Overheating after leak?

[joshuaeb09]

It's not just the TX inspection law thing that keeps me from "deleting" emissions on the truck. The emissions system is required by Federal EPA Law, deleting it would make it an illegal truck anywhere in the US. I don't want to be sweating it every time I pass a State Trooper out on the interstate. We live in the 5th wheel trailer and travel all the time, we're just not going to risk it.

That changes things with it being your TV for full timing. Unfortunately a lot of the operators out here have similar issues with the modern diesel emissions crap so they've been moving everything they can to gas. For stuff they can't quite a few of them are buying this stuff by the drum. I've also heard a few guys swear by the hotshots secret stuff as well for emissions/fuel issues. I know 1st hand on the diesel tractor the 5007 helps with the regens and such and accounts I've heard from operators is that it helps out noticeably on their rigs. Getting good diesel is kind of a crap shoot and I've seen some pictures from the guys that service service station tanks that are cringe worthy at best. A lot of tanks aren't being treated properly for the biodiesel so they're growing bugs and other terrible things since Biodiesel has the same water problem as ethanol in gas.

http://www.primrose.com/images/DataSheets/tds/PS_TDS_5007.pdf

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microbial_contamination_of_diesel_fuel

 

[Tach_tech]

Funny you mention the switch to gas for service trucks. We have a Cummins dealer in town and every now and then we do maintenance and work on their service trucks. Usually a 4500/5500. Pretty much all of their trucks are 6.4 gas trucks.

 

[joshuaeb09]

Funny you mention the switch to gas for service trucks. We have a Cummins dealer in town and every now and then we do maintenance and work on their service trucks. Usually a 4500/5500. Pretty much all of their trucks are 6.4 gas trucks.

Yup my old man talks to a lot of fleet operators as part of his job and the TCO when you factor in all the maintenance and new stuff makes it cheaper to run HD gassers wherever you can for the most part. He's also over their fuel stuff and man diesel has just become a headache to manage for stations and fleets with the ULSD and BD stuff. We were talking the other day about how were probably going to see, at-least out here, the diesels becoming more and more rare outside of guys hauling big loads with dually's, heavy equipment, and rigs. Even the well to do farmers that are typically the market for those fully loaded 3500 diesels are now getting fully loaded 2500/3500 gas trucks.

I do have to say I'm rather impressed with the new 6.4/A8/4.10 setup from Ram compared to what gas HD's used to be. If those had been around when I got my 1500 I'd probably be driving one of those bad boys instead.

 

[John Hickman]

The story goes on!!! We left Hot Springs on July 3rd and got almost to Memphis and the truck overheated again. We were on flat ground and not working the truck too hard, driving about 60 mph. We pulled into a TA Truck Stop with the coolant temp at about 225-230. We let it idle for a bit and the temp went down to about 215. Turned it off and let it cool down to the point that the radiator hose was without pressure and checked the coolant level. It was down about a gallon.
Not wanting to damage anything we were towed to an RV park in Southaven, MS so we could locate a local diesel shop. Several locals recommended one in Hernando, MS. I added coolant to the radiator and drove the truck to the shop, about 25 miles away without overheating. Without the load of the 5th wheel trailer of about 16,000 lbs, there is not much load on the engine.
It took them a couple of days to diagnose the problem, they did a cylinder drop-out test and determined the headgasket was leaking between cylinders. With the truck being covered by extended warranty it took a few more days to make sure it was covered.
Here we are today and the truck should be ready this week, then it is on to Charlotte, NC. fingers crossed.

 

[joshuaeb09]

The story goes on!!! We left Hot Springs on July 3rd and got almost to Memphis and the truck overheated again. We were on flat ground and not working the truck too hard, driving about 60 mph. We pulled into a TA Truck Stop with the coolant temp at about 225-230. We let it idle for a bit and the temp went down to about 215. Turned it off and let it cool down to the point that the radiator hose was without pressure and checked the coolant level. It was down about a gallon.
Not wanting to damage anything we were towed to an RV park in Southaven, MS so we could locate a local diesel shop. Several locals recommended one in Hernando, MS. I added coolant to the radiator and drove the truck to the shop, about 25 miles away without overheating. Without the load of the 5th wheel trailer of about 16,000 lbs, there is not much load on the engine.
It took them a couple of days to diagnose the problem, they did a cylinder drop-out test and determined the headgasket was leaking between cylinders. With the truck being covered by extended warranty it took a few more days to make sure it was covered.
Here we are today and the truck should be ready this week, then it is on to Charlotte, NC. fingers crossed.

