ethanol free?

[HEMIMANN]

10% of the fuel contains ~30% fewer BTU's, hence an estimated 3% fewer miles per gallon.

But also the reason ethanol has ~30% fewer BTU's per unit of mass is each molecule contains an oxygen atom; that's what's taking up the volume/mass. When you're burning fuel you're also burning oxygen. One doesn't work without the other - but we get most (ethanol) or all (pure petroleum) of the oxygen for free from the air and don't think about it as part of the fuel.

Since the oxygen in ethanol is part of the combustion process & since the molar density of nitrogen (80% of air..) is greater than the average molar density across petroleum's constituent elements burning E10 also means you're not wasting as much combustion energy heating up nitrogen for a given BTU product and you're pushing 3.74% less total mass out your exhaust pipe for a given BTU product. You're also drawing around 6% less mass through your air filter.

Isn't the end finance for the consumer the $$ per mile? Once long ago I had calculated it was about a wash, that was with ethanol taxpayer subsidies, so it wasn't a wash because our tax money was deducted from our pay before the pump price. I'm not an ideologist, just an application engineer.

Point is, a number of scientists posit that corn should be used for food, not a taxpayer subsidized program for big agribusinesses.

 

[kurek]

Isn't the end finance for the consumer the $$ per mile? Once long ago I had calculated it was about a wash, that was with ethanol taxpayer subsidies, so it wasn't a wash because our tax money was deducted from our pay before the pump price. I'm not an ideologist, just an application engineer.

Point is, a number of scientists posit that corn should be used for food, not a taxpayer subsidized program for big agribusinesses.

We're not going to talk politics here there are ag subsidies and there are petrochemical subsidies and both are much too complex to fit into a forum conversation.

The parts that are germane to this conversation are that fuel corn is also feed corn, it's not a "food or fuel" situation in the first place and never was.

Meat and dairy depends on distillers' grains so even if we dumped the ethanol in a lake it would still be necessary to grow the same crops and mash them because if you feed nothing but whole meal and silage to your animals they get liver disease and diabetes and a whole slew of other health problems. Distillers' grains store well, transport and dispense easily and because they have most of the carbohydrate removed they are a high protein high nutrient feed for pork and birds especially.

So when you're buying ethanol for your gas tank you're subsidizing your own breakfast by using one of the many derivatives from the same acre of corn. I don't mind giving money to an American farmer in any case, there's no corn in the sand box.
Regarding the end finance for the consumer, dollars per mile - well is E0 3% more expensive than E10? Not anywhere I ever looked.

Lastly people pay all sorts of money for fancy intakes and forced induction all to get more oxygen into their combustion chambers but when it's delivered by the fuel injector suddenly they don't want it. I'm never gonna understand that in a million years.

 

[rule18]

Is it legal in NY to put nonethanol gas in daily driver vehicles? It's illegal in Minnesota, due to agribusiness lobby bribing legislators. Fact, not hate. So - the few non-alcohol 91 octane pumps available here are labeled for us with small engines only - lawn mowers, chain saws, outboards, motorcycles. Not sure if the cops will descend from the sky on you if you fill your car at one of these?

Yes, it's legal for daily driver vehicles in NY (but now I'll be looking up when I fill up LOL).

 

[JW2 Innovations]

I went through some small engine carburetor pain on several devices in a short time period (blower, chainsaw, weedeater, leaf vac, dirt bike, 4wheeler, etc) using ethanol gas and not running it all through/out/etc to where I got good at replacing the pickup tubing/filters in the gas tanks as well as cleaning out gummed up carburetors and in some replacing jets too. Not by choice. I also have a boat with a 50 gallon tank on it that is also a focal point for me as well for this same item.
Long story short, for me I found this stuff works great on gas to combat the ethanol issue and storing gas as well. I now buy it by the gallon and use a pump to get what I need. Doesn't take that much since the gallon jug is the concentrate stuff so lasts a bit. They sell it at Wally world as well in smaller bottle sizes in auto and boat sections in same clear blue bottles. There is also a diesel version, but I haven't tried that one yet myself. I've tried some others that I'm sure others will mention, and moved away from each of them as this item I've had the best luck with so far.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0068ENYTG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[dhay13]

Our boat has a 75 gallon fuel tank and a carb. When we bought it it had been sitting for 3 years. Took me a full season of boating to finally get all of the crap ethanol out and had to be towed in twice. Ended up sucking about 20 gallons of separated ethanol, replacing the water separator several times and eventually buying a 'new' carb after a rebuild did not work. I rebuilt it myself and there were white salt like deposits stuck all through the float bowl. Couldn't get it to idle. My assumption was these deposits were also in the idle circuits and I had no way of getting to them so just replaced it. Runs great now but now I run ethanol free in it

 

[Wild one]

