Synthetic Oil

Oil of Choice

  • Castrol Syntec/Edge

    Votes: 237 8.5%
  • Royal Purple

    Votes: 327 11.8%
  • AMSOil

    Votes: 400 14.4%
  • Valvoline Synpower

    Votes: 160 5.8%
  • Mobil 1

    Votes: 994 35.8%
  • Other

    Votes: 662 23.8%

  • Total voters
    2,780

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Bigpaul13

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How does this HOLD any water ?? My 6.4 has 0w oil and noisy as hell on start up ??

How does going from 5w to 0w prove anything ?????????????????


Funny how folks are SO quick to claim a WEIGHT change as a fix VS BRAND they are using............................


THE Master oil Changer
Better flow on cold start ups. I'm pretty sure there's a few guys running 5w30 Redline in warmer months and 0w30 Redline in colder months. No brand change. Most guys reported positive results. I plan on trying 0w30 for my winter change as well. 5w30 is a little noisey on cold mornings even with the mild winter last year.

If you have the time, try reading through this thread from the beginning. It's impressive the amount of time and oil guys have tried to get these trucks sounding good. You can also see and hear clips of how trucks sound running different oil/filter combinations. Alot of the talk in this thread is about the 5.7 even though some guys are posting results with the 6.4. Maybe you should message some of them and see what they're running.
 

HammerHead

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Good morning gentleman, now that its getting cold here are the Redline cSt values down to 20 degrees. One thing ive always hated about oil information sheets is they always give you 100/40 degrees C; that's operating temperatures and 104 degrees F. That 40 degrees C is 104 degrees F, that tells you NOTHING about cold flow characteristics.
If your in a cold state this might be informative.
 

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  • REDLINE 20, 30, 40.pdf
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Burla

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Here it is as a photo, might be easier to see on a mobil device.

View attachment 227119

Very impressive chart, looks like you do it yourself? I'd like to see it go even further like to -20f. I like 0w30 because it offers the good cst at operating temp, plus many guys on the board have it kill their piston slap, experiences of the board is huge, nobody has complained yet about 0w30.

But as I've been saying for a year now since piston slap came up, don't be afraid of 0w20 ram forum. Hammers post explains why. You see why 0w30 or any 0 winter rating oil only buys you -5 degrees in operating viscosity, because they are close to their cousin 5w30 or 10w30 in cold performance. In other words weight is the biggest factor in cold performance, 5w20 is better then 0w30 or 0w40 in cold performance.

If you look at a standard visc chart it looks confusing, why? Because the factor the viscosity charts omit is that the application calls for a certain weight oil to begin with, so when they say 0w20, 0w30, and 0w40 all have the same low operating performance the chart itself takes into account the application that may call for a thicker oil.

Hammers chart is clearly in conflict with this chart without that key fact, hammers chart is 1,000 correct for oil weight, this chart is 1,000 correct when you add in the consideration of the application itself. Which is another reason to consider hammers chart more if you are having a real hard time with cold performance and that 0 rated oil. Hammers chart spells out why, 0 winter rated oil will only buy you so much performance, but going down in weight buys you a lot more.

Engine-Oil-Viscosity-Chart.png

Also, if you have hemi tick plus cold piston slap like corey, justin, kyle and others. Then you have to pick your battle, in viscosity terms what is good for one isn't good for the other. High cSt good for tick, bad for piston slap. The good news is that it isn't always just about viscosity, if that was true then lubegard wouldn't be killing those hemi ticks that it kills. So same thing we have been doing, use high additive with beneficial ep additives and the oil the balances both piston slap and tick. However, if you have to fix one, warm idle tick is what I would worry about most, cold piston slap sounds bad but isn't nearly as dangerous as warm idle tick that eats those cams.

The other option is a sump heater, maybe the best option. A sump heater can make a 40 or 50 weight oil have better cold performance then a 0w20. I know guys like Corey and Kyle have also at least went to engine block heating. Which is another weigh to avoid cold piston slap, as the cold itself is what is to blame for cold piston slap. Two more options to avoid cold piston slap, heating the block or heating the sump. Maybe those guys can chime in on how effective that has been? There is a lot more to consider even at 20f, no matter what like hammers chart shows the oil is just thicker at 20f. But, there are many strategies a guy can take, engine heating, sump magnet heater, going down in winter rating, and/or going down in weight.
 

