Diesel or Gas?

[nlambert182]

I always had a cummins and went hemi this last time. I only drive 1 mile to work, and 1 mile home. My 2016 cummins I did have was flawless doing this for a few years along with the occasional towing in summer and longer 30 mile trips to the city here and there. I figured I would eventually have emissions issues is why I went with the 6.4 hemi. Then I find out about cam and lifter failures. Lots of people recommending redline oil and short OCI. I do 5000 mile oil changes and use redline 5w-30...pretty sure the cummins is cheaper at oil changes when going this route by far. Overall, I like the hemi. It is nice to have warm air flowing in the winter in short time. There are plusses and minuses to both. Both can get costly with breakdowns. Just go with whatever you WANT, and whichever seems to be the best match for your needs.

This is the best suggestion. What works for one won't work for others. What's cheaper for some will be more expensive for others. We can talk about anecdotes all day long but at the individual level it's not possible to know what will be the wisest choice.

 

[2003F350]

This is the best suggestion. What works for one won't work for others. What's cheaper for some will be more expensive for others. We can talk about anecdotes all day long but at the individual level it's not possible to know what will be the wisest choice.

Agreed. If you're not worried about costly breakdowns (which aren't as common as it sounds - you only hear about the ones that fall apart, you never hear about the ones that never have an issue), then it really comes down to what you want...and what's available.

I thought I'd sworn off diesels because I didn't need one anymore. I still don't, really, but I was kind of married to the dealer I was working with and all they had were diesels in 2500 or 3500 trims. I needed a truck and didn't have time to wait for a Hemi to come in or be found, so I pulled the trigger, even knowing what issues the CTD can (not WILL) have in the future. And honestly I'm at 7k on the odometer (hard to believe I only got this thing back in July) and I'm looking forward to a lot of trouble-free miles.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Yup.
I waited a year to find a Hemi 6.4 2500 using a web crawler, because I didn't want to go through the hassle of custom ordering anymore.

Was surprised to find out Hemi tick can be catastrophic, but there's bad things about almost any truck these days. They're way too complex.

 

[UPNO4]

Just picked up a '23 2500 6.7 and 2 trips so far 1000 miles or so each pulling about 8500 lbs or so and I can't believe the difference over my 1500 Hemi night and day and the mpg are unbelievable drove to round trip to Denver from SLC basically pulling empty trailer up and brought a Ram 1500 CCSB back. This Truck is amazing. My first Diesel so I am impressed

 

[Units]

Just picked up a '23 2500 6.7 and 2 trips so far 1000 miles or so each pulling about 8500 lbs or so and I can't believe the difference over my 1500 Hemi night and day and the mpg are unbelievable drove to round trip to Denver from SLC basically pulling empty trailer up and brought a Ram 1500 CCSB back. This Truck is amazing. My first Diesel so I am impressed

Almost in the same boat as you. I picked my ‘23 6.7l Friday, got rid of my ‘22 6.4l. Man o man what a difference, boat loads of power and driving back and forth to work (30 miles one way) and putting around town, in the 6.4l I’d have used half a tank plus (and I drove easy).
I barely use a qtr tank driving the same distance with the 6.7l and in all honesty I drive it like a truck. Granted I do have a 2500 for pulling my 8000lb camper occasionally, but it is also my daily driver. I’m glad I made the switch.

 

[Tulecreeper]

Yup.
I waited a year to find a Hemi 6.4 2500 using a web crawler, because I didn't want to go through the hassle of custom ordering anymore.

Was surprised to find out Hemi tick can be catastrophic, but there's bad things about almost any truck these days. They're way too complex.

From my understanding that "Hemi Tick" thing was/is more prevalent in the 5.7.

 

[Timsdually]

Just picked up a '23 2500 6.7 and 2 trips so far 1000 miles or so each pulling about 8500 lbs or so and I can't believe the difference over my 1500 Hemi night and day and the mpg are unbelievable drove to round trip to Denver from SLC basically pulling empty trailer up and brought a Ram 1500 CCSB back. This Truck is amazing. My first Diesel so I am impressed

Gas and diesel might tow the same thing, but in the diesel it tows it comfortably.

 

[Tulecreeper]

Gas and diesel might tow the same thing, but in the diesel it tows it comfortably.

