Thinking about buying a TT, have a few questions

[michaelrc51]

This will be my first travel traveler, the one I am possibly buying is a 2008 MacKenzie Dune Seeker 260 FQB Toy Hauler. I have a 2009 Ram 1500 4x4, I'll get to the specs shortly. TT will come with weight distribution hitch and setup.

My truck is a 2009 Ram 1500 4x4 with 5.7l with bolt on mods: Ported TB, Air Grabber, Efan mod, 180 t-stat, MSD coils, Icon Stage IV suspension set to 3" front lift and 1.5" lift rear coil, 1.5" Zone body lift, wheels with 35" tires, Zone UCAs, Hellwig RSB, adjustable SWB links F+R, Trinity programmer, and just put an ATS Stage IV trans in with converter and Co-Pilot.

Planned mods for towing are: 4:10 Gears for F+R, Auburn LSD for rear, add an external trans cooler w/fan, brake controller, and air bags for the rear.

Trailer Specs are:
30.5" length
6100 lbs dry weight
1170 lbs tongue weight (this is a concern)
11000 lbs GVWR

My questions are:
1. What air bags should I consider?
2. Are in coil air bags good enough to handle my load?
3. Will in coil air bags fit inside Icon springs?
4. Is this tongue weight going to be an issue?
5. Any other concerns?

This will be my first trailer, just wondering what other things I should be thinking about here. TIA

 

[NewBlackDak]

You will have your hands full, even with a good setup and hitch. You have taken a truck with marginal towing characteristics, and made it much worse with lift/leveling and big tires. That trailer has a big profile, and you will be overweight without careful loading.

Go weigh your truck before you buy anything to find out where your axle weighs are. It’ll let you know where you stand.
Empty travel trailer toy haulers are notoriously tongue heavy, and you will have already lost some capacity with all the stuff you have added.


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[sandawilliams]

What NewBlackDak said.

 

[michaelrc51]

You will have your hands full, even with a good setup and hitch. You have taken a truck with marginal towing characteristics, and made it much worse with lift/leveling and big tires. That trailer has a big profile, and you will be overweight without careful loading.

Go weigh your truck before you buy anything to find out where your axle weighs are. It’ll let you know where you stand.
Empty travel trailer toy haulers are notoriously tongue heavy, and you will have already lost some capacity with all the stuff you have added.


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I get that what I would be towing is definitely on the heavier side for my truck. I listed the tongue weight and at 1150 lbs it's definitely heavy. But from everything I've read I'm within my limits.

The OEM tires were 32" actual and these Nitto G2 are 54.5" actuations; when they were new.

Are you saying that because of the lift the weight over each axle would be higher?
I can crank down my front coilovers if need be and the rear springs are 1.5" lift, I could always go back to stock springs. The body lift wouldn't affect the towing, at least I don't believe so.

I may have added a few pounds with the tires but if all 4 amount to a 200lb increase I'd be surprised. I doubt the other mods have added any weight, and I did remove some weight with getting rid of the OEM clutch fan setup.
Regardless, can you explain your thought a little more clearly please?

Are you saying to weigh the axles with it hooked up?

 

[dexter]

6100 lbs dry weight
1170 lbs tongue weight (this is a concern)
11000 lbs GVWR
------------------------------------------------

The key number for your truck is payload.

The key number for your TT is tongue weight when loaded not dry.

Research how payload is computed and you will see there isn't enough there for your TT.

 

[dexter]

https://driving.ca/auto-news/news/how-it-works-towing-and-payload

 

[dhay13]

your payload would likely be in the neighborhood of 1200-1400lbs and you have already used up almost 1200 of that with an empty trailers tongue weight. add your body weight and you are real close to being at that limit, maybe over. not saying you can't do it or that others haven't done it but you aren't likely to be legal. Adding airbags has nothing to do with the payload sticker on your door. Thats what insurance companies and attorneys will go buy if things go bad. And the lift and bigger tires will reduce stability so any if the trailer isn't behaving it will be magnifified

 

[michaelrc51]

your payload would likely be in the neighborhood of 1200-1400lbs and you have already used up almost 1200 of that with an empty trailers tongue weight. add your body weight and you are real close to being at that limit, maybe over. not saying you can't do it or that others haven't done it but you aren't likely to be legal. Adding airbags has nothing to do with the payload sticker on your door. Thats what insurance companies and attorneys will go buy if things go bad. And the lift and bigger tires will reduce stability so any if the trailer isn't behaving it will be magnifified

Yeah, I got it. That sucks.