I went through some small engine carburetor pain on several devices in a short time period (blower, chainsaw, weedeater, leaf vac, dirt bike, 4wheeler, etc) using ethanol gas and not running it all through/out/etc to where I got good at replacing the pickup tubing/filters in the gas tanks as well as cleaning out gummed up carburetors and in some replacing jets too. Not by choice. I also have a boat with a 50 gallon tank on it that is also a focal point for me as well for this same item.
Long story short, for me I found this stuff works great on gas to combat the ethanol issue and storing gas as well. I now buy it by the gallon and use a pump to get what I need. Doesn't take that much since the gallon jug is the concentrate stuff so lasts a bit. They sell it at Wally world as well in smaller bottle sizes in auto and boat sections in same clear blue bottles. There is also a diesel version, but I haven't tried that one yet myself. I've tried some others that I'm sure others will mention, and moved away from each of them as this item I've had the best luck with so far.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0068ENYTG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Says it's not available on amazon.com,but amazon.ca still has.For that price i hope it installs itself in the tank,damn it's expensive.

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B0068ENYTG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&tag=ramforum-20&th=1

 

[JW2 Innovations]

Says it's not available on amazon.com,but amazon.ca still has.For that price i hope it installs itself in the tank,damn it's expensive.

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B0068ENYTG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&tag=ramforum-20&th=1

Amazon shows availability of products by where you are located and their ability to get it to you in a timely manner, give it a bit and try again as they restock constantly.

Yes expensive for a gallon of it....but it does 2,048 gallons of gas. Not 50 gallons for $9-$10 a bottle like some of the smaller bottles cost.

 

[Wild one]

Amazon shows availability of products by where you are located and their ability to get it to you in a timely manner, give it a bit and try again as they restock constantly.

Yes expensive for a gallon of it....but it does 2,048 gallons of gas. Not 50 gallons for $9-$10 a bottle like some of the smaller bottles cost.

For $200 Canuck i hope it installs itself in the tank,lol

 

[Doug Ram]

So they just opened a new Sheetz store in town here and I stopped there today for fuel. Not certain but think all grades were the same price and they had ethanol free that I think was 90 octane and it was also the same price. Almost went with that but wasn't certain it was what I was thinking it was. I run ethanol free in our boat but have bought it at a different station and it is clearly marked 'recreational only'. Anyone familiar with Sheetz and have run it? I know I would get better fuel economy with it.

Looks like it's the same stuff > https://www.sheetz.com/ethanolfree

In NY ethanol free can be used by any vehicle. All gas is taxed.

 

[Doug Ram]

Using ethanol laced fuel in a marine application is bad, really bad if the gas sits for weeks. Its called phase separation when the ethanol becomes saturated with water from the moist marine environment. The combination of vented fuel systems, ethanol and moisture results in a layer cake where the gas floats on the top and water and ethanol separate on the bottom. The resulting goop is difficult to get out of the tank and difficult to dispose of.

God it's a total mess.

On older boats with old school with molded in fiberglass fuel tanks.... total disaster would result as the ethanol would dissolve the tank itself. A really explosive situation.

 

[GTyankee]

Field corn is not what you eat off the cob at the table
It has way too much starch in it.
99% of the corn grown is field corn
Field corn has a small corn kernel

Sweet Corn is what you eat off the cab, because it has so much sugar & the corns Kernel is quite large

------------------------------------------------------------

If you have eaten a corn tortilla, you have eaten field corn
Corn oil comes from Field Corn
Ethanol fuel comes from Field Corn
Cattle, Chicken, Pigs, etc. eat Field Corn

Field Corn

Corn Into Ethanol

From farm to your gas tank, discover how technology and biochemical reactions help convert corn into ethanol. To learn more, visit our website at intotheoutd...

www.youtube.com

 

[kurek]

My truck is not a boat, its fuel tank is not fiberglass, it does not have a carburetor.

My Mustangs park all winter long every winter with E10 and they start and run every spring like nothing happened. My lawn mower and pressure washer park all winter long with E10 in the fuel tank and drained carburetors and the fuel shut-off valve closed and they start up each spring like nothing happened.

Zero of these horror stories have ever manifested themselves in my life at any level as a man who has lived in every climate and owned at various times just about every type of gasoline engine that doesn't fly. When people talk about the terrors of ethanol I can't say this any more plainly, it's fiction to me. You might as well be talking about space aliens because I've seen the same number of them as I've seen problems with E10.
If you have some small engine that sits for ten years I could imagine the carb getting wrecked no matter what fuel is in it.. I run everything I own every year and if I was going to park something for a longer period I'd drain its fuel system whether it was e0, diesel or kerosene because all hydrocarbons go stale in the presence of air.

 

[HEMIMANN]

At Onan, ethanol fuel would not store for even 6 months. It is not a horror story. It is a fact.

