Upgrading my 2015 EcoDiesel, Hemi or Hurricane?

[ramffml]

My previous truck was an '18 F150. I didn't have it for long, but it never had a single problem.

You didn't have it long enough. Tim Esterdahl just had a report this week, Ford has the most recalls; literally 5 times the recalls of the next guy. 19.5 million vehicles from March 25 to March 26, way, way beyond Toyota who was second at 4.1 and then Chrysler at 3.4.

But you can't really judge quality on a forum because "squeaky wheel" combined with enthusiasts are completely dwarfed by the guys who just drive them and don't have issues.

Ford is no better than any other manufacturer, that's the hard honest truth. Buy what appeals to you and suits your needs best because if you bought on what you thought was quality and end up with one of the crappy ones it's going to be a bad time. If you bought what you like you can be more forgiving of flaws and issues.

 

[mikeru]

You can't separate them, it's the same truck; same engines, same transmission, same frames, same electronics; literally all the same except for styling and feature differences which are the same type of differences you'd find on (say) a bighorn vs laramie or LT vs LTZ: in other words, the difference between GM and Chevy are basically the type of differences that distinguish one trim from another.

Ford tries to play that game by saying "F series is best selling" and then putting all their F trucks (F150 - F650 or whatever it is) into the group. All GM needs to do is create a marketing label like "G series", put both chevy and gmc inside the G group and miracle of miracles "G series is now best selling".

Marketing is full of lies, but GM has been best selling since 2019, Ford behind them, and Ram always third.

I can see why you’d think that, but actually, Chevy and GMC are separate entities. They may share some components, and are both under the GM Umbrella, but they are in fact separate. That’s why they’re listed separately in truck sales charts. Combining them because they share some components means you’d have to combine other car makers that share a corporate parent and components, like Toyota and Lexus, Nissan and Infinity, Honda and Acura, Audi and VW, etc. And then you have the cars that are produced in collaboration, like the Subaru BRZ and Toyota gr86. Lots of shared components there.

 

[ramffml]

I can see why you’d think that, but actually, Chevy and GMC are separate entities. They may share some components, and are both under the GM Umbrella, but they are in fact separate. That’s why they’re listed separately in truck sales charts. Combining them because they share some components means you’d have to combine other car makers that share a corporate parent and components, like Toyota and Lexus, Nissan and Infinity, Honda and Acura, Audi and VW, etc. And then you have the cars that are produced in collaboration, like the Subaru BRZ and Toyota gr86. Lots of shared components there.

They are called the GM twins for a reason. It's the same truck. They don't just share "some" components, they share literally everything with exception of minor trim differences, even built on the same assembly line.

If Ford can combine everything under one label "F Series" and say "F series is best selling", then GM can say "bullsh|t we sell more". The differences between an F150 and an F250 are huge vs the differences between an LT and SLE.

GM is the corporation, Chevrolet and GMC are brands. Ford is both a brand and a corporation. So as a corporation, GM sells more than Ford. Individual brands may have different numbers, Ford only has the one brand. But then how deep down that hole do you go... starting from the very top (corporation) and working all the way down to a specific truck... why is corporation the wrong number, brand is the right number, trim is the wrong number, or even separating by v8 etc etc. Does one care that GM sells more v8's than Ford? No. Does one care that XLT sells more/less vs LT? No. Does one care that F150 sells more than GMC? You do, I don't. Does one care that GM sells more than Ford? This is the only number that matters when comparing in the segment.

We could also start discussing profits and what matters to shareholders... in the end though, it's clear that GM has been more successful.

Side question, as a buyer, who cares? Not me, I picked the 3rd leader in sales. There are some to who "running with the joneses" matters most, they need validate their purchase and feel like they got the best truck because most people are buying it, and for those people Ford is leaning heavily in their F series marketing. But it's BS.

 

[Farmer Fran]

Cannot speak for the GM light duty but I can say the Safari and Astro were very much the same. I know it was years ago. I knew people that worked at the plant, and they would say how identical they were

 

[mikeru]

They are called the GM twins for a reason. It's the same truck. They don't just share "some" components, they share literally everything with exception of minor trim differences, even built on the same assembly line.