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[Mr.AK902]

As others have said, once you load your trailer and truck for your trip you'll be over your payload limits. If you choose to tow like that or not is totally up to you. Will your truck do it, yes it will. Is it legal and safe, no it isn't. Will you prematurely wear your truck, yes you will.

You've got some coin sunk into your truck already, most of which won't help your towing needs. Before you spend any more money, consider one of two things:

1) Purchase a smaller TT within your trucks range.
2) Purchase a bigger truck able to handle your TT.

 

[michaelrc51]

As others have said, once you load your trailer and truck for your trip you'll be over your payload limits. If you choose to tow like that or not is totally up to you. Will your truck do it, yes it will. Is it legal and safe, no it isn't. Will you prematurely wear your truck, yes you will.

You've got some coin sunk into your truck already, most of which won't help your towing needs. Before you spend any more money, consider one of two things:

1) Purchase a smaller TT within your trucks range.
2) Purchase a bigger truck able to handle your TT.

Yeah, I mean I knew it wasn’t optimal but I didn’t realize it was a no go.

I came across this toy hauler, nice used one under $10k and that’s how this went where it did. I just put a trans in my truck so I’d be throwing $4k out the window if I upgraded right now.
All of the 2500/3500 diesel I would like are $40k or so and I don’t really want a payment.

IDK

Thanks for the help


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[Jimmy07]

This will be my first travel traveler, the one I am possibly buying is a 2008 MacKenzie Dune Seeker 260 FQB Toy Hauler. I have a 2009 Ram 1500 4x4, I'll get to the specs shortly. TT will come with weight distribution hitch and setup.

My truck is a 2009 Ram 1500 4x4 with 5.7l with bolt on mods: Ported TB, Air Grabber, Efan mod, 180 t-stat, MSD coils, Icon Stage IV suspension set to 3" front lift and 1.5" lift rear coil, 1.5" Zone body lift, wheels with 35" tires, Zone UCAs, Hellwig RSB, adjustable SWB links F+R, Trinity programmer, and just put an ATS Stage IV trans in with converter and Co-Pilot.

Planned mods for towing are: 4:10 Gears for F+R, Auburn LSD for rear, add an external trans cooler w/fan, brake controller, and air bags for the rear.

Trailer Specs are:
30.5" length
6100 lbs dry weight
1170 lbs tongue weight (this is a concern)
11000 lbs GVWR

My questions are:
1. What air bags should I consider?
2. Are in coil air bags good enough to handle my load?
3. Will in coil air bags fit inside Icon springs?
4. Is this tongue weight going to be an issue?
5. Any other concerns?

This will be my first trailer, just wondering what other things I should be thinking about here. TIA

Don’t worry about the payload, as it doesn’t matter once you hook up a trailer to your truck. Your RAWR and your tire ratings will handle that just fine. It’s the lift with aftermarket suspension that will be the weak link. Get rid of all that stuff (especially that it is “leveled”), and get the bags, gears, cooler, and brake controller, and you’ll be fine. If you insist on keeping that lift and level kit, then find a different trailer with a lighter tongue weight.

 

[OMW2SKI]

I can't imagine pulling that trailer, especially fully loaded, with your truck. I would say you need a much smaller trailer or a 3/4 ton truck.

 

[JMod45]

I was in a very similar situation as you with a toy hauler. Started asking questions on a different forum, that I don't think they will let me link to, but here is the link to my thread on this site. There is some good information in there.

https://www.ramforum.com/threads/hows-my-weight.143273/

I ended up finding a deal on a 2500 diesel, and the truck feels like there isn't even a trailer back there half of the time.

The website for my trailer stated 957lbs tongue weight, after having my 2500 I got a handful of measurements, posted them in that thread and VernDiesel (travel trailer expert) told me that the tongue weight calculated to about 1140.

So those specs on the trailer are dry weight. Propane tanks, under trailer storage, batteries, any water in tanks etc. will go more towards tongue weight on a toy hauler due to the wheel placement. If 1170 is the empty weight, add at least another 100lbs on top of that. Factory receiver hitch on my 2012 was only rated for 1000lbs tongue weight, and 10,000lbs trailer weight, you can get a class 4 hitch rated for more for less than $200. Depending on what toys you plan on putting in the back of the trailer, you could actually reduce tongue weight if you do it right.

