EPS to hydraulic power steering conversion

[Lentfiddle]

My power steering went out a few weeks ago on my 2013 5.7L and I’m curious if I can convert from EPS to just a traditional power steering set up. I’m learning this electronic garbage is just problems and a money pity

 

[khaled_hourani]

Im interested in this too, if someone can chim in please.

 

[Jeepwalker]

Here's a thought though before you ditch the EPS: There are a few common issues with EPS that it might be worth looking into which shouldn't take a whole lot of time. You never know you might be able to pinpoint the issue fairly easy.
#1. Check the fuse, Connector/Wiring (for corrosion & voltage signal)
#2. Remove the square cover, check the wiring & circuit board. Behind that cover is the circuit board that controls the EPS. There have been several reports that water fills up the cavity behind that cover. And it can short out the contacts. The circuit board itself is coated in a water-protecting plastic coating, but the main wires which connect to it are not. Maybe it all needs to dry out. If you have the circuit board out you might ask a guy you know who's decent with electronics to put his eye on it. A lot of electronic issues can be seen/or smelled (corroded traces, burnt components, cold solder joint, leaky capacitors, etc). It could be that simple.

These circuit boards are exposed to the cold, then heat up in a small compartment. If a guy made 3 trips a day on average for 10 years, that would be 10,950 cycles. That's not a lot in electronic terms, but ...How hot do they get?? IDK, good question. Heat/cool cycles loosen up solder joints and can cause flake-out, even if 99.999% of the rest is good. But if you ID'd a bad solder joint then it could be restored with one simple touch of a solder iron and a few min work. Or maybe there's enough moisture behind the cover and heating the circuit board causes condensation to occur and drip down on the contacts??

#3. Check the motor. If the control circuit board looks good, you might want to whack the motor a couple times with the wood handle of a hammer (not too hard) in case the armature is 'stuck'. Small electric motors can do that. Ideally, Ohm out the wires that go to it, etc. Make sure it's working properly. I think I read there's a belt on the motor. Is that still good ...or loose/broken? There's probably a couple videos on EPS racks by now that might be worth watching.

Good luck...

 

[Jeepwalker]

Swapping over:

Ditching the EPS *might* impact the stability system and maybe other systems which you might be able to turn off via AlfaOBD. But I'm not sure.

2013 was a Ram model 'refresh' year. A lot of things, especially electrical, are different than the 2012 truck's. Besides looking the same, a ton of things are actually different on the 2013 and later trucks. One thing you'd want to check is to ensure the frame had the ability to accept a hyraulic rack. It probably *can* accept a hydraulic rack as-is ..but check it out. Worst case a guy could cut brackets off a 2012 truck, or fab some up (if needed). But I suspect there's likely universality on EPS & Hydraulic systems.

There might even be a ready-made 2013 hydraulic rack for export markets like Mexico and Latin American (just conjecture) that would possibly interface to 2013 electronics (but with hydraulic control). I'm specutlating, but worth checking into. If there is, that might make a hydraulic swap-over a ton easier.

 

[Jeepwalker]

Go to the Mopar store and put in your truck's VIN and search out for a hydraulic steering ram. https://store.mopar.com. Then do a general search for other 2013's. See if a hydraulic rack comes up. And does it match a 2012?

I put in 2013 and it came up with hydraulic steering RL171449AB. But I haven't dug into very much to see how accurate it is. Maybe put your question into a straight google search (& a Youtube search too) and see what comes up for a hydraulic conversion. Mine's a 2012 so...I don't have to worry lol

 

[hunterdan]

Go to the Mopar store and put in your truck's VIN and search out for a hydraulic steering ram. https://store.mopar.com. Then do a general search for other 2013's. See if a hydraulic rack comes up. And does it match a 2012?

I put in 2013 and it came up with hydraulic steering RL171449AB. But I haven't dug into very much to see how accurate it is. Maybe put your question into a straight google search (& a Youtube search too) and see what comes up for a hydraulic conversion. Mine's a 2012 so...I don't have to worry lol

That part number you listed goes to a caravan, so doubtful it'd work.

 

[hunterdan]

As for the actual conversion to hydraulic power steering, the hard part is going to be the electronics. Isolating and removing what you don't need, then trying to figure out how to turn off those systems you don't need and possibly turn on others. The electronic steering is tied into so many other systems, just swapping in the hydraulic stuff could cause tons of issues.

 

[crash68]

I’m learning this electronic garbage is just problems and a money pity

Your learning is steering you wrong, the EPS is fairly trouble free.
As for converting the truck to hydraulic power steering that's probably going to be a no go as the electronic are cross integrated with the vehicle ABS/ESC system.

 

[Dean2]

If you want redular steering go buy a 2500, sell the half ton becuase the conversion you want to do, though possible, is really not easy. You would need to be a very advanced diyourselfer to get it done right.

 

[Jeepwalker]

Also, maybe your EPS unit just needs a simple (inexpensive) belt replacement and you're good to go. Pop the end off and check it out.

2010-2014 F-150 electric power steering rack fix save $$$$$$

has your electric steering rack gone out on your 2010-2014 f150 ? save hundreds by simply replacing the belt located inside the rack its selt!! dont go spend...

youtube.com

 

[Evguy1]

I did this swap a couple of years ago and no regrets. Had to turn off EPS with AlphaOBD. Hardest part was moving the mounting holes in the front cross member as the spacing is not the same. A couple of pic's on page 5 of my build. https://www.ramforum.com/threads/rambo-old-farts-last-build.160780/

 

[04fxdwgi]

I did this swap a couple of years ago and no regrets. Had to turn off EPS with AlphaOBD. Hardest part was moving the mounting holes in the front cross member as the spacing is not the same. A couple of pic's on page 5 of my build. https://www.ramforum.com/threads/rambo-old-farts-last-build.160780/

That thread was a great read and boy oh boy, you have some talent there.