Once you get your coolant consumption resolved I would flush the system and just go to the big boy Fleetguard OAT. Depending on what the system looks like right now restore more or may not be advisable before swapping coolants. There is also the much cheaper ES Compleat (Blue Stuff), but that requires SCA's at maintenance intervals to keep the coolant topped off. With either you'd want a full on flush to get all the old stuff out.

https://www.cumminsfiltration.com/sites/default/files/lt36625.pdf
https://www.cumminsfiltration.com/organicacidtechnology

Also wouldn't hurt to replace the T-stat with a 180 if you spend more time hooked up than you do empty. Starting with a slightly lower base line before you pull a grade can help keep it from peaking out higher, but a slightly colder T-Stat isn't going to increase the over all capacity of the cooling system. Even if you don't go colder I would replace it when doing a flush just to make sure you've got a fresh working T-Stat in place.

180 6.7 stats :

STANT 49218
GATES 34218

Also if you haven't been treating your fuel since the emissions issues you had please do yourself a favor and treat with something. If you want to stay with something "OE Approved" there's the Power Service stuff that is Cummins approved. Can't really bash them too hard since it does work well and they are another Texas company, but we've found better success at lower treat rate's with alternatives I've already mentioned.

https://www.cumminsfiltration.com/sites/default/files/Diesel Fuel Supplement Technical Bulletin.pdf

 

[John Hickman]

Once you get your coolant consumption resolved I would flush the system and just go to the big boy Fleetguard OAT. Depending on what the system looks like right now restore more or may not be advisable before swapping coolants. There is also the much cheaper ES Compleat (Blue Stuff), but that requires SCA's at maintenance intervals to keep the coolant topped off. With either you'd want a full on flush to get all the old stuff out.

https://www.cumminsfiltration.com/sites/default/files/lt36625.pdf
https://www.cumminsfiltration.com/organicacidtechnology

Also wouldn't hurt to replace the T-stat with a 180 if you spend more time hooked up than you do empty. Starting with a slightly lower base line before you pull a grade can help keep it from peaking out higher, but a slightly colder T-Stat isn't going to increase the over all capacity of the cooling system. Even if you don't go colder I would replace it when doing a flush just to make sure you've got a fresh working T-Stat in place.

180 6.7 stats :

STANT 49218
GATES 34218

Also if you haven't been treating your fuel since the emissions issues you had please do yourself a favor and treat with something. If you want to stay with something "OE Approved" there's the Power Service stuff that is Cummins approved. Can't really bash them too hard since it does work well and they are another Texas company, but we've found better success at lower treat rate's with alternatives I've already mentioned.

https://www.cumminsfiltration.com/sites/default/files/Diesel Fuel Supplement Technical Bulletin.pdf

I appreciate your comments!! Replacing the head gasket should be the end to the problem of loosing coolant. I've heard a lot of complaints about the EGR cooler leaking but I have to believe there are lots of 6.7's out there that are doing fine without a delete kit on them, but that's a whole other story.
I use the Power Service fuel additive already and will stick to it. I've been thinking of going to a cooler t'stat but didn't know if it was a good idea or not. We will use the truck more as a daily driver and will be towing roughly 15K lbs about once a month. It doesn't seem that running a 180 deg truck would be a big problem.

 

[joshuaeb09]

I appreciate your comments!! Replacing the head gasket should be the end to the problem of loosing coolant. I've heard a lot of complaints about the EGR cooler leaking but I have to believe there are lots of 6.7's out there that are doing fine without a delete kit on them, but that's a whole other story.
I use the Power Service fuel additive already and will stick to it. I've been thinking of going to a cooler t'stat but didn't know if it was a good idea or not. We will use the truck more as a daily driver and will be towing roughly 15K lbs about once a month. It doesn't seem that running a 180 deg truck would be a big problem.

If I remember correctly early 10-12 6.7's were odd balls and came with a 200 T-Stat factory, but the 07.5-09, 13+ came with a 190. I think they were trying to squeeze some unloaded efficiency out of them, but IMO for a truck built to work it's not an ideal way to go about it. If they're under heavier load they're going to get above 200 anyhow and starting from a lower temp where possible adds some buffer to the system and you get full coolant flow sooner. Unless you spend a lot of time in colder climates (Ice and Snow) then the 180 should be fine, if not you can still drop to the 190 like the other 6.7's and still get a baseline reduction.

