Can we please get past the dealership model?

[Ratman6161]

Anyone who goes to a stealersh!t deserve what they get...

Specialty shops are where it's at.

Its like people that go to fast food joints and complain when the foods garbage...lol...

Good, because I have nothing but dood things to say about both my Chevy and my Ram dealer

Seriously, if you don't like the deal then walk. I've got about 10 Rammdealers within 50 miles of me. If I don't like what I'm hearing I'll go some wheren else. When I hear someone say the experience was horrible from start to finish but the made the purchase anyway, I have to ask why? Why not just walk away and go somewhere else?

 

[GTyankee]

I am starting to wonder, if many very good auto service businesses are going to survive.
Between Covid & the changes being made by the top people in gov't
a lot of great shops are closing their doors.

My dealership was among the best, now they can't get good techs or even Service Advisers. My dealership used to have 8 service advisers, now they only have one & 4 greeters, that take your name & write down your odometer reading.

What bothers me even more, a German auto repair business that has been in town for ever, closed their doors 2 weeks ago.
They had so much business, they were scheduling appointments a month out.
I sure hope that they needed to move to a building with more service bays ?

 

[jejb]

Anyone who goes to a stealersh!t deserve what they get...

Specialty shops are where it's at.

Its like people that go to fast food joints and complain when the foods garbage...lol...

So if your truck is under the factory warranty, would you take it to an independent and pay out of pocket instead of taking it to a dealer?

 

[SniperDroid]

Way too much bitterness and acid in this thread, now. I found two dealerships I enjoy dealing with. A third that is pretty good, but doesn't have a Heavy Duty guy. I'm sorry for those that have been burned, but keep looking. There's a gem out there for you yet!

 

[Defuse]

You are reading what he wrote incorrectly. He is using an independant shop that specializes in vw Audi and Porsche, not the dealership. There are quite a few specialty independants that I have dealt with and they are generally exceptionally good at fixing their specialty makes. Most are factory trained earlier in their careers, some were even trained on factory sponsored race teams. They are the guys that take extraordinary pride in their work and expertise. These are exactly the guys the dealers need to have and consistently lose because of how their shops operate.

Yes, thank you for clarifying for me. This is exactly what I want in a service / warranty shop. Dealerships unfortunately are never going to be this because their business interests do not align with the work required to have a successful independent specialty shop.

To those saying keep looking. I will respond with a question. What is the reasonable amount of effort required of an individual to find a business that is honest? What is the method I can use to definitively determine if the dealer is honest? it's a rhetorical question because the answer is none. There is no way to do those things. So the logical answer is to remove that variable and deal with the manufacturer directly. This model is coming sooner than later anyway with Tesla already adopting this practice. I don't know how it's working for them cause electric cars are not for me but at the very least you know you are only dealing with the manufacturer.

 

[AnthonyRI]

Posting with very clear bias - so we're all on the same page.

Feedback - the dealerships ARE held accountable for feedback through the post-sale survey. If you did not get one, you should have. There are financial implications to poor survey trends, and even more-so for interference with said surveys. It's not taken lightly by Stellantis.

Searching for a good dealer I think is going to become more and more difficult. We're seeing consolidation across the country with large publicly traded companies buying up dealerships - this is resulting in the walmartization. Personal opinion, the independent dealers that are left independent - are going to be the best of the best on one end and the worst of the worst on the other. The middle is being gobbled up. As this happens, though, it should become more obvious - and you may be looking out of state.

 

[brian42]

So the logical answer is to remove that variable and deal with the manufacturer directly. This model is coming sooner than later anyway with Tesla already adopting this practice. I don't know how it's working for them cause electric cars are not for me but at the very least you know you are only dealing with the manufacturer.

Auto manufacturers want to sell directly to you but there are state laws that prohibit that. The idea is that it increases competition, benefits local communities, and (my favorite) the in-person experience is more satisfying to the customer. They would save a lot staffing and real estate cost to just have service and parts centers.

Selling directly to the customer also cuts out a lot of negotiation and allows them to make more net profit with less discounts. Of course they'll deliver it to your driveway. The vehicle is at your house, in your driveway, and is only 14 signatures away from staying there so you're more apt to purchase it; and most likely at a higher price than if you were sitting at the dealership looking out their glass wall at it in their parking lot. There's strategy in everything and a little extra investment up front (free/nominal fee delivery to your front door) pays dividends down the road ($XX/month extra out of your pocket to theirs for 5+ years). No auto manufacturer is a non-profit and they are very good at it (otherwise they would be out of business).

