Need HONEST/1st HAND Towing advice

[IRSmart]

Without reading through all the replies, here is some advice from someone who has towed with a Thuren suspension: get airbags! I have a 1.5” Thuren lift (it’s advertised less for the Power wagon) and King 2.5’s, and they sag a ton when I put weight behind it. I towed a 3k lb trailer with probably 1k lbs loaded in the front (we needed to make room at the rear) and my truck was riding on the bump stops. I hardly ever tow so it wasn’t an issue, but if you’re turning a Thuren powered truck into a tow rig, be prepared to fight squat.

 

[Rick Ram-jet]

I appreciate all of the honest feedback guys, after talking more with the wife and concluding that we will probably sell our lake house here in Big Bear next spring we will probably travel the different parts of the country we`re thinking of moving to (we`re done with Cali) which means that we`ll probably live in the trailer for awhile so it may make more sense to sell the current truck to someone who will enjoy/use all of the upgrades I have and just go straight for a diesel dually!

If I get the HO Diesel dually I can get a bigger trailer and not have to worry about weight/towing!
Any thoughts or advice from you dually owners/towers out there?

P.S. I`m going to miss my current truck a bunch, she`s set-up perfectly for the mountains we currently live in!

 

[Travelin Ram]

Now you’re heading towards an enjoyable traveling experience. Not white knuckles or worrying about every gust of wind or bad road shoulder.

 

[AFMoulton]

If you are buying a dually, look at 5th wheels, WAY better towing experience


2018 Ram 2500 6.4L 4x4
Amsoil SS 0W-40

 

[SouthTexan]

I guess I have been doing something wrong towing my 13-14k 5th wheel 160 miles one way multiple times a year to the coast for the past 6 years with my 2500. Or my 6k gooseneck cattle trailer that gets up to 12k lbs depending on how many heads of cattle I have in it. So is my brother who also has a 2014 2500 and says it handles the same 5th wheel better than the 2012 F350 he had prior. Towing the same trailer with is F350, it swayed a lot and made the back end bounce like crazy with even slight bumps in the road.

In my opinion and from personal experience, you don't need an F350/3500 to tow a 11k or even 14k trailer. I have towed the same trailer with both a 3500 that was one year newer than mine and my 2500. There was absolutely no difference in how each were able to handle such weights. If one is worried about staying under the ratings that are only meant for the manufacturers to sell trucks in a certain class to be below DOT regulations for fleets, then I can understand someone wanting a 3500. But there will be no difference in how they handle at least 14k from my experience. They both squat within .75 inches of each other with that weight as well. Maybe towing around 16k or 17k may be a different story because there will be a point to where the 2500 will be lacking versus the 3500, but 14k is not it.

 

[IRSmart]

I guess I have been doing something wrong towing my 13-14k 5th wheel 160 miles one way multiple times a year to the coast for the past 6 years with my 2500. Or my 6k gooseneck cattle trailer that gets up to 12k lbs depending on how many heads of cattle I have it. So is my brother who also has a 2014 2500 and says it handles the same 5th wheel better than the 2012 F350 he had prior. Towing the same trailer with is F350, it swayed a lot and made the back end bounce like crazy with even slight bumps in the road.

In my opinion and from personal experience, you don't need an F350/3500 to tow a 11k or even 14k trailer. I have towed the same trailer with both a 3500 that was one year than mine and my 2500. There was absolutely no difference in how each were able to handle such weights. If one is worried about staying under the ratings that are only meant for the manufacturers to sell trucks in a certain class to be below DOT regulations for fleets, then I can understand someone wanting a 3500. But there will be no difference in how they handle at least 14k from my experience. They both even squat within .75 inches of each other with that weight as well. Maybe towing around 16k or 17k may be a different story because there will be a point to where the 2500 will be lacking versus the 3500, but 14k is not it.

