Synthetic Oil

[grizzstang]

Question for everyone, do the 6.4's suffer cam issues like the 5.7?

They use the same MDS lifters.

I would think both cams come from the same supplier too. Anyone know?

 

[CanadianNick]

Isn’t industry standard “high milage” technically anything over 75,000.... ?

I guess ......

But in reality 75000 miles isn’t that much

 

[U&A]

Question for everyone, do the 6.4's suffer cam issues like the 5.7?

They use the same MDS lifters.

I would think both cams come from the same supplier too. Anyone know?

We haven’t seen it to near the same extent but we have seen it. I think the scenarios were slightly different and that we have seen the 5.7’s have cam failures and we feel it is a relation to the oil and poop quality run of cams. I’m not sure if I’ve seen the same scenario with the 6.4 but we have seen cam failures from heavily used/worked 6.4s

Anyone else remember cam failures in a 6.4?

 

[Ramnewbie]

We haven’t seen it to near the same extent but we have seen it. I think the scenarios were slightly different and that we have seen the 5.7’s have cam failures and we feel it is a relation to the oil and poop quality run of cams. I’m not sure if I’ve seen the same scenario with the 6.4 but we have seen cam failures from heavily used/worked 6.4s

Anyone else remember cam failures in a 6.4?

The only ones I recall are high mileage ones that have been worked all their lives.

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[Burla]

Well the 6.4's certainly have hemi tick in many of them!

 

[Burla]

Nick I would also check my pcv and certainly change it now if you haven't. Usually a simple procedure but I don't know about your engine that would be an overdo item at 90k miles. I'm pretty sure the industry norm is what happens to engine at 75k miles as far as break in and loosening of tolerances why they get the designation HM as far as oils are concerned. But I have no info on that, maybe something we should look into.

 

[CanadianNick]

Yeah I can look into that as well. I’ve already done spark plugs. As far as the oil is concerned for the time being I’m gonna let it do it’s thing and see what happens. If it doesn’t help any on my next oil change I’ll try a HM oil

 

[Hemi395]

Not sure about the cam, but the 6.4 lifters are the same PN as the 5.7. if the cams are the same PN, that should indicate the cam failures in the 5.7s are due to 20wt oil...

 

[grizzstang]

The cams are different part numbers but if they are made by the same supplier then I feel the failures can still be blamed on 20wt oil.

I believe these are OEM cam part numbers for each:

5038419AB = 6.4
53022263AF = 5.7

It is odd that in many cases the lifter fails (stops rolling) and starts digging into the cam but the 6.4's don't seem to suffer the problem as often.

 

[U&A]

Not sure about the cam, but the 6.4 lifters are the same PN as the 5.7. if the cams are the same PN, that should indicate the cam failures in the 5.7s are due to 20wt oil...

Hay!

That makes to much sense. It just cant be the whiskey thin oil doing it.

The cams are different part numbers but if they are made by the same supplier then I feel the failures can still be blamed on 20wt oil.

I believe these are OEM cam part numbers for each:

5038419AB = 6.4
53022263AF = 5.7

It is odd that in many cases the lifter fails (stops rolling) and starts digging into the cam but the 6.4's don't seem to suffer the problem as often.

Agreed

 

[Ramnewbie]

It seems to me it's more a lifter problem than a cam problem. There have been several repairs documented by dealers just replacing lifters. The only other real difference between the 5.7 and 6.4 other than the oil could be valve spring pressure.

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[Fitz-0518]

Cause and effect. We all sure know what the effect is. Its the cause that is so interesting. We know that some lifters have come to assembly from the vendor with offset push rod seats. That resultes in bent push rods. We know the rollers dig into the cam lobes. Lifter spring pressure to high? We know that Ram went to a heavier valve spring in the 6.1 after the 5.7 springs were found to be defective and to light. Or is it the cam steel, the forging process, the hardening process. Just think, roller cam systems have been around forever. How can one company get this so wrong.

 

[Ramnewbie]

I had read awhile ago that it was in 15 I think they lightened the valve spring tension in the 5.7. Probably a year ago I read that so I have no clue as to where I found it now.

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[U&A]

I had read awhile ago that it was in 15 I think they lightened the valve spring tension in the 5.7. Probably a year ago I read that so I have no clue as to where I found it now.

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Thats not the first time iv heard that from someone

 

[Burla]

I still hope on there will be movement on the mechanical side of the issue where redline wouldn't be necessary. I would think it is possible there is a simple fix that doesn't include a cam swap. Like fitz says lifter spring pressure or something that I admit I should have spent more time exploring.

 

[Ramnewbie]

I still hope on there will be movement on the mechanical side of the issue where redline wouldn't be necessary. I would think it is possible there is a simple fix that doesn't include a cam swap. Like fitz says lifter spring pressure or something that I admit I should have spent more time exploring.

I don't know, after the results in my engine I'd say redline would be required fix or no fix.

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[R.L.K.]

Cause and effect. We all sure know what the effect is. Its the cause that is so interesting. We know that some lifters have come to assembly from the vendor with offset push rod seats. That resultes in bent push rods. We know the rollers dig into the cam lobes. Lifter spring pressure to high? We know that Ram went to a heavier valve spring in the 6.1 after the 5.7 springs were found to be defective and to light. Or is it the cam steel, the forging process, the hardening process. Just think, roller cam systems have been around forever. How can one company get this so wrong.

Damn good post imo ...

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[Fitz-0518]

Damn good post imo ...

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You guys made me think. Need to look up the part number for 5.7, 6.1 and 6.4 lifter springs. If each has a different part number,,,,I think that would say, each have a different spring tension.

 

[Hemi395]

Never thought about the valve spring tension being an issue. But it makes sense that if it's too much tension it's going to put too much pressure on the rollers of the lifter. Couple that with 5w20 and there you go.

 

[chrisbh17]

Im staying with 5W-30, but the PUP still hasnt quieted down.

Giving it to the end of July and if its not better Ill be going to PYB. Pains me to buy it, because its not very much cheaper than PUP!