upgrading from bilstein to Fox

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Adil

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I have been running mopar lift kit on my RAM 1500 Laramie for the past four years now. The bilstein shocks are set at 2.8" and my 315/70/17 BFG KO2 on 17" method wheels are not rubbing.

the proposed set up is:

rear ICON 1.5 coil springs
Front/Rear Fox 2.0 shocks.

i am worried if this new set up will cause my tires to rub and whether there will be a negative impact on ride quality on road. i do 70% on road and 30% offroad (desert and mountains). has anyone tried it and can share the experience and pictures.


the price difference is high if I go for fox 2.5 with external reservoir and upgraded UCA.
 

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Go with Icon. Way better product and guarenteed for life. Im having a custom set of icons made for my truck. External resevoirs are a waste of money unless you do high speed desert racing. Thats why icon doesnt make them for the ram 1500.
 
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novelmike

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Go with Icon. Way better product and guarenteed for life. Im having a custim set of icons made for my truck. External resevoirs are a waste of monwy unless you do high speed desert racing. Thats why icon doesnt make them for the ram 1500.

Icon warranty:

“Lifetime warranty on all components, springs, and weldments. Shock warranty is limited to manufacture defect for 12 months from the date of purchase. The ICON Delta Joint features a 5 year warranty.”

I believe Fox has a 1 year warranty on their shocks as well.
 

novelmike

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I have been running mopar lift kit on my RAM 1500 Laramie for the past four years now. The bilstein shocks are set at 2.8" and my 315/70/17 BFG KO2 on 17" method wheels are not rubbing.

the proposed set up is:

rear ICON 1.5 coil springs
Front/Rear Fox 2.0 shocks.

i am worried if this new set up will cause my tires to rub and whether there will be a negative impact on ride quality on road. i do 70% on road and 30% offroad (desert and mountains). has anyone tried it and can share the experience and pictures.


the price difference is high if I go for fox 2.5 with external reservoir and upgraded UCA.

I suspect that if you went to the Fox from your Mopar lift that the ride will be a lot softer on the road. But more controlled off road. Every time I take my Ram Offroad I am impressed with it. I was out in the sand dunes with it last Sunday. There were a few other stock Rams out there, I could see the people inside bouncing around and they were going half the speed as me. I was easily going twice as fast everywhere than stock suspension vehicles and trucks with 4” and under lift kits.

The Bisltein shocks are similar to a spacer lift that many people call “cheap” and complain about the ride quality. The higher lift setting on them, the stiffer the ride.
The 2.0 are set at about a 2” lift from the factory. You could adjust them before install to achieve you additional .5” so you’ll have a similar ride height as before. That will stiffen the ride up a bit. But I would guess they’ll still be softer than your current set up.
 

ram1500rsm

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Go with Icon. Way better product and guarenteed for life. Im having a custim set of icons made for my truck. External resevoirs are a waste of monwy unless you do high speed desert racing. Thats why icon doesnt make them for the ram 1500.
I don’t know what beef you have with Fox, you keep throwing the company under the bus them because they use cheap chit based I guess on a experience you had with their cheapy shocks? they make a cheapy one, I think they called it adventure series, and they make a higher end they call performance series, I have no idea about the cheapy ones, but I’ve had their 2.0’s performance series in the back of my Jeep, never had any issues with the ride being harsh, or rust issues, and they don’t bounce like the Billies 5100’s in the dirt. Can’t speak for Fox CO’s because I never had them, I’ve used Icon and Radflo, soon King in the RAM, but they all make great products, and they all stand by them, especially given the money we pay for them :).

And Icon does add the reservoir literally to any other coilover application they have in any of their stage 3 and above options, I have no idea why Icon doesnt do this with the RAM, I’d presume it’s a marketing strategy to get some eyes away from the most expensive options with res?, the RES is not a waste of money, just because Icon doesn’t offer them with their kits in the RAM application doesn’t mean that, I’d guess they’ll add it if you ask for it and pay the difference. Nothing in this market is a waste, but a nice to have feature that some may not need, while others will crave for it, that’s different from being a waste.... and you can choose what to have, part of the reason we go with the high end chit.
 

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I don’t know what beef you have with Fox, you keep throwing the company under the bus them because they use cheap chit based I guess on a experience you had with their cheapy shocks? they make a cheapy one, I think they called it adventure series, and they make a higher end they call performance series, I have no idea about the cheapy ones, but I’ve had their 2.0’s performance series in the back of my Jeep, never had any issues with the ride being harsh, or rust issues, and they don’t bounce like the Billies 5100’s in the dirt. Can’t speak for Fox CO’s because I never had them, I’ve used Icon and Radflo, soon King in the RAM, but they all make great products, and they all stand by them, especially given the money we pay for them :).

