Why would this cause and fix lifter noise?

[Jason S]

Hey guys, I am new to the forum and this is my 3rd vehicle with a hemi but the first to have engine problems, any help would be greatly appreciated.
Quick history of this issue. In the past 2 months it has been at the dealership 3 times for loud lifter noise. Both sets on the passenger side have been replaced and 1 set on the driver side, so 12 out of the 16 are new. The third time the tech noticed the new lifters on the passenger side had already failed again, turns out the cylinder head was possibly blocked and not letting enough oil through, they replaced this cylinder head. A week went by with a nice quiet truck until a WOT was needed to pass a turtle on wheels, the loud lifter tick came back on the drivers side. 3 days later another turtle on wheels appeared, followed by a WOT to about 70mph. This fixed the lifter noise and it is quiet again. Any ideas as to why this would possibly cause this noise and also seem to fix it at the same time? 2021 Ram 1500 Classic Warlock, 5.7L with 39,000 miles.

 

[Curmudgeon]

You mentioned that "...the cylinder head was possibly blocked and not letting enough oil through, they replaced this cylinder head." so I'm wondering what oil and oil filter you are using, and how often you change them.

I am a technician but not an auto technician, but this question was the first I wanted to ask, especially since the new head (and valve trains) may not have fixed the issue.

 

[Jason S]

Hey thanks for the response. I bought the truck in February with about 36,000 miles on it. Since then, I have tried PUP 5w-30, with the Fram synthetic filter. That didn't quite the lifter noise so I tried Redline 5w-30 that was recommended on here with the same Fram oil filter. Since then the dealership has changed the old 4 times after the lifter replacements. I asked them and they use Pennzoil Yellow 5w 20, and some very cheap filter. I haven't changed to better oil again until I know this lifter noise is all fixed.

 

[Curmudgeon]

Sounds like what my dealer used, a Mopar paper filter, and I always requested their full synthetic oil which they claimed was Pennzoil but they could never prove it.

Even so my 2014 5.7 made it to about 90k miles with that treatment. I bought mine used with 20,000 miles.

I now have 113,000 miles and still no tick. For about the last 20,000 miles I have been using either PUP 5w-20 or Red Line 5w-30 along with an oversize Royal Purple filter. So - similar to yours. Fram also makes an oversize synthetic filter that is among the best you can use.

The only other thing I can add (as I am not a mechanic) is simply what I have read from a couple folks here... our Hemis are performance engines and can benefit from being drive "like a r.a.p.e.d. ape" rather than like grandpa. I am a grandpa and drive mine gently and make too many short trips, so as often as I can I press the TOW/HAUL button and really get into it. I'll also take it out on the highway just because.
I say all this because of your WOT experience.

Hopefully someone can chime in with more/better ideas as well as the number for the oversize Fram filter...

 

[Wild one]

Hey thanks for the response. I bought the truck in February with about 36,000 miles on it. Since then, I have tried PUP 5w-30, with the Fram synthetic filter. That didn't quite the lifter noise so I tried Redline 5w-30 that was recommended on here with the same Fram oil filter. Since then the dealership has changed the old 4 times after the lifter replacements. I asked them and they use Pennzoil Yellow 5w 20, and some very cheap filter. I haven't changed to better oil again until I know this lifter noise is all fixed.

Did they replace the cam,if not sounds like they're just trying to band-aid it together long enough it lasts till it's off warrenty,then you get to eat the bill for a new cam and lifters

 

[Jason S]

Fram also makes an oversize synthetic filter that is among the best you can use.

I have the Fram XG2 on standby along with PUP 5w-30, just waiting for the truck to behave so the dealership does not just dump my new oil. Is this the filter you are referring too?

 

[Jason S]

Did they replace the cam,if not sounds like they're just trying to band-aid it together long enough it lasts till it's off warrenty,then you get to eat the bill for a new cam and lifters

No they have not....he said there were no signs of wear on the cam which I questioned in my brain.

 

[EdGs]

I have the Fram XG2 on standby along with PUP 5w-30, just waiting for the truck to behave so the dealership does not just dump my new oil. Is this the filter you are referring too?

XG2 is a good filter, there's also an FE2 as well, supposedly a step up from the XG2.

 

[Jason S]

XG2 is a good filter, there's also an FE2 as well, supposedly a step up from the XG2.

Ahhh, I will remember that for future oil changes. They royal purple filter was not avaliable at the time and I read about these being good as well. Thanks for the tip.

 

[Curmudgeon]

Ahhh, I will remember that for future oil changes. They royal purple filter was not avaliable at the time and I read about these being good as well. Thanks for the tip.

The oversize Royal Purple filter is 20-820. Royal Purple Direct dot Com doesn't seem the have them in stock, which is good because they are asking $34.99 plus shipping.

