Blackstone - used oil analysis

[HEMIMANN]

Per my post above Amsoil and Cummins/Fleetguard use the same lab (Polaris laboratories also known as Horizon) to test oil samples...

Amsoil site seems far more user-friendly than buying a 10 pack kit direct?

 

[Musky Mike]

Changed to Redline 5w-30 at 2000 miles. 45psi hot pressure at idle.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Both iron and copper reduction shows those are break-in wear. The factory oil was obviously 5W-20. You'll have much better results with 5W-30 (low wear), and preserve your lifters with Red Line formula.

You're on the right track!

 

[Musky Mike]

Wear looks terrible to me at 50K. Seen much better looking through these posts.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Hemis are high iron engines. Look at the wear @ 2,000 mile break-in oil.

 

[06 Dodge]

Amsoil site seems far more user-friendly than buying a 10 pack kit direct?

Just remember that Polaris labs is not going have a big comments like your HEMI great and can do xyz, they only give you info related to your oil sample. Oh they will not compare your oil to give you the average results of all Hemi engines tested, so if you are in the need for hand holding then pay the extra $$ to Blackstone labs

 

[HEMIMANN]

Just remember that Polaris labs is not going have a big comments like your HEMI great and can do xyz, they only give you info related to your oil sample. Oh they will not compare your oil to give you the average results of all Hemi engines tested, so if you are in the need for hand holding then pay the extra $$ to Blackstone labs

Right, but in my case, I was educated by Mobil how to interpret results for customers. So, I'm a different case.

Blackstone's comments are hit and miss. The review i cited above they didn't even notice elevated parameters.

What i need is a user advocate forum, this one, so we can compare with each other. I've learned Hemi is a high iron engine and high copper break in engine here.

What I'm usually looking for is load sheer and evaporation via UOA vs VOA viscosities.. They can cancel each other, though, so I'd like oxidation that Blackstone doesn't offer. TAN might cover that.

 

[Curmudgeon]

Right, but in my case, I was educated by Mobil how to interpret results for customers. So, I'm a different case.

Blackstone's comments are hit and miss. The review i cited above they didn't even notice elevated parameters.

What i need is a user advocate forum, this one, so we can compare with each other. I've learned Hemi is a high iron engine and high copper break in engine here.

What I'm usually looking for is load sheer and evaporation via UOA vs VOA viscosities.. They can cancel each other, though, so I'd like oxidation that Blackstone doesn't offer. TAN might cover that.

I just received my latest 8 qts of 5w-30 Red Line and I already have my RP20-820.
I just need to get a sample. I have a little over 5k miles on the RL 5w-30 that is
in my truck now. I'll be requesting the TBN and TAN levels. My 2014 is just over 114,000 miles right now. I also have about 1/2 tank of 91 octane with Red Line fuel system cleaner to burn off.

I'll be posting updates here.

 

[Musky Mike]

Good oil test on dyno, no backyard test crap. Very scientific test and he explains how the test is done, double flush with oil so the last oil doesn't contaminate the next oil. Stock oil sample is compared with used sample because some metals are in Stock oil (some molys contains tin, he explains this). He asked if we wanted a test with Redline, please go to the comments and request a Redline test. Thanks

$5 VS $10 Synthetic Oil (Real Engine Results)

Do name brand oils like Amsoil and Royal Purple provide better wear protection compared to store brands like Super Tech and NAPA? Using the dyno at Shaver Sp...

youtu.be

 

[Curmudgeon]

The latest, today, from my Moroso catch can...

This oil is all Red Line 5w-30, with a RP 20-820 filter, PLUS 15oz of LUBEGARD Bio/Tech. Last OCI was 08/01/2024 at 109,755 miles.

The catch can was taken apart and thoroughly emptied, with only one drain, on
September 5, 2024 at 110,881 miles.

I just emptied the catch can again for the 2nd time, this time only using the drain and letting it drip for 2 minutes. Today, 03/01/2025 at 114,249 miles.

Although the pic below shows I am clearly not using a graduated cylinder
It also shows quite a bit of "nasty". This bottle is a 20oz / 591 mL container and is now about 1/4 full.

I want to go the full 5k miles for the next OCI so I still have about 600 miles to go.
I typically drive less than 100 miles/week, so maybe mid-April for next OCI?

So far all of my Blackstone UOAs are well under 5k miles.
Also, because this next oil change will take me through the summer, my plan is to run without the BioTech. I'm not hearing any ticking and never have. I have read here that the BioTech can not only add moly, but can also reduce viscosity, which might have been helpful with the unusual cold we saw here this winter.