Ford has been teasing non-negotiable pricing for a while now so it's only a matter of time before you are paying list price for all their new vehicles (and probably used ones on their lot too). Remember Saturn and the "no dicker sticker"? You were getting the "best price" so there was no need to negotiate as they had already done that for you...both new and used vehicles on their lot.

Tesla has slipped through the cracks as they sell via the internet and corporate-owned showrooms and galleries...not traditional independently-owned franchises.

 

[Defuse]

and you may be looking out of state.

This is the first new vehicle I have bought in my state in at least 20 years. All of my other vehicles were bought out of state and they were always a much smoother process.

 

[jejb]

Auto manufacturers want to sell directly to you but there are state laws that prohibit that. The idea is that it increases competition, benefits local communities, and (my favorite) the in-person experience is more satisfying to the customer. They would save a lot staffing and real estate cost to just have service and parts centers.

Selling directly to the customer also cuts out a lot of negotiation and allows them to make more net profit with less discounts. Of course they'll deliver it to your driveway. The vehicle is at your house, in your driveway, and is only 14 signatures away from staying there so you're more apt to purchase it; and most likely at a higher price than if you were sitting at the dealership looking out their glass wall at it in their parking lot. There's strategy in everything and a little extra investment up front (free/nominal fee delivery to your front door) pays dividends down the road ($XX/month extra out of your pocket to theirs for 5+ years). No auto manufacturer is a non-profit and they are very good at it (otherwise they would be out of business).

Ford has been teasing non-negotiable pricing for a while now so it's only a matter of time before you are paying list price for all their new vehicles (and probably used ones on their lot too). Remember Saturn and the "no dicker sticker"? You were getting the "best price" so there was no need to negotiate as they had already done that for you...both new and used vehicles on their lot.

Tesla has slipped through the cracks as they sell via the internet and corporate-owned showrooms and galleries...not traditional independently-owned franchises.

I'm not saying your wrong, but if there are state laws preventing dealers from selling direct, how does Tesla get away with it? Some kind of EV exception going on?

 

[Defuse]

I'm not saying your wrong, but if there are state laws preventing dealers from selling direct, how does Tesla get away with it? Some kind of EV exception going on?

Tesla's lobbyist are better than the dealerships lobbyist.

 

[CanuckRam1313]

I bought my ram in 2017 all online only going to dealer to pick up. Was smooth as butter.

I too purchased my 19' new online....

Funny story (or not funny...) - my then wife and I with our newborn get to the dealership to pick up our new truck.

I am immediately asked by the salesman to sign acceptance of the truck in the showroom and then he will show us our new truck... LOL.. not a chance buddy.... visual inspection, FIRST!

I do the inspection walkaround with the salesman. FML.... passenger side step bar is crunched to FFFFF..... there is a big scratch in the front right corner of the quarter panel by the top corner near the hood, and on the left rear corner panel, too near the bed cover.

I lay down under the truck as I purchased the factory undercoating (I like it nice and black underneath so I or others don't see rust orange, ever...lol), and inspect all door hinges for that wax stuff they lay down.

I also whip out my LED high intensity flashlight and inspect every inch of the body (purchased the OEM paint protection package as well).

Well, mr salesman.... what are you doing about my passenger side step, damages to my paint, shoddy application of undercoating and wax spray, and subpar paint protection application, too.

The guy dang near crapped himself..... he get's the sales manager.... this f_n juice monkey comes out and goes over the peripherals with me and says.... I'll give you $300 cash right now to take is as is....

I told him to his face to go FFFFFFFFFF himself and that I'll immediately report this to the media and the factory, as well as the BBB (Better Business Bureau), and the UCDA and the Ombudsman, too! I disclosed that everything has been recorded, documented, as well as his BS offer to just buy me out with cash and move me on!

He then said...okay sir... no worries... we'll take it from here and fix it... to which I told him that he will NOT be keeping my new truck, and he will put in writing right now that the dealership will address all deficiencies at their total cost to my satisfaction from the shop of my choice with ZERO cost to me, and full adhesion to all contractual purchases and/or warranties.... he agreed, in writing with no contest.

I took my new truck to a trusted shop and had everything addressed to my satisfaction. Their bill was north of $5K before tax...

Needless to say, my truck has been excellent with zero issues, and continues to be a fantastic purchase that I do not regret (say for the standard UConnect and stock exhaust manifold issues... but I knew those were coming, so it was a non-issue )

Moral of the story... do a forensic inspection of your new vehicle and don't sign a F_N thing until you are satisfied....