The heavier the trailer gets, yes. At 8500 pounds, though, I can tow all day and not even know it's back there. I don't begin noticing any real difference until I get up between 11k and 12k.

 

[jejb]

It's likely going to cost you more. If you tow a lot and neither one breaks, you might come out ahead. Most people don't tow enough and keep the truck long enough to realize that.

There are use cases where a diesel doesn't make a lot of sense. I would not use one as a commuter, personally.

If something does break on the diesel, you're way behind.

Maybe. Depends on what breaks. Lots of threads about engines and trannys going out on gas trucks too.

When I did all this mental gymnastics a few years ago I already knew I wanted one and was trying to justify it. I'm sure that's what most people do. I couldn't make it work out. Our fleet manager has also told me that diesels on average cost him more. One failure is so expensive that it wrecks the numbers for the diesel and they're frequent enough at least for him to notice it. Fleets would be trending diesel if it was cheaper to operate.

Fleet use, assuming not towing, is another place I would not put a newer diesel.

I had my numbers flipped. It's 1.3x the cost of gas yesterday so 30% more.

It's about 22% difference around here right now. That is way more than offset by the better mileage I get, compared to my last 3/4 gasser.

 

[nlambert182]

At the end of the day nobody can say unequivocally that a gasser is just going to be cheaper in the long run, or vice versa. There are too many unknowns and it really depends on what it will be used for.

For fleet vehicles that aren't towing it makes sense that they would choose a gasser. Not consistently towing is detrimental to a diesel. I think most know that. But on the flip side of that, how many hot shot truckers do you see towing a 43' gooseneck with a gasser? Not many.

But.. if you are going to use the truck frequently and the math works in your favor for a diesel, it's a no brainer. If it doesn't, then don't get one.


The one thing that drives me nuts over anything else is those who will say that no matter what, one truck is better than the other. It just isn't true. Every person will have to determine that for themselves. There's a place for both.

 

[KKBB]

At the end of the day nobody can say unequivocally that a gasser is just going to be cheaper in the long run, or vice versa. There are too many unknowns and it really depends on what it will be used for.

For fleet vehicles that aren't towing it makes sense that they would choose a gasser. Not consistently towing is detrimental to a diesel. I think most know that. But on the flip side of that, how many hot shot truckers do you see towing a 43' gooseneck with a gasser? Not many.

But.. if you are going to use the truck frequently and the math works in your favor for a diesel, it's a no brainer. If it doesn't, then don't get one.


The one thing that drives me nuts over anything else is those who will say that no matter what, one truck is better than the other. It just isn't true. Every person will have to determine that for themselves. There's a place for both.

I totally agree. I loved all my cummins trucks I had. I love the hemi I have now...so far. It pulls the boat and camper good enough for the short distances we travel while towing. I like the hemi for quick warm ups in winter. I still would take the Cummins any day over the hemi for pulling and just general driving on highway and interstate. It is so nice to not be downshifting all the time with the Cummins, though the 6.4 hemi with 8 speed transmission is so smooth you can barely tell it has downshifted. Wish I had enough money to just have both!!! Haha!!

 

[1stindoor]

This is my second 2500 with the 6.4. My previous 2500s (2 x Sierras) were gas engines as well. I have this discussion with myself (and others) every time. But I just can't justify the additional $10k for the diesel, when I'm normally towing just my boat and less than 75 miles. I understand the all the variables, but for my type of driving/towing I do, (plus I usually trade somewhere around 125k miles)...I don't think I'll ever see the savings of a diesel.

 

[Timsdually]

This is my second 2500 with the 6.4. My previous 2500s (2 x Sierras) were gas engines as well. I have this discussion with myself (and others) every time. But I just can't justify the additional $10k for the diesel, when I'm normally towing just my boat and less than 75 miles. I understand the all the variables, but for my type of driving/towing I do, (plus I usually trade somewhere around 125k miles)...I don't think I'll ever see the savings of a diesel.

Before I went diesel, my last gasser was a Silverado 2500. When I traded on a diesel Ram I got about $8500 for it. Had it been a Duramax I would have gotten close to $15,000 which meant I would have gotten my money back for what the Duramax upcharge was on the truck.

