Got beat by F150 with a small boat??

[BlkXpress]

Like others have said.. loss of back pressure from the headers. That's the only reason I haven't ordered the new JBA headers... too wide.


Get a TC to make up for it.

 

[GotExhaust.com]

Not to pleased with the old 1500 right now. Took it to the drag strip last year went a 15.2 with varam, 93 tune, muffler delete. This year put some long tube stainless works headers on, no cats, custom tune slowed down to a 15.8. Cooled the truck pretty good, added 5 percent fuel went a 15.6. Truck feels laggy on the bottom and I thought it was my imagination.

Towed my dads challenger on my trailer couple weeks ago and said it didn't feel as strong and going to the drag strip proved that.

Then to finish the day I saw a f150 coming up on my driver side as we were starting up a hill. I start to get in it and hes still coming so I know hes in it.. I floor it and slowly watch him go by. Part that really burns me is he had a small fishing boat on the back. Non eco boost just a newer f150.

Not pleased and wasted about 1300 bucks.

I hope you honestly don't feel like you wasted money on the headers, because they would be the last thing on earth to blame for varying track times. I have no doubt that you are well aware of the various factors that can effect 1/4 mile times. I'd like to introduce some talking points for those who might not be as experienced as you are.

Comparing 2 track runs back to back on the same day can yield varying results, let along comparing track runs a year apart. 4/10 of a second difference is basically negligible for a 4x4 truck running mid 15s. If you were in a 9 second track car, 4/10ths is more significant, but still a small amount.

First we need to establish what you expected to gain from installing headers. Were you hoping to break the high 13s? I can tell you that probably isn't going to happen, especially with a 4" lift and plus sized tires. It's going to take a lot of power to offset the fact that the 3.55 gears aren't going to get those tires moving off the line. Just look at the time slip thread. Guys with the exact same trucks are running nearly 2 seconds apart on any given day.

Some factors are more significant than others, but each one of these can add or subtract a few tenths on their own:

- Amount of fuel in the tank - Gas is about 6lbs per gallon. A full tank run vs. 1/4 tank run can effect track times greatly.
- Speaking of gas, the quality and grade of the gas at your last fill-up can give or take a few tenths easily.
- Head wind vs. tail wind. Huge factor in a Ram with a 4" lift. Wind resistance is a major factor.
- Temperature. Huge factor. I know it was warm in the Mid-Atlantic this past week. A 5-10* Temperature swing can add or subtract a few tenths.
- Mechanical / fluid breakdown. Your truck is a year older, and you have stated that you tow with it. Fluids break down, engines lose power, transmissions wear, shifting slows...etc.
- Traction / track conditions.
- Human input. People get paid a lot of money to be consistent at the drag strip. Even professionals vary back to back track times by several tenths, and in cars that are doing the 1/4 mile in under 10 seconds.
-Tuning. Who tuned your truck? Headers will do exactly nothing if the truck isn't properly tuned.
- You are running without cats or a muffler. I don't think the primary size the problem, but you might look at rebuilding your exhaust to promote better exhaust scavenging (X-pipe?).

Besides all that, let's assume everything is completely apples to apples and ****** dory. The headers DO increase HP and torque. How often you find yourself hole shotting your truck like you do at the track is something to consider. The headers are not going to add 20% of low end torque. 60ft times probably won't change much. What the headers will do, is improve pedal feel and passing power. The ~10% gains you'll see from headers will mainly be felt once the truck is in motion. In a world where manufacturers claim 15HP gains from air filters, headers are the last true bolt-on power adder besides forced induction. Long story short, something doesn't make sense here, and I want to be of any assistance to make sure you are satisfied with your purchase. Feel free to call me anytime. 800-875-8511 x427.

 

[Flex]

^^^ That's awesome service! Hope the OP gets it figured it out! Good luck

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

 

[Lawhand]

im still debating on how to keep my back pressure up with my 1 7/8 headers, anyone got any ideas? i was thinking keeping the stock cats would increase pressure.

 

[dodge dude94]

I hope you honestly don't feel like you wasted money on the headers, because they would be the last thing on earth to blame for varying track times. I have no doubt that you are well aware of the various factors that can effect 1/4 mile times. I'd like to introduce some talking points for those who might not be as experienced as you are.

Comparing 2 track runs back to back on the same day can yield varying results, let along comparing track runs a year apart. 4/10 of a second difference is basically negligible for a 4x4 truck running mid 15s. If you were in a 9 second track car, 4/10ths is more significant, but still a small amount.

First we need to establish what you expected to gain from installing headers. Were you hoping to break the high 13s? I can tell you that probably isn't going to happen, especially with a 4" lift and plus sized tires. It's going to take a lot of power to offset the fact that the 3.55 gears aren't going to get those tires moving off the line. Just look at the time slip thread. Guys with the exact same trucks are running nearly 2 seconds apart on any given day.

Some factors are more significant than others, but each one of these can add or subtract a few tenths on their own:

- Amount of fuel in the tank - Gas is about 6lbs per gallon. A full tank run vs. 1/4 tank run can effect track times greatly.
- Speaking of gas, the quality and grade of the gas at your last fill-up can give or take a few tenths easily.
- Head wind vs. tail wind. Huge factor in a Ram with a 4" lift. Wind resistance is a major factor.
- Temperature. Huge factor. I know it was warm in the Mid-Atlantic this past week. A 5-10* Temperature swing can add or subtract a few tenths.
- Mechanical / fluid breakdown. Your truck is a year older, and you have stated that you tow with it. Fluids break down, engines lose power, transmissions wear, shifting slows...etc.
- Traction / track conditions.
- Human input. People get paid a lot of money to be consistent at the drag strip. Even professionals vary back to back track times by several tenths, and in cars that are doing the 1/4 mile in under 10 seconds.
-Tuning. Who tuned your truck? Headers will do exactly nothing if the truck isn't properly tuned.
- You are running without cats or a muffler. I don't think the primary size the problem, but you might look at rebuilding your exhaust to promote better exhaust scavenging (X-pipe?).