You’re not towing on a Thuren suspension and 37’s, so you’re not comparing apples to apples. This suspension is VERY soft, and does not handle payload very well. The truck will PULL the weight just fine, it won’t CARRY the weight nearly as well. OP is going down the right path looking for a more capable tow rig, also allowing him to look at a whole new world of trailers as well.

 

[SouthTexan]

You’re not towing on a Thuren suspension and 37’s, so you’re not comparing apples to apples. This suspension is VERY soft, and does not handle payload very well. The truck will PULL the weight just fine, it won’t CARRY the weight nearly as well. OP is going down the right path looking for a more capable tow rig, also allowing him to look at a whole new world of trailers as well.

I do have a Thuren front suspension and run 35's with a 3.42 axle. However, my comment was mainly for those saying a 3500 is needed for such a small amount of weight. I have experience towing 14k with a 2500 and 3500 of the same model which not many people have. From that experience, I can say that both handle 14k the same. It is probably around 16-17k where the difference between the two start to become more evident and even then it is likely not much.

 

[392DevilDog]

The 6.4l HEMI has the same gross combined in 2500 as in 3500. But the 6.4l has much more payload in 3500 and even more in dually...but the gross combined stays the same.

6.4l 4th Gen has 19800 GCWR for 3.73 and 4.10 is 22800

You can decide to ignore this and that is fine.

If your geography were you live is more lower elevation and flat...then it is probably safe to exceed them as they are rated at elevation and steep grade.

Exceeding axle ratings is not a good idea. I would venture to guess under normal driving you may never have an issue. But one wrong pot hole or too much speed on down hill grade. You may change your tune.

Also experience plays a large rule. Experience probably allows some capacity to be exceeded.

But these people asking these questions...some of them have never even slid a ball mount into a receiver before

So we try to explain the limits.

I really need to stop reading these towing threads.

 

[SouthTexan]

Exceeding axle ratings is not a good idea. I would venture to guess under normal driving you may never have an issue. But one wrong pot hole or too much speed on down hill grade. You may change your tune.

This! GAWR is one thing I never go over. My rear GAWR is only 500 lbs less than the 3500's rear GAWR. If you subtract the 2700 lbs of my rear curb weight from my 6,500 lb rear GAWR (7,000 for 3500's) that leaves me with 3,800 lbs which I never even come close to. Most I have ever been was about 3,200 lbs. The front GAWR of the diesel 3500 and my truck is exactly the same since it uses the same suspension.

Another aspect that is overlooked by many is aftermarket rim/tire ratings. I have seen people unknowingly decreased their GAWR by getting rims/tires that were lower than stock rim/tires and had a combined rating lower than their stock GAWR. One case was 3,200 lb rated rims/tires on a truck with a stock rating of 7,000 lb GAWR. That reduced their GAWR to 6,400 lbs which is even less than my truck.

 

[SouthTexan]

Without reading through all the replies, here is some advice from someone who has towed with a Thuren suspension: get airbags! I have a 1.5” Thuren lift (it’s advertised less for the Power wagon) and King 2.5’s, and they sag a ton when I put weight behind it. I towed a 3k lb trailer with probably 1k lbs loaded in the front (we needed to make room at the rear) and my truck was riding on the bump stops. I hardly ever tow so it wasn’t an issue, but if you’re turning a Thuren powered truck into a tow rig, be prepared to fight squat.

I will say that one aspect you will might have to look out for is how the max tire/rim ratings effect your rear GAWR especially with 17' rims. The scenario I stated above where someone I knew put 3200 rates tires (actually 3,195 lbs @ 80 psi) on a 3500 was with 17" KO2's like you have. That effectively lowered his rear GAWR from 7,000 to 6,390 since the rims/tires were the new weakest link (lowest rating) in the axle system.

I am not sure what your back end weighs with all that stuff you have. Probably not enough to exceed the 6,390 rating of those rims/tires. From what you stated, it seems that the tires are not the weakest link in that setup.

