Synthetic Oil

[Treburkulosis]

Maybe Dodge isn't telling me a lie... I just ran across this. It still does concern me. We have never gotten past 28k miles on any of our previous Pentastar engines. The wife keeps them 2-3 years and then she wants something new. We are approaching year 3 with the jeep. She actually likes this one and plans to keep it for at least 3-4 more years. Its a very good looking Jeep IMO.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/pentastar-startup-rattle.330287/

 

[Burla]

What is odd, is that the 0w20 seems to do better then the 5w20 in the heat. The rattle at start up was a lot worse. I am hoping our road trip next week will really allow the lubeguard to work. She drives mostly city driving for her work. I have noticed my ram when its doing city driving acts a lot different. If it continues past the next 2-3 oil changes I will try 5w30. I am about 15k until the warranty is done. Dodge has told me that this is totally normal... Go figure lol.

sorry, what 0w20 and 5w20? And you are saying the 0w20 is worse, just not for a week?

So you buy them and get a new one every 3-4 years? damn bud, you are leaving meat on the bone. I see this one she might get 7 years.

 

[Treburkulosis]

sorry, what 0w20 and 5w20? And you are saying the 0w20 is worse, just not for a week?

The 0w20 is slightly better then the 5w20. It just came back in less then 2 weeks.

 

[Burla]

my wife used to ;pull that ihsht on me as well, I stopped asking and started telling, i said wife you pick the vehicle your best choice, and then we will go ten years. Now we are year 13 and she still driving it, I'm gonna wrap it to encourage her to even keep it longer. plus I was very happy with her choice, now if I could find a way to like her family as much as her rav 4.

 

[HEMIMANN]

I am familiar with the GM LS piston slap and it is definitely not like that. Its a dry rattle on start up. Its hard enough if its pulled in with the stereo up at night, you can hear it. Its a pretty rough shake and then its fine after 1-2 seconds. Its also only after it sits over night. It doesn't do it after a cold start in the morning.

Wrist pins? Lifter bleed down?

 

[HEMIMANN]

The 0w20 is slightly better then the 5w20. It just came back in less then 2 weeks.

Sure seems like early flow issue for lifters.

 

[Treburkulosis]

Wrist pins? Lifter bleed down?

What I am reading is that the design allows all of the oil to drain down after as short as 30 minutes. The design of the filter housing is plastic and they crack and fail. There is an upgraded aluminum one.

It looks like this will be happening in the near future.

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[Burla]

If you are gonna try redline, I'd at least pop one quart 5w30 in the sump with whatever 20 weight you chose.

 

[Treburkulosis]

If you are gonna try redline, I'd at least pop one quart 5w30 in the sump with whatever 20 weight you chose.

I will say this. The owners manual has the motor at 5 quarts. It always on the low side of full. This time I added an extra quart which took it to the top of full. I am seeing better Oil pressure as well. I have no problem paying for Redline. It just appears that I got the random difficult 3.6... Challenge accepted. I will try redline 5w20 with a 5w30 last quart and see how that goes.

 

[ramffml]

I will say this. The owners manual has the motor at 5 quarts. It always on the low side of full. This time I added an extra quart which took it to the top of full. I am seeing better Oil pressure as well. I have no problem paying for Redline. It just appears that I got the random difficult 3.6... Challenge accepted. I will try redline 5w20 with a 5w30 last quart and see how that goes.

I don't think you're going to fix it with oil. That thread you linked has an ex pentastar engineer saying "it's normal".

To add a little more information its just some valve clatter because they are not fully up to pressure yet. The cam phasers also need to get filled up as they take a good amount of oil and if the car sat for a while they can be almost empty. The lines to those are larger so they take the first few ounces followed by the more restrictive galleys/mechanisms. All those systems have springs in them so there is no damage for the fraction of a second it happens. It is noisy though!

In general Pentastar heads are complicated and it takes time to get all the head lines pressurized. Around 0.5 seconds....

 

[Treburkulosis]

I don't think you're going to fix it with oil. That thread you linked has an ex pentastar engineer saying "it's normal".

My hopes are low, but hey we didn't think we would ever see the day of preventing or fixing the Hemi tick. I wish there was an option for a relocation filter that allowed for an actual filter not a cartilage.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Just like Hemi tick is normal. For a bad design, that is. Hence this thread.

 

[HEMIMANN]

My hopes are low, but hey we didn't think we would ever see the day of preventing or fixing the Hemi tick. I wish there was an option for a relocation filter that allowed for an actual filter not a cartilage.

Did you check @Wild one plumbing for Hemis? Maybe you can modify to fit pentastar?

 

[Hemi395]

A little 3.6 update. Still getting the hard rattle start with the 21 Jeep. PUP and Lubeguard are not the answer. @Burla I am thinking Redline and a filter change is next up. Its the canister filter. Do you have an knowledge of which ones are the best? Its currently using the Puralator Boss Filter. I am wondering if I need to do a seafoam flush like I did with my Ram when it started ticking. It has never rattled until about 3k miles ago.

Both my wife's 2020 and 2017 Grand Cherokee 3.6 had a a nasty startup rattle using PUP 0w20 and whatever the dealer used for oil. I'm assuming it was bulk PP 0w20.

Give Amsoil SS 0w20 a try, both the current 2020 and her 2017 ran butter smooth on it. I tried RL 0w20 in her 2017 and it was virtually as quiet as the SS 0w20 so I just went with the SS since I can get it cheaper. We're planning on buying out the 2020 in August and once we do it's going to get SS 0w30.

Personally I would avoid PUP/PP in the the 3.6, that startup rattle was very disconcerting.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Huh - must be full Group IV / V base oil?

Don't recall Amsoil or PUP having high moly additive in those low vis grades.

 

[Burla]

Huh - must be full Group IV / V base oil?

Don't recall Amsoil or PUP having high moly additive in those low vis grades.

post 48,493 5w30 ss = 211ppm moly, I dont know if it is outliar.

 

[Hemi395]

All of the SS lineup has 200+ppm of moly with the SP reformulation

 

[HEMIMANN]

post 48,493 5w30 ss = 211ppm moly, I dont know if it is outliar.

Thanks, my shaky memory had only SS 0W-40 with higher moly, just like PUP.
Blenders change formulas so much I can't keep them straight.
None of this ridiculous crap was necessary 20 years back.

 

[HEMIMANN]

All of the SS lineup has 200+ppm of moly with the SP reformulation

Ta Da!!

 

[Treburkulosis]

So this morning the cold start was normal. I am now wondering if the lubegard finally got to work in it. It was smoother then its ever been. Old faithful got another round of lubegard at 160k and it fired right up as always no rattles and idles so smoothly.