HammerHead

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Yes I do it myself, it’s not hard but more time consuming. I have to calculate every temperature change for every oil and then convert from Celsius to Fahrenheit. It really is a pain but I’ll work on getting that -20 chart for our northern brothers.
 

Burla

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good job
 

Bigpaul13

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Very impressive chart, looks like you do it yourself? I'd like to see it go even further like to -20f. I like 0w30 because it offers the good cst at operating temp, plus many guys on the board have it kill their piston slap, experiences of the board is huge, nobody has complained yet about 0w30.

But as I've been saying for a year now since piston slap came up, don't be afraid of 0w20 ram forum. Hammers post explains why. You see why 0w30 or any 0 winter rating oil only buys you -5 degrees in operating viscosity, because they are close to their cousin 5w30 or 10w30 in cold performance. In other words weight is the biggest factor in cold performance, 5w20 is better then 0w30 or 0w40 in cold performance.

If you look at a standard visc chart it looks confusing, why? Because the factor the viscosity charts omit is that the application calls for a certain weight oil to begin with, so when they say 0w20, 0w30, and 0w40 all have the same low operating performance the chart itself takes into account the application that may call for a thicker oil.

Hammers chart is clearly in conflict with this chart without that key fact, hammers chart is 1,000 correct for oil weight, this chart is 1,000 correct when you add in the consideration of the application itself. Which is another reason to consider hammers chart more if you are having a real hard time with cold performance and that 0 rated oil. Hammers chart spells out why, 0 winter rated oil will only buy you so much performance, but going down in weight buys you a lot more.

Engine-Oil-Viscosity-Chart.png

Also, if you have hemi tick plus cold piston slap like corey, justin, kyle and others. Then you have to pick your battle, in viscosity terms what is good for one isn't good for the other. High cSt good for tick, bad for piston slap. The good news is that it isn't always just about viscosity, if that was true then lubegard wouldn't be killing those hemi ticks that it kills. So same thing we have been doing, use high additive with beneficial ep additives and the oil the balances both piston slap and tick. However, if you have to fix one, warm idle tick is what I would worry about most, cold piston slap sounds bad but isn't nearly as dangerous as warm idle tick that eats those cams.

The other option is a sump heater, maybe the best option. A sump heater can make a 40 or 50 weight oil have better cold performance then a 0w20. I know guys like Corey and Kyle have also at least went to engine block heating. Which is another weigh to avoid cold piston slap, as the cold itself is what is to blame for cold piston slap. Two more options to avoid cold piston slap, heating the block or heating the sump. Maybe those guys can chime in on how effective that has been? There is a lot more to consider even at 20f, no matter what like hammers chart shows the oil is just thicker at 20f. But, there are many strategies a guy can take, engine heating, sump magnet heater, going down in winter rating, and/or going down in weight.

So with all of that said, would you recommend going to 0w30 from 5w30 in the colder months to begin with? Or would you think it's better to go to 5w20 first? I ran 5w30 last winter without issue but there was some piston slap on cold mornings. It was a mild winter as well. I also had some tick but my manifolds were leaking at the the same time so not sure if redline or the new bolts made the difference but she's quiet now.
 

HammerHead

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This is what I call separating the men from the boys; here it is down to -20F. First oil to stand out is Redline 0W40 out flowing all the 30's and the 5W20. I think this is because the 0W40 has a Viscosity Index of 190, but I cant be sure. Seems unlikely but i triple checked it and included the conversion link:

http://www.nimacltd.co.uk/viscosity...en-the-viscosity-is-known-at-two-temperatures

If you find any errors let me know and ill make the change and repost. Keep in mind the conversion site is in C, so -20F is -28.8C. Be sure to add the minus (-) to the formula.

REDLINE.jpg
 

Flame Red Rebel

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Called WAY over thinking it................

I need them to last maybe 100K miles, then dump them off.

NOW yes, I had plans on 1 million mile engine then maybe tis makes sense.

Spend months in third world country's like I have and MAYBE U might know a thing about oil........................
 

Burla

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So with all of that said, would you recommend going to 0w30 from 5w30 in the colder months to begin with? Or would you think it's better to go to 5w20 first? I ran 5w30 last winter without issue but there was some piston slap on cold mornings. It was a mild winter as well. I also had some tick but my manifolds were leaking at the the same time so not sure if redline or the new bolts made the difference but she's quiet now.