And Icon does add the reservoir literally to any other coilover application they have in any of their stage 3 and above options, I have no idea why Icon doesnt do this with the RAM, I’d presume it’s a marketing strategy to get some eyes away from the most expensive options with res?, the RES is not a waste of money, just because Icon doesn’t offer them with their kits in the RAM application doesn’t mean that, I’d guess they’ll add it if you ask for it and pay the difference. Nothing in this market is a waste, but a nice to have feature that some may not need, while others will crave for it, that’s different from being a waste.... and you can choose what to have, part of the reason we go with the high end chit.

I had fox 2.0 resevoir shocks on my 4 door wrangler, and my ram came with the same rear shocks installed on it when i bought it. Not their cheap shock line.
Fox doesnt use any kind of zinc (rust preventive primer) before they paint. After one winter the paint on their springs starts rusting.
Icon uses zinc primer, thats why theirs do not rust.
Now onto the topic of resevoir shocks or coilovers...The resevoirs are to help cool down shock oil from high speed, which causes friction, known as heat. Unless you are doing high speed baja off road driving in a desert environment, there is no advantage of having a resevoir. I actually called Icons tech department when i was deciding between fox and Icon, and both confirmed what i said about resevoir need/use.
On a daily driven truck, resevoirs serve no purpose, they just have that "cool" look.
 

PerfectCreature

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I think the longevity depends on use and how you maintain your vehicle. I called Fox and other companies and asked about the use in winter climates and the ability to withstand the abuse from salt, calcium and dirt mixes in various degrees and was met with the same answer from each company.
No company tests their products to withstand the type of abuse from salt lake climates or snow belt areas, even the trucks rust after a few years. They recommended boots for the shocks; Fox has a "Shock Roost" to help prevent spray on the shock rod and so forth.

I went with Fox as I got a very good deal on the parts. Each manufacture was equally responsive to calls, emails and knowledgeable in regards to my concerns.

I see this turning into a contest. I think debating one companies longevity over the other is silly as each person uses their equipment is different ways, and maintains them equally as differently.

Just pick what you want and go with it, if it doesn't work out the market place will happy accept them and I am sure someone will scoop them up and you can try again.
 
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Adil

Adil

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I suspect that if you went to the Fox from your Mopar lift that the ride will be a lot softer on the road. But more controlled off road. Every time I take my Ram Offroad I am impressed with it. I was out in the sand dunes with it last Sunday. There were a few other stock Rams out there, I could see the people inside bouncing around and they were going half the speed as me. I was easily going twice as fast everywhere than stock suspension vehicles and trucks with 4” and under lift kits.

The Bisltein shocks are similar to a spacer lift that many people call “cheap” and complain about the ride quality. The higher lift setting on them, the stiffer the ride.
The 2.0 are set at about a 2” lift from the factory. You could adjust them before install to achieve you additional .5” so you’ll have a similar ride height as before. That will stiffen the ride up a bit. But I would guess they’ll still be softer than your current set up.
Thanks, what tire size and rims are you running?
 
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Adil

Adil

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No body answered my main question , will the 315/70/17 rub if I use fox 2.0 kit which comes without an external reservoir?


I am done with Mopar lift kit. Had enough. Two years ago one shock came off and I replaced it. Two weeks ago, the rear spring broke in two and came off the car.
 

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No body answered my main question , will the 315/70/17 rub if I use fox 2.0 kit which comes without an external reservoir?


I am done with Mopar lift kit. Had enough. Two years ago one shock came off and I replaced it. Two weeks ago, the rear spring broke in two and came off the car.
Can’t answer your question.....but oh broke a spring. Are you wheeling it? It sounds like you use the truck and it’s not a just for looks.
 
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Adil

Adil

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Can’t answer your question.....but oh broke a spring. Are you wheeling it? It sounds like you use the truck and it’s not a just for looks.
Heheh
Yes it goes beyond the looks.
Screenshot_20181213_215940.jpg
 

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I’ve got 285/75/17 Nitto G2 tires on Method Racing wheels. I believe the backspacing is 4.75?

New the tires measure something like 33.5 x 11.5
 
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novelmike

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I’d contact Fox and ask them how much to adjust the spring retainer to get another .5” out of them. I do not think you’ll run. When I can all see where the closest point is that may possibly run on my truck.