I'm thinking I'd like to take advantage of the full viscosity available with Red Line's 5w-30 through the Summer days when temps can get into the mid-90s and above.

Any thoughts from the collective brain-trust on whether or not I should add BioTech for the "summer fill"? The oil and filter are a given and already waiting in the garage.

*NB: The oil level on the dipstick has not moved, not 1mm, although it is about as dark as I normally see it. My upcoming UOA will include TBN/TAN.

 

[quickster2]

I add BioTech year round. At a 5K OCI I'm not worried about a small viscosity drop. I do run 0W40 PUP & Biotech in my 6.4L. I prefer to have the additive vs not.

 

[Burla]

Good oil test on dyno, no backyard test crap. Very scientific test and he explains how the test is done, double flush with oil so the last oil doesn't contaminate the next oil. Stock oil sample is compared with used sample because some metals are in Stock oil (some molys contains tin, he explains this). He asked if we wanted a test with Redline, please go to the comments and request a Redline test. Thanks

$5 VS $10 Synthetic Oil (Real Engine Results)

Do name brand oils like Amsoil and Royal Purple provide better wear protection compared to store brands like Super Tech and NAPA? Using the dyno at Shaver Sp...

youtu.be

a real good part of this video was what happens when you over fill on Dyno, should post in syn thread.

 

[HEMIMANN]

The latest, today, from my Moroso catch can...

This oil is all Red Line 5w-30, with a RP 20-820 filter, PLUS 15oz of LUBEGARD Bio/Tech. Last OCI was 08/01/2024 at 109,755 miles.

The catch can was taken apart and thoroughly emptied, with only one drain, on
September 5, 2024 at 110,881 miles.

I just emptied the catch can again for the 2nd time, this time only using the drain and letting it drip for 2 minutes. Today, 03/01/2025 at 114,249 miles.

Although the pic below shows I am clearly not using a graduated cylinder
It also shows quite a bit of "nasty". This bottle is a 20oz / 591 mL container and is now about 1/4 full.

I want to go the full 5k miles for the next OCI so I still have about 600 miles to go.
I typically drive less than 100 miles/week, so maybe mid-April for next OCI?

So far all of my Blackstone UOAs are well under 5k miles.
Also, because this next oil change will take me through the summer, my plan is to run without the BioTech. I'm not hearing any ticking and never have. I have read here that the BioTech can not only add moly, but can also reduce viscosity, which might have been helpful with the unusual cold we saw here this winter.

I'm thinking I'd like to take advantage of the full viscosity available with Red Line's 5w-30 through the Summer days when temps can get into the mid-90s and above.

Any thoughts from the collective brain-trust on whether or not I should add BioTech for the "summer fill"? The oil and filter are a given and already waiting in the garage.

*NB: The oil level on the dipstick has not moved, not 1mm, although it is about as dark as I normally see it. My upcoming UOA will include TBN/TAN.

View attachment 561829

This is outstanding real world test data, thank you for sharing!

Since mass flow is constant (outside of nuclear reactions where some mass is converted to energy), the oil residual in the catch can had to lower the amount in the crankcase. The issue is whether it's enough to be noticeable or measurable on a crude dipstick level. In addition, it is not all oil - it is an emulsion with water from combustion blowby.

Look at the amounts in the bottle - maybe 4 ounces max. between the last oil changes? Hemi sump is 7 quarts. 1 quart is 32 ounces. 7 x 32 ounces = 224 ounces fresh oil per change.

Percentage in catch can = 4 ounces / 224 ounces = 1.8% Is <1.8% lower oil level on a dipstick perceivable? And it is less than 1.8% because it is not pure oil in the catch can.

Regardless of the physics, your catch can once again adds to the database of worthiness - the gunk in your catch can would have been routed right back into the engine, impinging on the the intake valve stem, piston crown, and valve faces, adding to carbon deposit buildup in the engine.

Which causes bad things, man!

 

[Curmudgeon]

This is outstanding real world test data, thank you for sharing!

Since mass flow is constant (outside of nuclear reactions where some mass is converted to energy), the oil residual in the catch can had to lower the amount in the crankcase. The issue is whether it's enough to be noticeable or measurable on a crude dipstick level. In addition, it is not all oil - it is an emulsion with water from combustion blowby.

Look at the amounts in the bottle - maybe 4 ounces max. between the last oil changes? Hemi sump is 7 quarts. 1 quart is 32 ounces. 7 x 32 ounces = 224 ounces fresh oil per change.