 

[Rick Ram-jet]

It`s true about the squat when running the Thuren suspension, (my pontoon boat or hauling my Harley in the bed the squat is very noticeable) if I were to go with a smaller trailer and keep my current truck I will install air bags and a equalizer hitch for sure!

To be fair, the Thuren system does excellent on our mountain trails!

 

[miles01]

If I get the HO Diesel dually I can get a bigger trailer and not have to worry about weight/towing!
Any thoughts or advice from you dually owners/towers out there?

I miss my 1 Ton dually diesel I towed a 5th wheel that weighed 12,000 empty , I downsized the camper and sold the 1 ton (it was a 2001 HO with 6 speed manual).
It was very stable tow vehicle compared to my current 2500 CC with 6.4 gas motor that I tow a 26ft RV that weighs 6,800 empty and about 8,500lbs loaded, it adds approx. 1,500lbs to the rear axle of the truck. I should have gotten another diesel. If i was pulling bigger I would definitely go dually.

 

[HAL9001]

I just have to say something here also being in the market for a new truck and wanting to tow a travel trailer.

I currently own a powerful SUV and the people on that car's forum say to buy a 1500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go to the 1500 RAM forum and the people there say to buy a 2500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go here and I see people saying to buy a 3500 RAM if you want to tow. If I go onto the 3500 forum maybe they'll say to buy a tractor-trailer, LOL.

Now, I'm not saying anyone's wrong and I'm sure all of this advice has merits. But the bottom line is that the SUV, the 1500, the 2500, and of course the 3500 can all safely pull trailers within the weight class they were designed for and there are travel trailers in all these vehicle's weight classes. So, as most of us know, it's all about deciding on which travel trailer you want/need and then carefully matching the tow vehicle to the trailer and not the other way around.

 

[rule18]

I just have to say something here also being in the market for a new truck and wanting to tow a travel trailer.

I currently own a powerful SUV and the people on that car's forum say to buy a 1500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go to the 1500 RAM forum and the people there say to buy a 2500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go here and I see people saying to buy a 3500 RAM if you want to tow. If I go onto the 3500 forum maybe they'll say to buy a tractor-trailer, LOL.

Now, I'm not saying anyone's wrong and I'm sure all of this advice has merits. But the bottom line is that the SUV, the 1500, the 2500, and of course the 3500 can all safely pull trailers within the weight class they were designed for and there are travel trailers in all these vehicle's weight classes. So, as most of us know, it's all about deciding on which travel trailer you want/need and then carefully matching the tow vehicle to the trailer and not the other way around.

Yep, opinions happen. This isn't necessarily a 1500 Forum as you've mentioned, but a lot of members have do have 1500's, and many have 2500 and 3500. The gross weight ratings are what they are, but for many people there is some grey area as you ride the line between needing a 1500 and 2500, as an example. Some folks are happy to push the limit of a 1500, while others wouldn't dream of that and jump into a 2500 just to have a bit of headroom. You need to filter out the noise, look at the real world numbers, take the advice (or not) of some of our more seasoned TT/RV members and make your choice. Oh and usually, never take truck advice from a TT salesman!

 

[AFMoulton]

It really depends on what you are pulling. First trailer was 28’ long and was 7900#s loaded. My 1500, with Airlift 1000 airbags and WDH did just fine. Spence trailer is 9950# loaded and it was too much tongue weight wise for my 1500 and to give me some margin in the payload. So I bought a 2500 6.4 Hemi, and it pulls the trailer great and with the WDH set up properly it’s not too bad. However it’s 38’ long so if there is ever a crosswind that’s more than about 15-20mph, I’m pulling over and waiting for it to be done. 3500 dually would pull that trailer with less sway issues no doubt, but it’s not practical for my everyday life and the 12% I actually tow.




2018 Ram 2500 6.4L 4x4
Amsoil SS 0W-40

 

[Rick Ram-jet]

AF, that`s a very nice trailer, similar to the Grand Design 2975STS, 33ft, GVR 9,995 we were looking at!

