not a vehicle but uses a vehicle battery. And some of the stuff is analog & it don’t like less than 12v. Definitely load test batt & check grounds. 1 ground on the side you have a code could be in the wrong spot. I saw an 84 ford loose OD because they missed a ground that went too one trans bolt. It was on the harness and had kinda got wrapped around the harness & they didn’t see it. I found it reconnected it to trans bolt , the OD worked fine. They had replaced the trans with a new unit & couldn’t figure out why the new 1 had no OD. Funny how 1 wire can kick the ****

 

[Nathanv]

Low battery causes relay chatter. In the equipment i often work on . Not a vehicle but uses a vehicle battery. And some of the stuff is analog & it don’t like less than 12v. Definitely load test batt & check grounds. 1 ground on the side you have a code could be in the wrong spot. I saw an 84 ford loose OD because they missed a ground that went too one trans bolt. It was on the harness and had kinda got wrapped around the harness & they didn’t see it. I found it reconnected it to trans bolt , the OD worked fine. They had replaced the trans with a new unit & couldn’t figure out why the new 1 had no OD. Funny how 1 wire can kick the ****

The grounds have all been fixed, I should mention with my sound system I installed a big 3 wire kit. They are basically 2 giant ground wires and one giant power wire for the alternator one ground is for engine block to firewall, other ground is for engine block to battery.

 

[ibike]

Had the exact same problem. Jump box wouldn’t help so I was guessing something in the ecm computer r wiring. I mean it was exactly like what you’ve got going on.

Got it rollbacked back to my place and put the toaster style battery tester on. 14volts and looking strong. Hit the switch to load the battery down. 0volts. You’ve got a bad battery.

 

[Nathanv]

Had the exact same problem. Jump box wouldn’t help so I was guessing something in the ecm computer r wiring. I mean it was exactly like what you’ve got going on.

Got it rollbacked back to my place and put the toaster style battery tester on. 14volts and looking strong. Hit the switch to load the battery down. 0volts. You’ve got a bad battery.

The dealer is saying ecm is dropping off, I have abs, brake, air bag, traction control, and service 4wd light when key is turned on, just clicks when key is turned and no crank, every relay is clicking in the tipm and throttle body opening and closing. The dealership had told me they have put a power supply on that acts as a good battery.

 

[RamDiver]

The dealer is saying ecm is dropping off, I have abs, brake, air bag, traction control, and service 4wd light when key is turned on, just clicks when key is turned and no crank, every relay is clicking in the tipm and throttle body opening and closing. The dealership had told me they have put a power supply on that acts as a good battery.

And the big question is, how did everything you listed above behave with the power supply?

Everything you describe above points to a power fault or a communication fault knocking out the CAN bus network.

Sometimes a module gets locked on and will kill the communication to all the modules.

We see these issues quite often. I know you're tired of the problems but you won't be much happier if spending all this money only gets you into a new problem.

Fighting with the stealership will be a serious PITA.

Have you given them the green light yet?

.

 

[Nathanv]

And the big question is, how did everything you listed above behave with the power supply?

Everything you describe above points to a power fault or a communication fault, knocking out the CAN bus network.

Sometimes a module gets locked on and will kill the communication to all the modules.

We see these issues quite often. I know you're tired of the problems but you won't be much happier if spending all this money only gets you into a new problem.

Fighting with the stealership will be a serious PITA.

Have you given them the green light yet?

.

I’ve already said yes, I think they looked over all the modules and they said if the ecm happens to not work then I will not be charged for any of the parts and labor for it.