With the hemi, my opinion is to follow the noises of the engine. I know some guys go crazy with this, which is not my intention, we have guys so scared about hemi tick they think any noise is a sign. This was the downside of all of this talk.

But, I would run 5w30 redline as much as possible if it were me, in the 5.7 and 6.4. The most proven tick killer and guys with hemi tick have smooth engines that have lasted a decade in a lot of cases, including mine which was silenced in 2011, so soon to be a decade. Very low miles, but many other guys also came on board 2011 and 2012 with this strategy and knock wood so far so good.

The only time I would consider anything other then 5w30 redline (my opinion only on this) is if you get cold piston slap. Then I would go to whatever worked even 0w20 as long as I don't have warm idle tick and if possible kill cold piston slap. Also, don't forget the other options if you are in the cold, engine block heating or sump heating. I forget who put theirs in first but they both did it, kyle and corey, so how is it working guys?? hopefully they chime in because they both are in snow and both had cold piston and both had hemi tick.

According to Hammers chart 0w30 is a very short swing at the issue of cold piston slap, whereas 20 weight anything would be a larger one. If 20 weight keeps piston slap and hemi tick away but 5w30 has cold piston slap, I would use 5w20. I had good luck with 5w20 redline personally, I was one of the last guys to move to 5w30 of this group.

Either choice 20 weight redline or 0w30 comes with a risk, pick your poison. 0w30 redline has been a proven tick killer even in rams that ticked on 5w20 redline- IE corey's truck, proven and backed with audio/video, and also in his truck was "better" at cold piston slap. To be honest, he is the guy you should be asking. In theory one will be better at cold piston slap and the other one will be better at hemi tick. It's a judgement call, what works in Corey's truck might not work in your truck, what works in mine might not work in yours. Corey and I have had completely different results with same redlines. Hope you make the right choice and save yourself from wasting some oil.
 

HammerHead

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Called WAY over thinking it................

I need them to last maybe 100K miles, then dump them off.

NOW yes, I had plans on 1 million mile engine then maybe tis makes sense.

Spend months in third world country's like I have and MAYBE U might know a thing about oil........................

United States Marine right here, I know a little about third world countries LOL. And a self proclaimed oil nerd. That should be OK on an oil thread dedicated to oil discussion LOL.
 

Burla

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This is what I call separating the men from the boys; here it is down to -20F. First oil to stand out is Redline 0W40 out flowing all the 30's and the 5W20. I think this is because the 0W40 has a Viscosity Index of 190, but I cant be sure. Seems unlikely but i triple checked it and included the conversion link:

http://www.nimacltd.co.uk/viscosity...en-the-viscosity-is-known-at-two-temperatures

If you find any errors let me know and ill make the change and repost. Keep in mind the conversion site is in C, so -20F is -28.8C. Be sure to add the minus (-) to the formula.

View attachment 227172

Thanks, but how did you get the numbers? I might be wrong, but the 0w20 and 5w20 numbers at -20f seams off to me, maybe I'm wrong?
 

Flame Red Rebel

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United States Marine right here, I know a little about third world countries LOL. And a self proclaimed oil nerd. That should be OK on an oil thread dedicated to oil discussion LOL.



We do not own a RARE race car here, just a DD of some sort. So the OVER NERD it make no sense to me.


Just sayin for the newbie oil changer that changes his/her car every 4 years this is still WAY over kill.


But what do I know, i get it. Should NO nothing after changing oil for a living.

Any oil, any filter and DRIVE to proper temps is the holy grail to fountain of youth.............


read again, PROPER oil TEMP is the SEcret #$@$@$
 

HammerHead

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Here is an example, the 100/40 cSt is set by the oil manufacturers, so those numbers don’t change. But the operating temperature that I circulated is whatever you want it to be. 10,20,30 degrees all the way up to whatever you want to see. You just have to calculate the Celsius to Fahrenheit and vice versa.
In the example below those are redline 0W40 cSt numbers off their website, all I did is add the operating temperature of -28.8 Celsius which converts into -20°F. So you can literally put in any temperature you want and see the Oil perform at. Really cool.

C895B55C-F1CC-4DE8-8471-EB00BF5A87CA.jpeg
 

Hemi395

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Yes I do it myself, it’s not hard but more time consuming. I have to calculate every temperature change for every oil and then convert from Celsius to Fahrenheit. It really is a pain but I’ll work on getting that -20 chart for our northern brothers.

Awesome thanks!
 
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