2016 3500 CUMMINS CRANK NO START

[canada_eh]

2016 CUMMINS 3500 CREW CAB, PUSH BUTTON START
WENT TO START TRUCK IN THE MORNING AND WOULDNT START
TRUCK HAS 38,000KM
Truck is deleted def, dpf, egr, exahust has been straight piped, egr and temp sensor left plugged in, tuner is a raceme. Truck has ran for 3 months now no issues.
PUSH THE BUTTON CRANKS STARTS THEN TURNS OFF AFTER 1-2 SECONDS
SCANNERS WONT PULL VIN, HAVE TO ENTER IT MANUALLY
TRUCK HAS A AISIN, HOWEVER MESSAGE CENTER IS SAYING PRESS CLUTCH AND BRAKE TO START.. NEVER SEEN THAT BEFORE ONLY EVER SAID PRESS BRAKE
ORIGINALLY DIAGNOSED IT AS THE ORC MODULE AS I DISCONNECTED IT OFF THE CAN BUS BAR AND THE TRUCK WOULD RUN HOWEVER DISPLAYED ERROR MESSAGES FOR ABS AND PARK ASSIST, AND THEN IT STARTED DOING THE NO RUN/START ALL OVER AGAIN. WE REMOVED THE 2 PLUGS FROM THE ECM TESTED POWERS AND GROUNDS THEY ALL CHECKED OUT. DID THE CAN BUS CHECK FOR SHORT TO VOLTAGE AS WELL AS TERMINATION RESISTANCE. WE HAVE MANUALLY REMOVED EACH MODULE OFF THE BUS BARS TO SEE ANY CHANGE IN THE TOPOLOGY AND NOTHING CHANGES
MODULE TOPOLOGY SHOWS:
DCU VGT PCM DOWN/RED
ABS YELLOW
DTCM RED/DOWN
ORC DOWN/RED
PTS DOWN/RED
ITBM DOWN/RED
BCM YELLOW
DDM YELLOW
PDM DOWN
HSM RED/DOWN
ANY OR ALL IDEAS WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED

 

[hotrod45]

Fuel jelled?

 

[canada_eh]

No still warm out here.

 

[Tach_tech]

What was the can bus voltage when you checked it at the PCM?

 

[canada_eh]

The can bus voltage at the PCM, with harness removed on green connector off the block mounted ecm 2.1v i beleve it was pin 46, other than that the 3 grounds and 3 powers tok.

 

[Tach_tech]

There are 2 Can bus at the PCM. Can bus - and can bus +. They should be around 2.5V, both voltages of the + and - should add up to around 5V.

 

[canada_eh]

Proving the 2.5 at the connector when unplugged from ecm eliminates any other issues and we hang a new ecm/pcm?
If the voltage is not 2.5 we go to another module bringing the voltage down or start doing 5v reference voltage testing on sensors?

 

[canada_eh]

green plug on block mounted ecm, these are the terminals to measure from correct?
terminal 21 can 4 (+)
terminal 22 can C (+)
terminal 46 can C (-)

blue plug on block mounted ecm
terminal 94 can j1939 2 (-)
terminal 70 can J1939 2 (+)

 

[Tach_tech]

If you measure roughly 2.5v on both can + and - circuits. All battery/fused powers and grounds are good. I would suspect a faulty ECM, although with as many modules as you have off the bus it also could be bus wiring down somewhere along the line. Have you checked the star connectors?

 

[Tach_tech]

I’d need your vin to get exact wiring information.

 

[canada_eh]

Last 8 of vin GG176464
Say i measure 2.1 on the can at the ecm plug i would then assume or target can wiring or another module "bringing the system down" which i can eliminate by unplugging modules off of the green star/bus connectors one by one correct?

Alright well bus wiring is what we were thinking as well.
Star connectors you are referring to are the green bus bars with all the 2 prong connectors , there are 2 on the drivers side under the column then 1 in the pass kick panel.

So technically can a faulty sensor bring down a module then bring down this system as all of these modules are on the can c system. Its just the troubleshooting wise not sure if iam going about this the correct way.

 

[Tach_tech]

As long as bus voltages are in that 2.0-2.5v range it should be ok. A sensor can take down the bus, it’s usually something on the 5V reference circuits. A common one is the engine fan.

You’re correct about the star connectors, you can check bus voltage there as well as unplugging each one to see if normal communication is restored. I’m on my phone right now so I won’t be able to get exact pin out for bus wiring at the PCM till tomorrow.

 

[canada_eh]

I have alldata and the circuit diagrams so i truly appreciate that but wont need those diagrams, just some advice and direction.
Testing wise on the 5v reference circuits iam looking at the "check the 5volt supply circuit for voltage" test which is unplugging sensors one by one and reading the pigtail for voltage and as well as testing a 5volt circuit and testing the ground of said circuit. Iam assuming this is what you mean by the 5v reference circuits?
Engine fan sounds like a good starting point.

Secondly in regards to testing at the bus about reading the 60 0hms of resistance with the battery disconnected that is just removing a 2 plug from the star connector and measuring the resistance across that plug?

Example: Measure the resistance of the (D27) CAN C Bus (+) circuit between the STAR CAN Connector DASH C4 harness connector and the PCM C1 connector.
So that is unplugging the 2 prong plug and hooking the ohm meter up to what 2 places exactly, would it be the - prong on the star connector of the d302 circuit and the - can prong on the dtcm pin 5, essentially iam checking that WIRE for any break

 

[Tach_tech]

As for the 5V reference yes, check to ensure 5V at the sensor as well as unplugging and checking if any communication is restored.

When you’re checking 60ohms resistance that is termination resistance of the module, measured at the can + - at the module or at star connector wiring. I believe the BCM should have 120ohms but not positive, I’d have to check the service procedure.

When checking wiring for a break, max should be 5ohms.

 

[canada_eh]

Alrighty! Thank you so much, truly appreciate the help and guidance. Should be a fun sunday, hopefully we can find the culprit. Will report back with some findings! Again Thank you !!

 

[Mike Huber]

Hi, for me it seems the ECM is on its way out. What happens if you try to reprogram truck? What scan tool (Witec or what?) do you use? A recovery file from https://racemeofficial.com/category/tuners/ could help if you have the RaceMe Ultra.