If Ford can combine everything under one label "F Series" and say "F series is best selling", then GM can say "bullsh|t we sell more". The differences between an F150 and an F250 are huge vs the differences between an LT and SLE.

GM is the corporation, Chevrolet and GMC are brands. Ford is both a brand and a corporation. So as a corporation, GM sells more than Ford. Individual brands may have different numbers, Ford only has the one brand. But then how deep down that hole do you go... starting from the very top (corporation) and working all the way down to a specific truck... why is corporation the wrong number, brand is the right number, trim is the wrong number, or even separating by v8 etc etc. Does one care that GM sells more v8's than Ford? No. Does one care that XLT sells more/less vs LT? No. Does one care that F150 sells more than GMC? You do, I don't. Does one care that GM sells more than Ford? This is the only number that matters when comparing in the segment.

We could also start discussing profits and what matters to shareholders... in the end though, it's clear that GM has been more successful.

Side question, as a buyer, who cares? Not me, I picked the 3rd leader in sales. There are some to who "running with the joneses" matters most, they need validate their purchase and feel like they got the best truck because most people are buying it, and for those people Ford is leaning heavily in their F series marketing. But it's BS.

Throughout US automotive history there have been instances like the Chevy and GMC truck similarities. Especially within GM brands. For instance, as a kid I wondered why there was a Chevy Nova, Pontiac Ventura, and Oldsmobile Omega. They were virtually the same car. But you can be sure the sales numbers of each were kept track of separately.

I’m not arguing how similar the Chevy and GMC trucks are. But you’re wrong that they aren’t looked at as separate entities as far as sales numbers go. I can also tell you from experience that GMC owners don’t like it when someone calls their truck a Chevy.

 

[Gero]

Either F150 coyote and swap the valve body or go ram with hurricane. I would avoid new hemi mainly because of the mild hybrid ejunk.

 

[ramffml]

Throughout US automotive history there have been instances like the Chevy and GMC truck similarities. Especially within GM brands. For instance, as a kid I wondered why there was a Chevy Nova, Pontiac Ventura, and Oldsmobile Omega. They were virtually the same car. But you can be sure the sales numbers of each were kept track of separately.

I’m not arguing how similar the Chevy and GMC trucks are. But you’re wrong that they aren’t looked at as separate entities as far as sales numbers go. I can also tell you from experience that GMC owners don’t like it when someone calls their truck a Chevy.

It doesn't matter what the owners think. Lets look at this logically, from the top:
- Ford created the "F series is best selling" marketing slogan
- They lump F150 - F5/60 into it all
- They do not break out F150 or F250 etc sales by themselves, in their quarterly/yearly reports
- The differences between an F150 and F550 are huge, different market, different buyers
- The differences between an SLT and LT are tiny, like a difference in trim
- Since Ford is creating this artificial group and defining the boundaries of that group (everything in half ton to 1 ton and beyond), in order to make fair fair, we need to add up all the sales in those segments from Ram into their group, and GM twins into their group.

Therefore Ford's marketing is incorrect. GM sells more. It's really that simple.

Not only do they sell more trucks in that entire segment, they make more profit than Ford too. The GMC division is a license to print money, the Denali sub brand has been hugely successful and makes up a huge part of those sales, all high end models, pure profit.

GM is kicking Ford's butt. Ford guys need to get over it.

 

[Jimmy07]

They do not break out F150 or F250 etc sales by themselves, in their quarterly/yearly reports

Neither does Ram or GM. It’s ALL of their full size pickups bundled into the quarterly and yearly reports.
And Ram even had a crutch for model years 2019-2024, since they had two vehicle lines for the 1500, where the others didn’t.

 

[ramffml]

Neither does Ram or GM.

Yes, GM does.

For example:

Sales Report: Ram Truck Sales Continue to Decline, But Ford, GMC, & Toyota Sales Are Gaining in Q3 2024 - The Fast Lane Truck

Sales Report: Ram Truck Sales Continue to Decline, But Ford, GMC, & Toyota Sales Are Gaining in Q3 2024 for the full-size truck category.

tfltruck.com

 

[ramffml]

And Ram even had a crutch for model years 2019-2024, since they had two vehicle lines for the 1500, where the others didn’t.

