Emergency Brake design sucks... any upgrades?

[CVX20]

Actually it’s doesn’t matter if it’s at the same time, but it matters a lot that both have some minimum amount of applied pressure to ensure the axle/wheels can hold the vehicle. And most setups I have worked on over the years split and pull both from a splitter. This one pulls the passenger almost to the point of bottoming out and then the driver slightly moves. The driver has no means for leverage to be applied other than a chance that the cable is stiff enough when adjusted precisely to have the passenger bottom out and then the cable friction, not actual tension, pulls slightly on the driver.

I’ve been working on vehicles for 30 years. There are a multitude of better designs out there. I’m just venting and hoping they do better on other models and newer years. I like my Mopars but also like vehicles in general. I expect more from them than the average person.


2014 Ram 1500 5.7l CrewCab
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It all comes down to whether the shoes are adjusted properly, the cables are adjusted properly and the rotors aren't worn to much.

 

[Narg]

I've had to replace EB lines more than once in past vehicles due to stretching. A pretty common issue I think.

 

[MrDelete]

Truth of the matter is that the brakes should be serviced at least once a year.Proper cleaning of the caliper pins and the pad slides as well as cleaning and lubing all of the park brake parts would have stopped what the OP is seeing now.

 

[MrDelete]

Agree on annual brake maintenance. Had almost no brakes on 2016 Ram 2500 Laramie, 6.7 Cummins, 35,000 miles. Brake pads were barely worn and ran hot. Had to remove old pads with chisel and hammer. Slide pins were good. Pad ends were rusted from chemicals used one Utah roads.

 

[jlongjohn]

Update, the replacement was definitely interesting. It is difficult to replace the ebrake pads and springs due to the hub size. It leaves little room to work with. It would be easy with the rear axles removed, which I considered since I want to change the rear diff fluid anyway. But with multiple tries per side and some select words late at night in the garage, I managed to get both sides replaced.

I ordered replacement parts including the levers and hardware from RockAuto. I also picked up a PowerStop pad, rotor, and hardware kit to update the normal rear brakes.

The ebrake works now, but only the passenger side engages, the driver starts to pull slightly but not enough to keep the wheel from being turned. I’m going to replace the cables next and also may brace the cable adapter to help ensure the driver side pulls on better.










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[GsRAM]

Nice man! Things are looking up. Parts look decent too.

 

[anchorsaweigh]

I don’t disagree on maintenance, I’m a big proponent, but since I just bought this 2 months ago used I of course couldn’t have maintained it. The design is simple, but it could easily be improved to reduce the chance of failure. I work in the maintenance industry, and I can tell you designing out failure is much more affordable and safer than routine maintenance. There is no reason with increases in technology and materials that this cannot be improved.

That said, I have found nothing other than stock replacements so I will be cleaning and lubing the assembly and replacing the levers. I service twice a year so it shouldn’t be a problem moving forward, but the cable design is just horrible. Hangs down too low and not enough bracing to ensure both wheels brakes are applied evenly.


2014 Ram 1500 5.7l CrewCab
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So, someone else didn't properly maintain the vehicle before you purchased it and it's somehow the designer's fault?

At any rate, now that you're aware of it you'll be checking on this from time to time. Even BAD experience is knowledge.

Cheers

Bob

 

[jlongjohn]

Anchors,

Nah the blame is twofold actually. Bad designs make it worse if maintenance is not done. I see it all the time. Make it harder to access something, don’t allow for proper lubrication, bad choice of material, etc etc.

Don’t disagree on experience, I learn from everything and hope I’m never done learning.

For what’s it worth the replacement (Dorman) levers have just a bit of space between the layers and around the pin, so I actually was able to brush in some lube before assembly. The originals had zero clearance so it would have been hard to lube other than penetrating fluid.