 

[Zoe Saldana]

I just have to say something here also being in the market for a new truck and wanting to tow a travel trailer.

I currently own a powerful SUV and the people on that car's forum say to buy a 1500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go to the 1500 RAM forum and the people there say to buy a 2500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go here and I see people saying to buy a 3500 RAM if you want to tow. If I go onto the 3500 forum maybe they'll say to buy a tractor-trailer, LOL.

Now, I'm not saying anyone's wrong and I'm sure all of this advice has merits. But the bottom line is that the SUV, the 1500, the 2500, and of course the 3500 can all safely pull trailers within the weight class they were designed for and there are travel trailers in all these vehicle's weight classes. So, as most of us know, it's all about deciding on which travel trailer you want/need and then carefully matching the tow vehicle to the trailer and not the other way around.

Yoda has spoken.

 

[Firebird]

I just have to say something here also being in the market for a new truck and wanting to tow a travel trailer.

I currently own a powerful SUV and the people on that car's forum say to buy a 1500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go to the 1500 RAM forum and the people there say to buy a 2500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go here and I see people saying to buy a 3500 RAM if you want to tow. If I go onto the 3500 forum maybe they'll say to buy a tractor-trailer, LOL.

Now, I'm not saying anyone's wrong and I'm sure all of this advice has merits. But the bottom line is that the SUV, the 1500, the 2500, and of course the 3500 can all safely pull trailers within the weight class they were designed for and there are travel trailers in all these vehicle's weight classes. So, as most of us know, it's all about deciding on which travel trailer you want/need and then carefully matching the tow vehicle to the trailer and not the other way around.

I've towed with half tons, and with heavy duty's, and all I can say is I hate towing with a half ton!

 

[Rick Ram-jet]

I noticed that several people mentioned reduced load capacity with after mkt rims/tires.
For others interested in specific info on the following:

AEV Katla 17x8.5 wheels 36lbs, (weighed them myself), weight pretty much a wash compared to my stock rims, maybe even a pound or so less!
Rating w/40in tire 4,100 lbs ea, so I`m guessing around 3,700 for my set-up!

37 x 12.5 Kanati trail hogs: 3,525 load rating ea, weigh 72.5 lbs ea. can`t recall what the stock tires weighed, obviously less..

I bought these specific wheels/tires with load rating in mind!

 

[Jughed]

I just have to say something here also being in the market for a new truck and wanting to tow a travel trailer.

I currently own a powerful SUV and the people on that car's forum say to buy a 1500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go to the 1500 RAM forum and the people there say to buy a 2500 RAM instead if you want to tow. So, I go here and I see people saying to buy a 3500 RAM if you want to tow. If I go onto the 3500 forum maybe they'll say to buy a tractor-trailer, LOL.

Now, I'm not saying anyone's wrong and I'm sure all of this advice has merits. But the bottom line is that the SUV, the 1500, the 2500, and of course the 3500 can all safely pull trailers within the weight class they were designed for and there are travel trailers in all these vehicle's weight classes. So, as most of us know, it's all about deciding on which travel trailer you want/need and then carefully matching the tow vehicle to the trailer and not the other way around.

This is why you will end up seeing a Honda Pilot (i own one too) towing a 24' TT down the road from time to time. Or like i saw on my last trip - an Audi SUV passed me at about 75mph towing a larger TT than I was towing at 65mph with my 3/4 ton... The pilot may have a 5k tow rating - but it has no business towing a 24' TT down the road. Ours was bad at pulling our 2500# pop up...

It wont end well - blown tire, emergency maneuver, hard stop... it will not end well.


My opinion on how these threads end - people get the weights so close to the limits they need to talk about if they can add fuel or passengers...

My rule of thumb - for towing regularly, no more than 75% of max capacity - for safety, for longevity of the tow vehicle, for the ability to take extra gear when needed and not have to worry...