Percentage in catch can = 4 ounces / 224 ounces = 1.8% Is <1.8% lower oil level on a dipstick perceivable? And it is less than 1.8% because it is not pure oil in the catch can.

Regardless of the physics, your catch can once again adds to the database of worthiness - the gunk in your catch can would have been routed right back into the engine, impinging on the the intake valve stem, piston crown, and valve faces, adding to carbon deposit buildup in the engine.

Which causes bad things, man!

Thanks @HEMIMANN !

I guess what I was trying to say is that with over 4k miles I can see no loss of oil in the sump from any causes, like burning it, leaking it, etc. I'll gladly put ~2% in the catch can.

And after seeing the infamous chocolate milkshake from the catch can, which has not been there previously (and almost having a heart attack), I immediately checked the dipstick for the same horror, but the sump oil looks good.

Engine still runs quiet, smooth, tick-free, no CELs, and no misses that I can detect via my butt-dyno.

*Also, I just finished a tankful of my usual Top Tier 91 octane, AND, 1 bottle of Red Line Sl-1.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Right - you don't want to flow 4 ounces of gunk through your engine every 4-5000 miles!

Imma put one on my 6.4 shortly.

Your cylinders are nice and tight with this little amount coming out and no noticeable change in dipstick oil level. Catch can will help keep it that way.

 

[Wild one]

This is outstanding real world test data, thank you for sharing!

Since mass flow is constant (outside of nuclear reactions where some mass is converted to energy), the oil residual in the catch can had to lower the amount in the crankcase. The issue is whether it's enough to be noticeable or measurable on a crude dipstick level. In addition, it is not all oil - it is an emulsion with water from combustion blowby.

Look at the amounts in the bottle - maybe 4 ounces max. between the last oil changes? Hemi sump is 7 quarts. 1 quart is 32 ounces. 7 x 32 ounces = 224 ounces fresh oil per change.

Percentage in catch can = 4 ounces / 224 ounces = 1.8% Is <1.8% lower oil level on a dipstick perceivable? And it is less than 1.8% because it is not pure oil in the catch can.

Regardless of the physics, your catch can once again adds to the database of worthiness - the gunk in your catch can would have been routed right back into the engine, impinging on the the intake valve stem, piston crown, and valve faces, adding to carbon deposit buildup in the engine.

Which causes bad things, man!

It also coats the inside of the manifold and intake ports with an oily mess,that takes some work to clean up.Throw in the fact the crud sucked through the pcv system effectively lowers the octane rating of the fuel your using on top of everything else. The guys claiming a catch can isn't needed or is a waste of money on a hemi,i dare you to pull your intake manifold,go ahead don't be chicken,it's only about a 30 minute job to remove the intake,lol

 

[CanuckRam1313]

It also coats the inside of the manifold and intake ports with an oily mess,that takes some work to clean up.Throw in the fact the crud sucked through the pcv system effectively lowers the octane rating of the fuel your using on top of everything else. The guys claiming a catch can isn't needed or is a waste of money on a hemi,i dare you to pull your intake manifold,go ahead don't be chicken,it's only about a 30 minute job to remove the intake,lol

And here I was thinking that a catch can was a waste of money, time, and did nothing to benefit the health and longevity of ones engine

 

[HEMIMANN]

It also coats the inside of the manifold and intake ports with an oily mess,that takes some work to clean up.Throw in the fact the crud sucked through the pcv system effectively lowers the octane rating of the fuel your using on top of everything else. The guys claiming a catch can isn't needed or is a waste of money on a hemi,i dare you to pull your intake manifold,go ahead don't be chicken,it's only about a 30 minute job to remove the intake,lol

Any engine with pcv looks like this without a "breather coalescer". Which is what we called.it in industry. I dislike the catch can term - sounds like little kid slang.

 

[Wild one]

Any engine with pcv looks like this without a "breather coalescer". Which is what we called.it in industry. I dislike the catch can term - sounds like little kid slang.

They used to be called Air / Oil Seperators ,i'm not sure when the Catch Can name became popular.

 

[Burla]

They used to be called Air / Oil Seperators ,i'm not sure when the Catch Can name became popular.

That was from diesel which in history had water issues, trust me in the 80's when I started driving a rig we worried about it. Diesel has came a long way baby. Gas never had moisture issue except for leaky tanks or accidents with fueling trucks getting water in their tank.

I guess you can call a catch can an oil separator, but nobody really worries about water in gas engine. But that was our main worry, we could care less about oil in our fuel, that only mattered at start up and we had glow plugs anyhow.