I have the Fox 2.5 ordered for my truck. I’ll sell you my 2.0 if you’re interested. You can have them rebuilt for about $70 each. And when they rebuild them they can adjust them for more lift for you.

Where do you live?
 
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Adil

Adil

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I’d contact Fox and ask them how much to adjust the spring retainer to get another .5” out of them. I do not think you’ll run. When I can all see where the closest point is that may possibly run on my truck.

I have the Fox 2.5 ordered for my truck. I’ll sell you my 2.0 if you’re interested. You can have them rebuilt for about $70 each. And when they rebuild them they can adjust them for more lift for you.

Where do you live?
Oh thanks . I am thousand miles away in the middle east desert.
 

ram1500rsm

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I had fox 2.0 resevoir shocks on my 4 door wrangler, and my ram came with the same rear shocks installed on it when i bought it. Not their cheap shock line.
Fox doesnt use any kind of zinc (rust preventive primer) before they paint. After one winter the paint on their springs starts rusting.
Icon uses zinc primer, thats why theirs do not rust.
Now onto the topic of resevoir shocks or coilovers...The resevoirs are to help cool down shock oil from high speed, which causes friction, known as heat. Unless you are doing high speed baja off road driving in a desert environment, there is no advantage of having a resevoir. I actually called Icons tech department when i was deciding between fox and Icon, and both confirmed what i said about resevoir need/use.
On a daily driven truck, resevoirs serve no purpose, they just have that "cool" look.

What springs are you talking about ? aren't we talking about the regular emulsion 2.0 Fox shocks ?
Also Fox 2.0 have aluminum bodies, (they have a version that is SS and can rust fast) i understand that Fox uses zinc plating for the shock bodies, even in the SS versions, i think the 2.5 CO's have steel bodies, and prob one of the reasons some people find this option to a little more problematic if they live in the salt belt, but again, i'm not familiar with Fox in general and anything else they do besides the factory performance 2.0 shocks, i know pretty much almost all manufacturers do sell something to protect their stuff from the elements/harsh driving conditions, and you can also use home made stuff, so if your invesment is rusting out, there are things you can do to help prevent that.

I know their rods (2.0's) are made of stainless steel with a hard chrome plating, if they rust is because the shaft was pitted and the previous owner might have not cared too much for his/her equipment since you mentioned buying the truck used, pitted/rusted shafts are a sure way to damage your shock internals/a way for those shocks to stop working as they should fairly quick, and just like people using fluid flim to protect their vehicle underbody and parts from the elements, you want to protect your investement as well, you throw away your $80 shocks when they're done, with race shocks, you might pay $80 to get them rebuild (seals/oil etc assuming you took care of yout stuff), but you have to take care of them if you don't want them to look like crap if you have to drive in the winter with them, just like everything else that can rust because salty conditions.

As for the reservoir, yes i agree it helps with some cooling, their main task is to separate the nitrogen pressure from the oil using a remote location for the Nitrogen, so the shock cylinder is filled 100% with oil as the piston cycles up/down while the nitrogen remains in the reservoir, that's it, it allows for a longer shaft if needed as well, without the res, the IFP is placed within the body of the shock itself, so the shock is filled with less oil, cooling in their case is an added effect but not the main purpose, no difference in feeling one way or the other if you're not cycling the shocks fast enough to need the extra oil, the reservoir helps resist fade and cavitation, again nothing here if you're driving to the mall back and forth, though you can say the res can help the shock last longer just because how much oil you can feel in, think about it as an HD hard cover or trans pan, more oil, longer service, less heat, though in the res case, the res could make the valving more consistant if you wish because you have more oil/gas to help you with, so the performance benefit will be there.

Cost of rebuilding either version is pretty much the same, in any case it's not a waste to have them, extra cost if you need them sure, i wish i could have added CDC to my future shocks for example which is another feature, again a feature i may need but choose not to have because of the extra price :), maybe later on though who knows, you can always send your stuff in to get extra features added, go with a different valving, and add a bunch of other options, or even do them yourself, i DD my truck, i wanted the res, and i know they'll come handy on the weekends as my truck sees the dirt/desert, only thing special about living in the Socialist republic of Commifornia....
 

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What springs are you talking about ? aren't we talking about the regular emulsion 2.0 Fox shocks ?
Also Fox 2.0 have aluminum bodies, (they have a version that is SS and can rust fast) i understand that Fox uses zinc plating for the shock bodies, even in the SS versions, i think the 2.5 CO's have steel bodies, and prob one of the reasons some people find this option to a little more problematic if they live in the salt belt, but again, i'm not familiar with Fox in general and anything else they do besides the factory performance 2.0 shocks, i know pretty much almost all manufacturers do sell something to protect their stuff from the elements/harsh driving conditions, and you can also use home made stuff, so if your invesment is rusting out, there are things you can do to help prevent that.