This site seems to have them for $13.99. I have them bookmarked. Myself and several others have used this site. They are cheap, fast, and trustworthy...

https://www.myautoparts123.com/royal-purple-20-820-4-spin-on-oil-filter

This little graph will show you the results of filter testing for fine particle efficiency...

 

[Heatheroo]

Ahhh, I will remember that for future oil changes. They royal purple filter was not avaliable at the time and I read about these being good as well. Thanks for the tip.

If you go with a FE2, prepare to get creative when trying to get it into position……but….it will fit!

 

[EdGs]

Mines a 2wd, not sure if 4wd makes a difference in room. I did have to tip it to get it up in there, but it fit ok.

Had used the XG2 for several changes before now, same physical size.

I have heard that the XG2 won't fit for some, though. Not sure why.

 

[Jason S]

This site seems to have them for $13.99. I have them bookmarked. Myself and several others have used this site. They are cheap, fast, and trustworthy...

Thanks I will bookmark that site.

 

[Jason S]

Should I just change the oil and filter and see if it comes back or ride it out a little while longer? I'm hesitant because the Redline had about 1500 miles on it and the PUP had a few hundred miles when the dealership dumped it and you all know it isn't cheap oil. I still am curious why WOT would cause the tick then days later stop it, could something be loose that shifts during high RPMs?

 

[Curmudgeon]

I can't answer your question, but an oil change could end up being the
less expensive alternative to engine surgery, by far.

Is there a Walmart near you? PUP 5w-20 or 5w-30 and an FE2 or XG2 filter...

PUP Oil by the quart or 5 gallon jug: https://www.walmart.com/search?q=pennzoil ultra platinum&typeahead=pennzoil

FRAM XG2: https://www.walmart.com/ip/FRAM-Ult...4?classType=VARIANT&athbdg=L1600&from=/search

FRAM FE2: https://www.walmart.com/ip/FRAM-Syn...les/1289827904?classType=VARIANT&from=/search

Wally World seems to keep a good quantity of everything, in stock, and one of the Fram filters, not sure which, is ONLY available at Walmart. Both filters seem to be among the best and PUP is no slouch either. I currently have a Hemi full of Red Line and I know how expensive that can be. Maybe switch to Red Line once your engine has been running nice and quiet for a while.

IIRC, both PUP weights will show about 8-9 cst viscosity while the Red Line 5w-30 should test at about 12+ cst. The slightly thinner viscosity of the PUP might flow better this time of year,

Just my 0.02, and I am certified to add my own gas and change my own air filters.

So I have that working for me.
Which is nice.

 

[Burla]

It's called an italian tuneup for a reason, wot just splash lubricated your cam and lifters, maybe opened up passages. On your dash you see oil psi on evic, see what happens when you add throttle. So you had to pay for all of this? And you had lifter tick but no engine code? No CEL? Just curious, it sounds like redline didn't work at quieting it? But it didn't have a lot of miles? How it is sounding NOW?

 

[Jason S]

It's called an italian tuneup for a reason, wot just splash lubricated your cam and lifters, maybe opened up passages. On your dash you see oil psi on evic, see what happens when you add throttle. So you had to pay for all of this? And you had lifter tick but no engine code? No CEL? Just curious, it sounds like redline didn't work at quieting it? But it didn't have a lot of miles? How it is sounding NOW?

No engine code just a really loud metal clanking from the engine at all RPMs. Luckily it is all warranty work but at this point the truck has been at the dealership more than my house the past 2 months. Redline dis nothing to quiet it, but the tech said that lifter during that service was in bad shape. Only 39000 miles, starting to think it is a lemon. I just got back from running errands and WOT to 60, ticking is back again

 

[Jason S]

Is there a Walmart near you? PUP 5w-20 or 5w-30 and an FE2 or XG2 filter...

I have PUP and the fram filter in the garage, just not wanting to change the oil if it is just going to get dumped again. I have an appointment next Thursday..yay

 

[Burla]

No engine code just a really loud metal clanking from the engine at all RPMs. Luckily it is all warranty work but at this point the truck has been at the dealership more than my house the past 2 months. Redline dis nothing to quiet it, but the tech said that lifter during that service was in bad shape. Only 39000 miles, starting to think it is a lemon. I just got back from running errands and WOT to 60, ticking is back again

yeah bad deal, to your question I wouldn't change an oil til they figure it out, glad you ain't paying!

 

[Jason S]

yeah bad deal, to your question I wouldn't change an oil til they figure it out, glad you ain't paying!

Thanks for the advice. I hope they figure it out this time or I may consult a lawyer. I can't do lemon law because I bought it used but there are other ways to make FCA pay for the truck and all equity I have in it. I'd rather not go that route because I like the truck....when it doesn't sound like a blacksmith lives inside it.