Could Nissan blame Ford's success on F150 having more trim/options available than Titan? To a certain extent you're right, the more options you have the more you can fit an exact truck to a specific consumer, but it's not some "crutch". If anything it's the other way around. What does that say about the much newer Fords/GMs and even 5th gens, that a truck designed more than 15 years ago was still selling in large enough numbers?

Ram Classic was the best value in the segment, in terms of what you get for what you pay. The 5th gen are a little nicer and more refined in some areas, but that doesn't mean Ram was somehow cheating the numbers game by keeping the classic around. They weren't giving them away, people made the decision to buy them over the F150 and other trucks. Fair game.

 

[jzacha]

I'm looking at selling my 2015 RAM EcoDiesel. It's been a Great truck. My driving habits have changed, so having the diesel doesn't make sense anymore, as I only drive 2.5 miles one way to work now. I'm looking at RAM 1500's in either Rebel, Limited or RHO trims. Which engine is better and why? And yes I know the RHO only comes with the Hurricane. Two features of my truck I love are the RAM box and 4 corner air suspension (not available on RHO). What are the problems with Etorque and are there any problems with the Hurricane motor?

Thanks in Advance!
Mike

There’s a dealer in Louisiana that’s your best option if ordering.

I love the look and value of the base level RHO and would take that any day over an overpriced rebel. If going standard hurricane, I’d get whatever is cheapest that has the options you want.

 

[djhartm]

I have both.

The HO is BY FAR the superior engine.

 

[rocket]

The only reason I'm looking at the RHO, is that it looks cool and has a great stance.

So does the warlock classic. That and the hemi (2022). That’s my choice.

 

[Dusty]

If you're come from a Eco Diesel, I think you'll find the Hurricane with slightly more torque and gas mileage more likeable.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 150666 miles.

 

[crash68]

If you're come from a Eco Diesel, I think you'll find the Hurricane with slightly more torque and gas mileage more likeable.

torque yes, gas mileage not even close as it has spark plugs but props for having a turbo. I get better fuel economy towing my boat than some people do just driving. Hook 7K lbs travel trailer behind a Hurricane and it will probably beat out the Hemi for fuel economy but not the EcoD.

 

[MikeC725]

Either F150 coyote and swap the valve body or go ram with hurricane. I would avoid new hemi mainly because of the mild hybrid ejunk.

I'm not really an F150 fan, nor do I like the Silverado, the GMC.......maybe.

 

[MikeC725]

torque yes, gas mileage not even close as it has spark plugs but props for having a turbo. I get better fuel economy towing my boat than some people do just driving. Hook 7K lbs travel trailer behind a Hurricane and it will probably beat out the Hemi for fuel economy but not the EcoD.

11 years and 122K miles and I've never hooked up a trailer...... I bought it originally for the mpg's. I was driving 65 miles round trip to work 5 days a week until covid, then 3 days a week. Now I'm driving 20 miles round trip a week, 5 miles a day. LOL.

 

[Gero]

I'm not really an F150 fan, nor do I like the Silverado, the GMC.......maybe.

I am sort of in the same boat except the alumaduty is such a big advantage over steel as rust is the #1 enemy where we are.

Its enough to steer me into fordland for the next truck. Fortunately my 2017 wont be replaced until another 10years minimum. Trucks are way too expensive it's not even funny.

 

[MikeC725]

I am sort of in the same boat except the alumaduty is such a big advantage over steel as rust is the #1 enemy where we are.

Its enough to steer me into fordland for the next truck. Fortunately my 2017 wont be replaced until another 10years minimum. Trucks are way too expensive it's not even funny.

I hear you about rust as I'm just across the river from you.....30 minutes west of Detroit.

 

[mikeru]

I'm not really an F150 fan, nor do I like the Silverado, the GMC.......maybe.

What!!?? How can this be? How can one not like the Silverado but maybe like the GMC? According to one member here who has been very vocal about it, they are virtually the same truck. So there's no way this could happen. It's like mixing matter and anti-matter. No good can come of this.