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[Thornback]

Note to opening poster -- There is one improvement out there -- It's called Ford. Sorry, I couldn't resist. But my 2020 F-150 has a solenoid that applies the back disc brakes when you hit the parking brake lever on the dash. Works great when I frequently launch my boat at a ramp. Boy was I surprised the first time I looked for the parking brake pedal

 

[PoMansRam]

Totally agree with the OP. This setup on our trucks is terrible for those who live in the rust belt. Not so bad for those who don't. I just posted a thread on the same experience: https://www.ramforum.com/threads/parking-brake-rust-belt-blues.159424/

If your parking brake cable is sagging. 9/10 times it's not the cable, it's because the lever actuators the OP showed in the first post are seized up or partially seized and the lever arms are not pulling back on the cable causing it to sag.

Easiest way to tell is get under the truck with a chisel or big flat blade screwdriver and a hammer and tap the P-brake levers rearward that the cables attach to. If they move and the slack is removed from the cables, the lever/cam assemblies are partially seized.

OP, if you catch this, the best thing you can do is butter this area up with some marine grade anti-seize and you may need to clean and reapply it every so often.

Those who live in areas with no winter will likely never have to deal with this.

 

[Tach_tech]

Note to opening poster -- There is one improvement out there -- It's called Ford. Sorry, I couldn't resist. But my 2020 F-150 has a solenoid that applies the back disc brakes when you hit the parking brake lever on the dash. Works great when I frequently launch my boat at a ramp. Boy was I surprised the first time I looked for the parking brake pedal

A lot of new vehicles now use an electronic parking brake. The 5th gen Ram does as well.

 

[CVX20]

Update, the replacement was definitely interesting. It is difficult to replace the ebrake pads and springs due to the hub size. It leaves little room to work with. It would be easy with the rear axles removed, which I considered since I want to change the rear diff fluid anyway. But with multiple tries per side and some select words late at night in the garage, I managed to get both sides replaced.

I ordered replacement parts including the levers and hardware from RockAuto. I also picked up a PowerStop pad, rotor, and hardware kit to update the normal rear brakes.

The ebrake works now, but only the passenger side engages, the driver starts to pull slightly but not enough to keep the wheel from being turned. I’m going to replace the cables next and also may brace the cable adapter to help ensure the driver side pulls on better.










2014 Ram 1500 5.7l CrewCab
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Did you adjust the shoes after you installed the rotors?Even if it is a sh*tty set up it does need proper adjustment before blaming the cables.

 

[jlongjohn]

A lot of new vehicles now use an electronic parking brake. The 5th gen Ram does as well.

Yeah I had to LOL at the Ford statement! I guess just a new truck would do the truck for a while. The rust and corrosion always catches up here.

My wife’s new suv has the electric actuator also, but keep in mind that actuator is still actuating something that has to move. It will need service.

I would love to see something like a wet brake or driveshaft mounted parking brake.


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[jlongjohn]

Did you adjust the shoes after you installed the rotors?Even if it is a sh*tty set up it does need proper adjustment before blaming the cables.

Yes, shoes definitely adjusted as part of the rotor install. Adjusted and checked and removed rotor several times to get it as snug as possible without too much initial drag. I even added a few “star” turns once the rotor was on and checked free play on each wheel with both in the air.

I’ve been doing mechanical and automotive work (brakes-included) on vehicles of all kinds for several decades. I’m in my 40’s and started helping my dad and cousins and neighbors when I was big enough to hold tools, I have some cool pics from when I was 5ish. I learned most in the school of hard knocks but the military added some formality, although much of it was already learned at that point based on what they taught. I did learn a ton working on all the various equipment types.

Point being, I do all my own work, did it for the military, and do it for others also. I’m not just a weekend wrench type and have some stuff from rebuilds to designing some new parts. I expect things to work to the point of fulfilling their designed intent. If they don’t I usually figure out why, then try to either fix or improve the situation. I want things to last and work trouble free for as long as they can with reasonable amounts of maintenance.

Back to my parking brake. The cables here are definitely stretched a bit, but the driver side simply isn’t going to work right since it has no hard mount at the lead end. The drivers side literally is pulled by the outer jacket of the passenger side cable, and it has no fixed attachment point near this junction so there is no leverage for it to be pulled other than back force on the cable jacket when the passenger side bottoms out.