 

[dustbowl_dodge]

When it overheated it went to 242 to 246, for about 15 minutes, but never higher than that.
We drove the truck again today, same thing happened. All was working fine, thermostat was opening and closing as it should. Temp varied from 186 to 195. Stopped at the store for about 20 minutes, no fluid on the ground, the engine started heating to 220 on the way back. We stopped and let it cool to 170 and I added a gallon of coolant and it stayed at 186 to 195 the rest of the way back.

New to the forum here. Hello all!!!! As a heavy duty mechanic I felt this was one thread I could touch on. Check your EGR cooler for internal leaks. I'd be willing to bet you're leaking coolant into the intake through the cooler. When the EGR cooler doesn't have coolant running through it and then runs hot, that's when it develops a hole in the cooler fins. Look in your intake after the EGR crossover and if you smell a sweet scent then you have coolant leaking in the intake. You might also be able to smell a sweet smell in the exhaust. With as much coolant as you're adding it sounds like a bed EGR cooler to me.

 

[dustbowl_dodge]

If you’re having to add coolant. There is either air in the system and it’s being worked out. Or there’s a leak, wether it’s internal or external.

The most common leaks I see are the water pump and the EGR cooler. Water pump is a pretty easy leak to find. EGR cooler you’ll really only see if you take the tube off at the cooler. If it’s clean,shiny and a little wet, the cooler is leaking. The burning coolant pretty much steam cleans the cooler and tube, and it’s mostly burned before it gets to the engine so you won’t have any white smoke.

Also if the EGR cooler is leaking, you'll find that the EGR cooler is starting to get clogged up with soot. The coolant isn't always burned off and the excess soot is caught in the cooler fins and starts to plug up. You'll soon start to see EGR flow rate codes after this, but it can occasionally take a while for this to develop to trouble code status. Depends on the severity of the leak. If you see excess soot buildup in the EGR, it could point to a leak. It wont always be clean or wet, especially after this much drive time after the original issue. My 0.02.

 

[dustbowl_dodge]

Thanks Tach_tech, the truck is running great all the time while it is running hot. It has not misfired at all. I know there is no coolant on the ground and the oil level is at normal all the while. The truck had a delete kit on it when we bought it and we took it off and replaced all the EGR parts with used parts. I'm hoping that is where the problem is found.
Since my last post I've found that there are bubbles coming out of the radiator fill hole, with the cap off, while the truck is running. Would that in itself be an indicator of where the leak might be???

Bubbles in the coolant system mean that gases are being pushed into the coolant. If there was a head gasket leak you would see the leak or have coolant in the oil (most cases), but most probable is that you are getting exhaust gases into coolant through the EGR cooler. Check outlet of EGR cooler for caked soot and/or puddled coolant. If you don't see either, smell for a sweet smelling scent. If you smell it, odds are your EGR cooler is bad.

 

[Tach_tech]

New to the forum here. Hello all!!!! As a heavy duty mechanic I felt this was one thread I could touch on. Check your EGR cooler for internal leaks. I'd be willing to bet you're leaking coolant into the intake through the cooler. When the EGR cooler doesn't have coolant running through it and then runs hot, that's when it develops a hole in the cooler fins. Look in your intake after the EGR crossover and if you smell a sweet scent then you have coolant leaking in the intake. You might also be able to smell a sweet smell in the exhaust. With as much coolant as you're adding it sounds like a bed EGR cooler to me.

OP has had the cooler replaced already, it’s mentioned on page 4.

 

[dustbowl_dodge]

Apologies all around, didn't see the fix had been figured. Still trying to keep up with the forum as a newbie.

 

[John Hickman]

Apologies all around, didn't see the fix had been figured. Still trying to keep up with the forum as a newbie.

Thanks for the comments Dustbowl, your perspective is appreciated!! While in Hot Springs, we found the EGR cooler was leaking by doing exactly as you suggested.
This problem started out in Feb.with an incompetent mechanic shop working on the truck at the direction of the extended warranty folks. It all started with a loose bolt failing to secure the coolant inlet tube for the EGR cooler. It now seems really crazy that it has taken so long to get the final fix done. We should pick up the truck this week and we will see how it goes from there.