The 5.7l engine has more than enough power to PULL that trailer, and the upgraded transmission is a benefit also, but I don't think you have the payload/axle capacity. Rear axle rating is 3900 lbs, and according to the ram body builder website, the rear end of your truck is between 2200 and 2500 lbs. If you actually have 1170 tongue weight, then that leaves you 230-530lbs for gas, stuff in the bed, passengers, etc. If your actual tongue weight is higher, like mine, then you could be at the axle rating before getting in the truck.

Keep in mind also that 35" tires are a lot more tire for the axle to try and push. If you start trying to pull a trailer at the max end of what the truck is rated for, I would think that you're going to be out an axle before long also.

If you decide to put in airbags, get on the timer grove website. I forget the guys name right now, but he is really helpful, and the product was good quality. I bought my 2500 a week after installing them on my 1500, so no idea how they would have handled my trailer weight.

 

[michaelrc51]

I was in a very similar situation as you with a toy hauler. Started asking questions on a different forum, that I don't think they will let me link to, but here is the link to my thread on this site. There is some good information in there.

https://www.ramforum.com/threads/hows-my-weight.143273/

I ended up finding a deal on a 2500 diesel, and the truck feels like there isn't even a trailer back there half of the time.

The website for my trailer stated 957lbs tongue weight, after having my 2500 I got a handful of measurements, posted them in that thread and VernDiesel (travel trailer expert) told me that the tongue weight calculated to about 1140.

So those specs on the trailer are dry weight. Propane tanks, under trailer storage, batteries, any water in tanks etc. will go more towards tongue weight on a toy hauler due to the wheel placement. If 1170 is the empty weight, add at least another 100lbs on top of that. Factory receiver hitch on my 2012 was only rated for 1000lbs tongue weight, and 10,000lbs trailer weight, you can get a class 4 hitch rated for more for less than $200. Depending on what toys you plan on putting in the back of the trailer, you could actually reduce tongue weight if you do it right.

The 5.7l engine has more than enough power to PULL that trailer, and the upgraded transmission is a benefit also, but I don't think you have the payload/axle capacity. Rear axle rating is 3900 lbs, and according to the ram body builder website, the rear end of your truck is between 2200 and 2500 lbs. If you actually have 1170 tongue weight, then that leaves you 230-530lbs for gas, stuff in the bed, passengers, etc. If your actual tongue weight is higher, like mine, then you could be at the axle rating before getting in the truck.

Keep in mind also that 35" tires are a lot more tire for the axle to try and push. If you start trying to pull a trailer at the max end of what the truck is rated for, I would think that you're going to be out an axle before long also.

If you decide to put in airbags, get on the timer grove website. I forget the guys name right now, but he is really helpful, and the product was good quality. I bought my 2500 a week after installing them on my 1500, so no idea how they would have handled my trailer weight.

Yes, this is what I now understand. Before I didn’t know it was to much tongue weight. I had other people, who I thought knew what they were talking about, telling me I would be OK.

I’ve been shopping for a 2500/3500 diesel. I wanted to build my pole barn and renovate my house before doing so, but my daughter is 9 and this is a good time for us to do some camping.

Thanks for the help everyone.


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[JMod45]

Yes, this is what I now understand. Before I didn’t know it was to much tongue weight. I had other people, who I thought knew what they were talking about, telling me I would be OK.

I’ve been shopping for a 2500/3500 diesel. I wanted to build my pole barn and renovate my house before doing so, but my daughter is 9 and this is a good time for us to do some camping.

Thanks for the help everyone.


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I apologize for beating a dead horse, didn't read through all of the posts like I should have.

Your initial question sounded really similar to what I was going through, so I got a little excited to share my info.

 

[michaelrc51]

I apologize for beating a dead horse, didn't read through all of the posts like I should have.

Your initial question sounded really similar to what I was going through, so I got a little excited to share my info.

No worries, thanks for the help!

 

[michaelrc51]

I just picked up a 16’ 2500 diesel mega cab!

Problem solved!


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[GsRAM]

There you go man. I didn't have time to post but would have echoed the others comments.

That toy hauler is too much for a half ton truck.


Congrats and yes, camping is a great family activity/family time. It forces you to unplug a bit, relax and just spend time together. Money well spent Sir! I've been doing it since 1981 or so and have tons of memories with my parents and now my own family. Its grest

 

[Loudram]

Problem solved indeed. Congrats!

 

[maverickmk]

I can't imagine pulling that trailer, especially fully loaded, with your truck. I would say you need a much smaller trailer or a 3/4 ton truck.

I agree with this. I've done a lot of hauling throughout the years and I have always had at least a 2500. You done did good.