I know their rods (2.0's) are made of stainless steel with a hard chrome plating, if they rust is because the shaft was pitted and the previous owner might have not cared too much for his/her equipment since you mentioned buying the truck used, pitted/rusted shafts are a sure way to damage your shock internals/a way for those shocks to stop working as they should fairly quick, and just like people using fluid flim to protect their vehicle underbody and parts from the elements, you want to protect your investement as well, you throw away your $80 shocks when they're done, with race shocks, you might pay $80 to get them rebuild (seals/oil etc assuming you took care of yout stuff), but you have to take care of them if you don't want them to look like crap if you have to drive in the winter with them, just like everything else that can rust because salty conditions.

As for the reservoir, yes i agree it helps with some cooling, their main task is to separate the nitrogen pressure from the oil using a remote location for the Nitrogen, so the shock cylinder is filled 100% with oil as the piston cycles up/down while the nitrogen remains in the reservoir, that's it, it allows for a longer shaft if needed as well, without the res, the IFP is placed within the body of the shock itself, so the shock is filled with less oil, cooling in their case is an added effect but not the main purpose, no difference in feeling one way or the other if you're not cycling the shocks fast enough to need the extra oil, the reservoir helps resist fade and cavitation, again nothing here if you're driving to the mall back and forth, though you can say the res can help the shock last longer just because how much oil you can feel in, think about it as an HD hard cover or trans pan, more oil, longer service, less heat, though in the res case, the res could make the valving more consistant if you wish because you have more oil/gas to help you with, so the performance benefit will be there.

Cost of rebuilding either version is pretty much the same, in any case it's not a waste to have them, extra cost if you need them sure, i wish i could have added CDC to my future shocks for example which is another feature, again a feature i may need but choose not to have because of the extra price :), maybe later on though who knows, you can always send your stuff in to get extra features added, go with a different valving, and add a bunch of other options, or even do them yourself, i DD my truck, i wanted the res, and i know they'll come handy on the weekends as my truck sees the dirt/desert, only thing special about living in the Socialist republic of Commifornia....
Yes we were talking about the fox 2.0
I meant to refer to the fox coilover spring as per rusting. They do not use any primer on them before they paint them. Icon uses zinc primer, then paint. Hence why im going with Icon coilovers.
 

ram1500rsm

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No body answered my main question , will the 315/70/17 rub if I use fox 2.0 kit which comes without an external reservoir?


I am done with Mopar lift kit. Had enough. Two years ago one shock came off and I replaced it. Two weeks ago, the rear spring broke in two and came off the car.
I run and offroad the Rancho QL struts which are 2" lift in the front, with Falken AT3W 315/70/17, i'll have a very light rub in the plastic mud flaps seams in the front at partial lock with caster set at 3* driver, 3.5* passenger, same config with 4.5* driver, 5* passenger will clear everything just fine, found this by coincidence when i had my alignment shop guy mistakenly setting my caster towards the "stockisk" side of things. Never rubbed before since i had the higher caster, inmmediatly started rubbing after the dude did set the truck with lower caster, fixed it next day bumping the caster back to what i had before, front fender is 39 1/8" with the Ranchos and the 315/70/17 tires, so that'll give you the best idea.
 
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ram1500rsm

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Yes we were talking about the fox 2.0
I meant to refer to the fox coilover spring as per rusting. They do not use any primer on them before they paint them. Icon uses zinc primer, then paint. Hence why im going with Icon coilovers.
Fox makes the strut/shock, the springs are made by Eibach if i'm not mistaken,
For this post, this could be an example of improper care, combined with perhaps a bad batch of springs ? or maybe they could rust out like that, i'd never know since i haven' run Fox CO's in any flavor, and i've never experienced a rust in anything this bad myself, https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/fox-2-0-coilovers-failure.574879/
, Icons could potentially face the same fate if you live in the salt belt, any other shock could, assuming you don't take any precautions, If you had paid a good amount of money for race shocks, and you live in this type of climate where salt and other crap can corrode your vehicle, you have to protect your invesment, there are CO and shocks boots to protect the body, silicone sprays to protect the shaft, keep the shocks/springs waxed etc ,etc, hoses and fittings/nuts might rust and that'll be normal in that environment, but you have some fun work to do if you want to protect your invesment from the salty elements :)
 
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