 

[White six four]

Whether it's still the same since many years ago (15 or so) or not I don't know, probably not, but my uncle took some gas with ethanol in it and put it in a mason jar. Within 2 weeks you could easily see it separating. I've never had a problem with ethanol in small engines because I've never used it in a small engine. Another point is fuel with ethanol burns hotter so who would want an air cooled engine to run hotter then it already does?

Since camping season is done I'm lucky if I go through a tank of gas every 3-4 weeks in my truck so I use 91 octane since thats the only gas by me that doesn't have ethanol.

In my run around work beater car that's not as picky as these hemis I use 87 octane that has the up to 10% ethanol in it. With the car I usually go through 2-4 tanks a week.

 

[Lamarsh]

No clue about Sheetz, but I run ethanol free / rec gas exclusively in all my boats and any small engines that I don't burn the fuel within a month or so. Ethanol is fine for autos so long as it doesn't sit for months at a time. If you're going to store a truck with fuel in it, store it with ethanol free.

Best way to find where it's sold near you is on pure-gas.org. I like to pick gas stations I know sell a lot of it, such as those close to heavy boat use areas or snowmobile / ORV areas. They tend to have fresher fuel, at a cheaper price as well.

 

[retired]

My truck is not a boat, its fuel tank is not fiberglass, it does not have a carburetor.

My Mustangs park all winter long every winter with E10 and they start and run every spring like nothing happened. My lawn mower and pressure washer park all winter long with E10 in the fuel tank and drained carburetors and the fuel shut-off valve closed and they start up each spring like nothing happened.

Zero of these horror stories have ever manifested themselves in my life at any level as a man who has lived in every climate and owned at various times just about every type of gasoline engine that doesn't fly. When people talk about the terrors of ethanol I can't say this any more plainly, it's fiction to me. You might as well be talking about space aliens because I've seen the same number of them as I've seen problems with E10.
If you have some small engine that sits for ten years I could imagine the carb getting wrecked no matter what fuel is in it.. I run everything I own every year and if I was going to park something for a longer period I'd drain its fuel system whether it was e0, diesel or kerosene because all hydrocarbons go stale in the presence of air.

Pretty much my experience too.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Whether it's still the same since many years ago (15 or so) or not I don't know, probably not, but my uncle took some gas with ethanol in it and put it in a mason jar. Within 2 weeks you could easily see it separating. I've never had a problem with ethanol in small engines because I've never used it in a small engine. Another point is fuel with ethanol burns hotter so who would want an air cooled engine to run hotter then it already does?

Since camping season is done I'm lucky if I go through a tank of gas every 3-4 weeks in my truck so I use 91 octane since thats the only gas by me that doesn't have ethanol.

In my run around work beater car that's not as picky as these hemis I use 87 octane that has the up to 10% ethanol in it. With the car I usually go through 2-4 tanks a week.

Cenex usually offers non ethanol gas of all grades. Wisconsin law also doesn't allow to put into cars and trucks, but nobody checks, if that's your thing. I don't have any issue with 10% ethanol for my on-road vehicles since we go through enough gas not to cause storage issues.

My small engines are entirely different. The small 4 stroke engines get non ethanol 87 octane (low compression ratios need lower octane to burn cleanly), the 2 strokes get 91 octane non ethanol (required by manufacturers).

I had property in Hayward I've since sold, a nice big Cenex there. This spring I think I'll fill my dolly jug at the Cenex in Hudson across the border with 87 octane non ethanol. Cenex was Top Tier at one time, don't know if it is now. Regardless, I always add Stabil to my annual dolly gas because it lasts all year.

 

[GTyankee]

corn gas eats into metal

I have a generator & a Harley Davidson, both have metal tanks
Both tanks are rusted bad & the petcock on the generator is something that i don't want to think about.
The generator is in a deep closet, in back of a rebuilt 327 Chevy engine, i am not about to dig it out to check

 

[Bandit1859]

So they just opened a new Sheetz store in town here and I stopped there today for fuel. Not certain but think all grades were the same price and they had ethanol free that I think was 90 octane and it was also the same price. Almost went with that but wasn't certain it was what I was thinking it was. I run ethanol free in our boat but have bought it at a different station and it is clearly marked 'recreational only'. Anyone familiar with Sheetz and have run it? I know I would get better fuel economy with it.

Looks like it's the same stuff > https://www.sheetz.com/ethanolfree

InTennessee I use ethanol free in my daily lawn service. In my 2019 ram sometimes. Might be marginal increase in mpg but cost difference of fuel makes it a wash

 

[JW2 Innovations]

Ethanol gas in small engine test

Is Non-Ethanol Gasoline Really Better? See the PROOF!

Is non-ethanol gasoline really better for fuel efficiency? What about carbon buildup? In this video I use a generator with electronic fuel injection to meas...

www.youtube.com