 

[Gary Hogan]

There is the whole service side to a dealership. And without dealerships who will do recall repairs? Warranty repairs? Other repairs that require special equipment from the manufacturer? Are you suggesting dealerships be turned into factory service centers only? Allow independent shops to do said repairs?

Not saying dealerships are fun but they do provide a network of local service and support as well as sales.

 

[Gary Hogan]

But unfortunately the system also fails at the service department in many cases.

 

[TestPilot57]

I want nothing more than to be able to go to a manufacturer's website, configure my vehicle, have it built and delivered to me without having to ever talk to a dealership again.

So you have no interest in looking at and/or driving a truck similar to one you are going to spend $50-100k on?

Unless/until VR can become indistinguishable from IRL that ain't happenin' for me.

Not to mention service. Pass it off to indie shops for warranty, recalls, etc?

 

[brian42]

I'm not saying your wrong, but if there are state laws preventing dealers from selling direct, how does Tesla get away with it? Some kind of EV exception going on?

Tesla sells on-line and their showroom/galleries are company-owned...not an independently-owned affiliate making a profit.

Florida just passed a new law letting new manufacturer's sell direct also (but keeping existing dealerships as they are).

Polestar is coming up through the path that Tesla blazed. They are breaking new ground as they are not only on-line and in galleries but they are selling at select Volvo dealerships that they've 'partnered' with. Even though Volvo bought that company in 2015 I can only assume it has remained its own entity to enjoy the benefits and loopholes of an electric-only lineup.

 

[Ratman6161]

I'm not saying your wrong, but if there are state laws preventing dealers from selling direct, how does Tesla get away with it? Some kind of EV exception going on?

I don't know about other states, but here in MN Tesla does have e a physical location. But for some reason they can't sell used cars here. I learned this when wh3n I asked the sales manager at our Infiniti dealer why they had so many used Teslas. Apparently they has a deal with Tesla where they handle their used car sales.

 

[Ratman6161]

Tesla sells on-line and their showroom/galleries are company-owned...not an independently-owned affiliate making a profit.

Florida just passed a new law letting new manufacturer's sell direct also (but keeping existing dealerships as they are).

Polestar is coming up through the path that Tesla blazed. They are breaking new ground as they are not only on-line and in galleries but they are selling at select Volvo dealerships that they've 'partnered' with. Even though Volvo bought that company in 2015 I can only assume it has remained its own entity to enjoy the benefits and loopholes of an electric-only lineup.

FYI, Polestar is actually a branch of Volvo. After Volvo was bought out by the Chinese, they separated their EV's into a separate "brand" similar to how you can buy a Chevy or a GMC but they are both General Motors. If they are usingnth8s to claim to be a new "brand" it's just a gimmick/loophole.

 

[GTyankee]

I don't know about all dealerships, but the dodge dealership that i have been using, has 3 or more Sales Departments.

Showroom Sales Team, a bunch of Junior Salesmen, that can't sign anything, without the Sales Managers permission. When you ask them a question, they ask you if you would like a cup of coffee, because they are thirsty. Actually means, i'll have to ask the Manager.

Then there is the V.I.P. Sales Team, these sales persons are always smiling, i think they might use super glue to keep their lips up.
They are more knowledgeable than the show room staff, if there is something that they are not sure of, they can call the Manager & some of them have a laptop & DealerConnect access, that gives them access to Ram Headquarters & some Ram Engineers.

Then there is the Fleet/Internet Sales Team. Some of this Team also can be found in the VIP offices, it seems like some of them have the same power as the Assistant Sales Manager.
my sales man mainly works with the Fleet/Internet Sales Group, but he has his own office in the V.I.P. building, he has access to DealerConnect, & his own FAX/Printer/Copier. ( to me that is a sign of power at a dealership )

 

[Fishing Fool]

I recently purchased a new RAM from my local dealer. The process absolutely abysmal with dishonesty and gaslighting at every turn. I have already talked to the ownership of the dealership that they have lost my business forever. Is there a path for customers to share these experiences with FCA for them to see how bad their brand is being represented?

I am not terribly interested in getting back on the soap box just for the sake of it if at the end of the day nothing happens to the dealer to change their behavior. I want nothing more than to be able to go to a manufacturer's website, configure my vehicle, have it built and delivered to me without having to ever talk to a dealership again.


Yes, I am bitter these **** bags can just lie to the public and there are no repercussions for their actions.

You can.
TESLA

Even make trucks or so they say they will.

 

[kdoublep]

It is my opinion that anything that has to do with purchasing, selling, insuring, repairing or maintaining a vehicle just kinda sucks. We can do things that help it suck less, but it still sucks.