Besides all that, let's assume everything is completely apples to apples and ****** dory. The headers DO increase HP and torque. How often you find yourself hole shotting your truck like you do at the track is something to consider. The headers are not going to add 20% of low end torque. 60ft times probably won't change much. What the headers will do, is improve pedal feel and passing power. The ~10% gains you'll see from headers will mainly be felt once the truck is in motion. In a world where manufacturers claim 15HP gains from air filters, headers are the last true bolt-on power adder besides forced induction. Long story short, something doesn't make sense here, and I want to be of any assistance to make sure you are satisfied with your purchase. Feel free to call me anytime. 800-875-8511 x427.

^This guy is good.

GE is totally right when it comes to headers adding passing power, gears would help you get up into that power band much faster.

 

[GotExhaust.com]

im still debating on how to keep my back pressure up with my 1 7/8 headers, anyone got any ideas? i was thinking keeping the stock cats would increase pressure.

Back pressure isn't the concern in the sense you're saying. Back pressure means restriction in a modern engine. Back pressure is a term that was widely used in the tuning of carbureted engines, and not enough back pressure meant the potential for running too lean and doing damage. Adding cats will simply create a roadblock in the exhaust system, and will actually slow down the exhaust gasses. Back pressure...yes, but that's no good because exhaust gas velocity slows.

The ideal exhaust system will have the highest average exhaust gas velocity through the RPM range, with the least back pressure possible. An exhaust pipe smaller in diameter will have better exhaust gas velocity at low RPMs (better low end torque), but will introduce too much back pressure (restriction) at higher RPMs (less peak HP). The opposite is true for larger diameter pipes; they don't do much in the low RPMs, but when the RPMs climb and the volume of exhaust gasses increase, they allow for a freer and faster flowing exhaust stream at high RPMs which helps with top end power. I'm speaking in terms of properly sized pipes which are close to what would be appropriate size for the engine. Too large and the exhaust gasses would actually stop, and too small and the exhaust gasses could actually stack up and go backwards. Neither would be good.

OEMs have battled this balance between exhaust velocity and exhaust restriction by adding butterfly valves where the exhaust is routed through only 1 pipe at low RPMs and the valve opens at high RPMs to allow the gasses to escape both pipes. I think Ferrari was the first to do it, and I know Mercedes does it on some of their AMG vehicles.

Does that make sense?

 

[chris4x4]

The ideal exhaust system will have the highest average exhaust gas velocity through the RPM range, with the least back pressure possible.

Actually....The "ideal" exhaust system would impart the least amount of friction on the exhaust pulses.....allowing for the velocity to be maintained. backpressure isn't the concern....more accurately, its the friction of the pulses thru the pipe. Anyway....I like the site! Back to lurking

 

[GotExhaust.com]

 

[audio1der]

I hear you about the track times, but about ther Ford; How do you know it wasn't an EB? Maybe he debadged? Maybe he had a tuner? Even if he was stock-ish, unless he was lifted with big tires that's not an apples to apples pull.
Gotexhaust.com had some great points about consistency and driver skill; that goes both ways.

If your 1/2 ton is lifted with big tires, you've handicapped it. I hate to see people throw money at a problem, but it sounds likt the TC/gears are the only things that will help you now.

 

[chris4x4]

Just to touch on cats, as I saw it was mentioned, catalytic converters are vastly different than the just a handful of years ago, and don't crate as much of a loss, if any, as some may think. The old bead style were restrictive. Modern cats are a honey comb design, and have very little impact on the engines performance. They are larger, and flow freely. Larger DOES slow the exhaust gasses, however, being as the cats heat the gasses to burn off pollutants, the heated gasses expand, thus keeping the velocity up.

 

[mhb1638]

I also agree with what everyone is saying. However, since he IS lifted and on larger tires, he needs at least SOME backpressure to maintain some ideal torque...or of course stall and gears. I would put a chambered muffler on to introduce the backpressure as I really don't think a flowthrough will do much in that regard. As for a crossover, I've had bad experiences with FM and x pipes...so I usually went to an H pipe for that (or X and then MF). Either way, I think peopl ehave stated what needs to be done.

 

[chris4x4]

I also agree with what everyone is saying. However, since he IS lifted and on larger tires, he needs at least SOME backpressure to maintain some ideal torque...or of course stall and gears. I would put a chambered muffler on to introduce the backpressure as I really don't think a flowthrough will do much in that regard. As for a crossover, I've had bad experiences with FM and x pipes...so I usually went to an H pipe for that (or X and then MF). Either way, I think peopl ehave stated what needs to be done.

gears. Gearing to 4.10's would be about perfect compromise with 33" tires.

 

[mhb1638]

gears. Gearing to 4.10's would be about perfect compromise with 33" tires.

Agreed.

 

[UneasyJmitchell]

I think the OP was just having a bad dream. Maybe try having the 4 wheel drive on low at the track. That should get you out of the hole? Or maybe a 300 shot N2O? Its a truck, not a drag/bracket car. I bet the headers do sound great, amiriot?