 

[ggrimm01]

Hello, I have been a diesel guy for many years now. I currently own a 2011 Ram 6.7 3500 with 75K on it. I have no warranty and the truck is flawless except for only one issue. The emissions. If you get a diesel, the emissions leg on the diesel will fail at some point. I only have 75K on this truck and it works hard pulling trailers, never has been a daily driver, and always drives it like I stole it. The engine light comes on, and have 3 shops tell me the emissions need to be replaced (DPF, NOX) filters to a tune of ($9K to $11K).
So I have several options to unload the truck, fix it, delete it, or go to gas. A new truck will cost $75K to $85K. Fixing the emissions ($9K to $11K). Deleting ($3K). Equiv gas truck will be $65K to $75K. So my first thought is to delete the truck and keep the current truck for many more years. My alternate option is going to gas. I already own a Ram 2500 6.4l and this truck can do most of my camper/farm activities at the expense of lower fuel mileage pulling heavy loads. I am only writing this to let everyone know that diesel is good and has pros and cons and everyone needs to weigh what is best for there scenario. Good Luck

 

[ggrimm01]

Duplicate

 

[ppine]

A diesel is going to be cheaper in the long run because they last so much longer.

 

[nlambert182]

Hello, I have been a diesel guy for many years now. I currently own a 2011 Ram 6.7 3500 with 75K on it. I have no warranty and the truck is flawless except for only one issue. The emissions. If you get a diesel, the emissions leg on the diesel will fail at some point. I only have 75K on this truck and it works hard pulling trailers, never has been a daily driver, and always drives it like I stole it. The engine light comes on, and have 3 shops tell me the emissions need to be replaced (DPF, NOX) filters to a tune of ($9K to $11K).
So I have several options to unload the truck, fix it, delete it, or go to gas. A new truck will cost $75K to $85K. Fixing the emissions ($9K to $11K). Deleting ($3K). Equiv gas truck will be $65K to $75K. So my first thought is to delete the truck and keep the current truck for many more years. My alternate option is going to gas. I already own a Ram 2500 6.4l and this truck can do most of my camper/farm activities at the expense of lower fuel mileage pulling heavy loads. I am only writing this to let everyone know that diesel is good and has pros and cons and everyone needs to weigh what is best for there scenario. Good Luck

Correct. At some point the emission system is going to fail but when they fail depends heavily on how it was used. Haulers tend to get more mileage out of them than grocery getters. When I buy one I already factor in that potential cost because I won't buy a truck that's already been deleted. Too many idiots like to turn them up.

The cost isn't THAT bad on a 2010-2012 6.7 though... definitely not $9-$11k).

The entire emissions system components on a 2013+ are around $6.5k. If you have to take it into the dealer to replace then yes you're going to spend a pretty penny but all of it is easy to part swap if you're slightly mechanically inclined.

You're lucky with the 2011 in that you don't have DEF to contend with. You only have a DPF/Nox filter and EGR so no DEF pump, DEF tank, or DEF injector. Those add a significant cost IF they fail.

For your truck (2010-2012) it's only about $2,500-$3,000:

DPF filter - $1,200
EGR cooler - ~$600
EGR valve - $700

For a 2013+ truck it can be upwards of $6,500 for the entire system:

DPF filter - $1,200
EGR cooler - $1,200
EGR (bypass) valve - $1,100
DEF tank - $1,900
DEF injector - $250
DEF pump - $900


A delete kit runs ~$1,300-1,700 and is pretty straight forward to install. I deleted both of mine in my driveway. Not everyone can do this because of inspections, etc.. but if you can and if it fails I wouldn't hesitate to do it. I wouldn't do it unless I had to though.

All that said.... I'd have to consider the cost of replacing the truck versus the cost of fixing the one I have. If it does what you need it to do I'd either fix it or delete it. With interest rates and the cost of trucks right now, trying to buy a new one would be the last line on my list. (I'm doing it right now, and it's painful)

 

[jimboschnitz]

The only reason the gas trucks have a higher towing capacity is because the added
weight of the diesel engine reduces the GVWR and the tow rating. Highest tow rating
is with a gas engine and a 2 wheel drive short cab......lightest truck available.

 

[Scottly]

Diesel...Because, that's what men do. If your balls are in your wife's purse, by all means, a gasser will do.

 

[SniperDroid]

Diesel...Because, that's what men do. If your balls are in your wife's purse, by all means, a gasser will do.

Usually spoken by guys that only use a truck to "roll coal"...