 

[Dean2]

I did this swap a couple of years ago and no regrets. Had to turn off EPS with AlphaOBD. Hardest part was moving the mounting holes in the front cross member as the spacing is not the same. A couple of pic's on page 5 of my build. https://www.ramforum.com/threads/rambo-old-farts-last-build.160780/

Awesome thread. Seeing what you can do, I get why you think switching the steering was no big deal. You are exceptionally talented and very experienced. For the average guy, its a big deal.

 

[yrraljguthrie]

Why not just go back to the model T Ford? 100 years of improvements can't be good.

 

[AR RAM]

Just closing loop on my experience with replaceing my EPS. I tried replacing the eps drive belt first. This did not fix my issue. That was fairly easy to do but wound up just being a waste of about $50 and 5 hours of my time. Next step was to find a replacement EPS Rack and Pinon. If you searched for one you know there are no cheap ones to be had. Found one at Buy Auto Parts, very expensive, but a lifetime warranty. Took about 3 hours to switch out. Return the core for a refund. No need to get the computer flashed unless you get a code MIL light. No way to know...just depends on the year and make of the replacement eps. Mine worked great. You do need to get a new front end alignment because you remove the tierod ends. Mine worked great just sucks due to the cost. Water in the eps due to a bad boot clamp caused my failure . tks.

 

[Jeepwalker]

Out of curiousity, what was the condition of your old EPS unit's belt when you removed the housing cover (before you replaced it)? Was it in really good condition? Or did it appear kind of ragged?

Glad you're back up and running!

 

[AR RAM]

Out of curiousity, what was the condition of your old EPS unit's belt when you removed the housing cover (before you replaced it)? Was it in really good condition? Or did it appear kind of ragged?

Glad you're back up and running!

The old belt was in good shape. Really did not need replacing. I left the new belt on the rack and pinion when I returned the core. Just wasn't worth the time to pull it and had no use for it. A little tricky putting the new belt on...tight...secret was securing steering wheel with a ratchet strap around the brake pedal then disconnecting the steering shaft from the rack and pinion. This allowed me to move the gear in and out to get the new belt over the splined gear. Just remember to count the raised groves on the main shaft so you can return the rack to center....just a technique...I marked it with a sharpie. Be sure and use the right size Allen wrench on the cover screws too.

 

[AR RAM]

Btw...I could see corrosion inside the belt housing. Water corrosion. I had a bad boot clamp on that side tie rod. During duck season I drove thru some standing water. That allowed water to get in. Bad design...it's my understanding that ram has updated the new trucks with a better rack.

 

[tractor]

Yes, not sure why so many people come into this forum to defend the electronic power steering technology, they're like oh just check the million little points that are known to fail it's not that bad go check this go check that plug go check this go look at that make sure you check this,,, which by the way it's never the belt I've seen these things go 200,000 miles the belt looks fine...

My power steering went out a few weeks ago on my 2013 5.7L and I’m curious if I can convert from EPS to just a traditional power steering set up. I’m learning this electronic garbage is just problems and a money pity

The issue is the million little failure points on these systems and I literally mean a million little failure points that are all super sensitive to the slightest amount of oxidation which completely disabled the utilitary and value on the RAM and leave it comparable to something like a cybertruck..
Not only does this specific forum need a good how to, it would really be the best thing ever if somebody came on here to belittle all these EPS defenders, because let's face it there's two types of people in the world those who know how to work on their stuff and those who know how to just pay for it,

Right now I'm looking at creating a retro fit however I would like to remove the entirety of the circuit board it looks like one of the sensors Daisy chains off of it..

I think this is as per design so that you don't go and try to take this whole thing apart but the traction control system is also trash and the ABS system I don't think is really honestly even necessary in vehicles of the size I don't know who's still running the theories on the back seats anyway but I don't think anybody who knows how to design a vehicle has been working on cars since Curtis brubaker touched a javelin.

I purchased the 2012 electronic power steering rack because I want to see how different the boat holes are, I will be buying the hydraulic pump from one of the 2500 units that bolts right onto the 5.7, getting a set of lines and a bigger belt I don't see why this is a massive undertaking and rather a simpler fix,.

There is a huge irony that I see that I don't think anybody else sees in trying to claim that it's just easier to replace it because the electronics are so complicated to delete ...

If there was another way of saying I don't know how to work on my own crap...

So there are various electronic tools that you can use and it doesn't matter which direction that you go you're going to need to do literally the exact same amount of work, if you change the rack out you're probably going to need to get a scan tool that's got the capabilities of recalibrating it, you might have been dumb enough to buy one of the dorm and remanufactured ones that are promised to be this that and great I've seen them fail at 40,000 miles,

The only real solution to this technological nightmare is a complete electronic delete,

And a few sentences have already established what we need to mechanically do to line this stuff up over dealing with is the other systems that work off of these systems and I have found that we can box the old electronic power steering module and wire it up in such a way that we create a mechanically adjustable steering angle sensor by pulling it from the old EPS and the rest of the control board thinks it's doing something but in reality it's just sitting making the computer happy. You can leave it in a box in a place that's not going to fill with water.

This retro fit doesn't even require any computer and will work,

Problem is too many people who don't know how to use a computer have access to one. Trac control and abs don't work on these vehicles, anybody that's actually driven these f****** things understands that, if anything I think there should be a word for people that drive Rams that get that instant rage the second they feel that traction control kicking at the worst possible time because I know that we all share that stupid feeling.

Anyway this is a whole get over ourselves pose hopefully we can move forward with this I'll give you guys updates when the parts arrive.

 

[Ken226]