I’ll give that the lever and internal setup is “ok” but still could be improved and I have seen better setups on other vehicles, certain generations of silverados, Subaru’s, Toyota’s, all had better parking brake designs.

These Ram cables no, they are just a bad design, no way to explain out of it. The cable itself is ok, but the arrangement of how they split is not.


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[CVX20]

Yes, shoes definitely adjusted as part of the rotor install. Adjusted and checked and removed rotor several times to get it as snug as possible without too much initial drag. I even added a few “star” turns once the rotor was on and checked free play on each wheel with both in the air.

I’ve been doing mechanical and automotive work (brakes-included) on vehicles of all kinds for several decades. I’m in my 40’s and started helping my dad and cousins and neighbors when I was big enough to hold tools, I have some cool pics from when I was 5ish. I learned most in the school of hard knocks but the military added some formality, although much of it was already learned at that point based on what they taught. I did learn a ton working on all the various equipment types.

Point being, I do all my own work, did it for the military, and do it for others also. I’m not just a weekend wrench type and have some stuff from rebuilds to designing some new parts. I expect things to work to the point of fulfilling their designed intent. If they don’t I usually figure out why, then try to either fix or improve the situation. I want things to last and work trouble free for as long as they can with reasonable amounts of maintenance.

Back to my parking brake. The cables here are definitely stretched a bit, but the driver side simply isn’t going to work right since it has no hard mount at the lead end. The drivers side literally is pulled by the outer jacket of the passenger side cable, and it has no fixed attachment point near this junction so there is no leverage for it to be pulled other than back force on the cable jacket when the passenger side bottoms out.

I’ll give that the lever and internal setup is “ok” but still could be improved and I have seen better setups on other vehicles, certain generations of silverados, Subaru’s, Toyota’s, all had better parking brake designs.

These Ram cables no, they are just a bad design, no way to explain out of it. The cable itself is ok, but the arrangement of how they split is not.


2014 Ram 1500 5.7l CrewCab
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Yeah I here ya.I'm almost 65 and have been wrenching for a living for close to 40 of that.Pretty much seen it all.

 

[jlongjohn]

Here is more of what I expect, also one of the first places I went looking for upgrades (not add ons) https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Lokar-EC-80TU-Trans-Mount-Emergency-Brake-Cables,7320.html

This shows the typical 2-1 cable design I expected to see under this thing, generically of course, not this exact thing. I do park in a lot of off-camber situations where we hunt and hike/kayak. So I really probably expect more from my parking brake than most.

 

[tjkoen01]

I’ve had the opportunity to get to work on the ebrakes on my truck recently due to the friction material separating from the shoes. I ended up pulling the axles since the rear diff fluid needed changed too. No way I could have done the job without pulling the axles; every was rusted together. Liberal use of the hammer was required to loosen it all up. Mine is a 2014 from Canada.


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[jlongjohn]

I’ve had the opportunity to get to work on the ebrakes on my truck recently due to the friction material separating from the shoes. I ended up pulling the axles since the rear diff fluid needed changed too. No way I could have done the job without pulling the axles; every was rusted together. Liberal use of the hammer was required to loosen it all up. Mine is a 2014 from Canada.


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I feel ya. I honestly believe for a rusted up job the axle removal is the easiest and could be a timed replacement with seals and fluid along with the ebrake shoes and hardware.

I did it with those hub ends in the way, using needle nose vice grips and brake pliers. It’s hard to get the clips and springs in place.


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[tjkoen01]

I feel ya. I honestly believe for a rusted up job the axle removal is the easiest and could be a timed replacement with seals and fluid along with the ebrake shoes and hardware.

I did it with those hub ends in the way, using needle nose vice grips and brake pliers. It’s hard to get the clips and springs in place.


2014 Ram 1500 5.7l CrewCab
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I won’t lie, I had a difficult time getting it back together without the axles in place. Kudos to those that did it without removing the axles!


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