We need UOA's for Cam/Lifter Failures...

[Burla]

Guys one of the pieces of this puzzle missing is uoa's on these cam failures. The last thing someone wants to do is spend 35 bucks when their cam fails. But this can be helpful in two ways, number one if there is a warranty issue it can reveal the oil was in good condition but there was heavy wear, which can help you with your warranty or case against FCA if they deny you, something they do on a high number of cases. For this purpose, I would also recommend getting tbn. Secondly, you will be putting back another cam/lifters and knowing if that had heavy wear numbers and which metals are wearing could help you if your truck starts showing signs the new cam is failing. You could possible sell it or trade it in to avoid $$, or even try thicker oil to maybe protect it.

So last week when I seen one guy who owned two rams that both had premature cam fails right within the window of when we are seeing them 75-125k, one of his made it is a little longer, I have a hard time believing this guy is that unlucky. I think this is more prevalent then any of us know. It may even be that oil cannot fix it, but at least knowing if accelerated wear numbers were happening we could take action, if not trading in the vehicle at least simply fixing the lifters and avoid installing a cam, a much cheaper procedure. So guys that had those mis-fire codes consider doing a uoa and posting the results. Let's figure this thing out.

 

[GMcD]

How does one do a used oil analysis?

 

[Burla]

How does one do a used oil analysis?

blackstone

That is a good question, that lab will send you a kit for free even with return shipping, you pay by check or visa when you send sample back.

 

[U&A]

This is absolutely the missing link in the cam failure threads. It would give everyone much more insight especially the OP happened did multi ones that showed the downhill trend.




GREAT thread Mike!




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[8675309]

Good idea!

 

[joshuaeb09]

Guys one of the pieces of this puzzle missing is uoa's on these cam failures. The last thing someone wants to do is spend 35 bucks when their cam fails. But this can be helpful in two ways, number one if there is a warranty issue it can reveal the oil was in good condition but there was heavy wear, which can help you with your warranty or case against FCA if they deny you, something they do on a high number of cases. For this purpose, I would also recommend getting tbn. Secondly, you will be putting back another cam/lifters and knowing if that had heavy wear numbers and which metals are wearing could help you if your truck starts showing signs the new cam is failing. You could possible sell it or trade it in to avoid $$, or even try thicker oil to maybe protect it.

So last week when I seen one guy who owned two rams that both had premature cam fails right within the window of when we are seeing them 75-125k, one of his made it is a little longer, I have a hard time believing this guy is that unlucky. I think this is more prevalent then any of us know. It may even be that oil cannot fix it, but at least knowing if accelerated wear numbers were happening we could take action, if not trading in the vehicle at least simply fixing the lifters and avoid installing a cam, a much cheaper procedure. So guys that had those mis-fire codes consider doing a uoa and posting the results. Let's figure this thing out.

I'd love to see the wear indicators for lifter failure. It would be nice if there are clear indications in the data so we could at least know what warning signs to look for from the motor. Truth be told I'd probably order a full hotter cam package myself if I knew failure was imminent, but I'm easily tempted by upgrades (especially ones that sound as good a good cam grind).

 

[Firebird]

Excellent idea!

 

[Nova John]

Can Blackstone labs tell if the metal is from a cam or lifter failing? Or will it show up as metal in the oil.

 

[U&A]

Can Blackstone labs tell if the metal is from a cam or lifter failing? Or will it show up as metal in the oil.

It will show up as super high iron. They will make suggestions of what it is/could be.


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[chrisbh17]

Great idea.

Even better would be someone with a low mileage truck that starts to get regular UOAs over the lifetime of the truck. Then if they do eventually have the lifter/cam issue, we can try to see what went wrong and possibly even WHEN it started to go wrong.

I just switched to RL over the weekend, my truck has 8K miles on it, I planned on its first UOA after the RL OCI is up and then probably once a year (every other oil change) after that.

 

[Burla]

Maybe someone can find that thread, like I said a ram forum member already did this with his ticking hemi and right before his cam failed the numbers were astronomical. I understand that one example does not a fact make, but if we have a couple it could be a thing. If you pay attention to the blackstone newsletter, they often catch failures before they happen.

 

[R.L.K.]

Great idea.

Even better would be someone with a low mileage truck that starts to get regular UOAs over the lifetime of the truck. Then if they do eventually have the lifter/cam issue, we can try to see what went wrong and possibly even WHEN it started to go wrong.

I just switched to RL over the weekend, my truck has 8K miles on it, I planned on its first UOA after the RL OCI is up and then probably once a year (every other oil change) after that.

I hope it's not ME ,but I'd be a great candidate , as I've got UOA's since about 20k and I'm at the cam/ lifter failure zone now with 70k

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[GMcD]

I hope it's not ME ,but I'd be a great candidate , as I've got UOA's since about 20k and I'm at the cam/ lifter failure zone now with 70k

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Mind posting your data?

 

[Ramnewbie]

Speaking of oil samples, what was the final outcome of the supposed redline sample that was messed up? Was it in fact not redline or did Blackstone labs mess up? I've lost track of that issue.



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[U&A]

Speaking of oil samples, what was the final outcome of the supposed redline sample that was messed up? Was it in fact not redline or did Blackstone labs mess up? I've lost track of that issue.



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Mike has a copy of the final emails. They admitted that something was not quite right.

Ill see if i can find them.


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[R.L.K.]

Mind posting your data?

Not at all , my UOA's have been well documented for years in the synthetic oil thread [emoji106]

Here's a couple pics of my history [emoji16]

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[U&A]

Not at all , my UOA's have been well documented for years in the synthetic oil thread [emoji106]

Here's a couple pics of my history [emoji16]

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Nice slow downward trend of iron[emoji106][emoji2532]

And your aluminum numbers are AWSOME the entire life of the engine


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[RedSRT4Me]

Not at all , my UOA's have been well documented for years in the synthetic oil thread [emoji106]

Here's a couple pics of my history [emoji16]

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Do you added any additives to your oil?

 

[U&A]

Speaking of oil samples, what was the final outcome of the supposed redline sample that was messed up? Was it in fact not redline or did Blackstone labs mess up? I've lost track of that issue.



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Curtesy of Burla. He did the work. This was the last email to him from blackstone.






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[Ramnewbie]

Thanks U&A and Burla. That's one reason I don't want to do a uao untill I run an oil for the second oil change. I'm not sure I quiet believe his analogy unless the OP just added redline to Amsoil and didn't actually change his oil. I can see a small amount of leftover oil but not enough to effect a UOA to that extent.

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