Got my Ram back today after 6 months at Dealership

[RamDiver]

Yet they are still selling. Tesla isn't, but they are not the only electric vehicle.

EV sales have been pretty much dead in Canadastan since the incentives disappeared.

Now our current supreme overlord has negotiated with Beijing to sell cheaper EVs and is threatening to provide the federal incentives again. Even he can't be that stupid. I suspect he's just trying to **** off someone else, you know where.

What a ****!

.

 

[TradesmanGuy]

EV sales have been pretty much dead in Canadastan since the incentives disappeared.

Now our current supreme overlord has negotiated with Beging to sell cheaper EVs and is threatening to provide the federal incentives again. What a Ta rd!

.

Here in the US the infrastructure has not risen to the level to support EVs. And with the tax incentives gone or going, sales of EVs are waning. Read awhile back, GM I think, has backed way off its goal to sell a majority of EVs, verse Gas vehicles, by year XX. It is a sea change, and IMO not recoverable. Yes, there is still a market for EVs but it is shrinking.

 

[Docwagon1776]

I have read articles lately saying that the lawmakers are leaning towards removing the mandate for the start stop feature due to consumer demand.

We've got a thread on it already, but their was never a mandate. They got credit toward CAFE standards (the fleet wide mpg standard companies have to meet to avoid fines) and it reduced idle emissions. CAFE standard fines are now $0 and they are redefining pollutants at the EPA to not include greenhouse gasses. Because of that the incentive for stop-start is eliminated *at the federal level*. CARB still exists and companies still want to sell cars in CA and all the states that follow CARB standards. Then add in European markets which are even more stringent. As a result, it's unlikely they'll actually remove it.

Note the new Grand Cherokee has a 2.0L turbo motor with 35lb of boost as an example. There's zero reason to do that if emissions and fuel economy standards aren't considered.

 

[RamDiver]

Here in the US the infrastructure has not risen to the level to support EVs. And with the tax incentives gone or going, sales of EVs are waning. Read awhile back, GM I think, has backed way off its goal to sell a majority of EVs, verse Gas vehicles, by year XX. It is a sea change, and IMO not recoverable. Yes, there is still a market for EVs but it is shrinking.

It will continue to shrink right up until the political climate changes, when the eco-na zis gain control again. Then we will experience yet another wave of green foolishness.

Look at the history of roofing shingles. How many times has the industry shifted back and forth between asphalt and fibreglass shingles as being the latest and greatest 'new technological discovery'?

It must be another conspiracy designed to make us feel senile even before we get there.
Or do we call it human nature?

.

 

[MeatCurtains]

EV sales have been pretty much dead in Canadastan since the incentives disappeared.

Now our current supreme overlord has negotiated with Beijing to sell cheaper EVs and is threatening to provide the federal incentives again. Even he can't be that stupid. I suspect he's just trying to pi ss off someone else, you know where.

What a Ta rd!

.

World wide they still have seen growth and have increased to 25% of vehicles sold. That's before the global adoption of the Chinese evs.

We can stamp our feet and scream no no no but it's happening regardless of what we personally want or think. I thought hydrogen was coming for years and years and ignored all of the signs that it's not realistic at any point in the near future. My belief didn't change the fact it isn't happening in broad scale.

 

[Docwagon1776]

World wide they still have seen growth and have increased to 25% of vehicles sold. That's before the global adoption of the Chinese evs.

We can stamp our feet and scream no no no but it's happening regardless of what we personally want or think. I thought hydrogen was coming for years and years and ignored all of the signs that it's not realistic at any point in the near future. My belief didn't change the fact it isn't happening in broad scale.

People here tend to forget that the majority of consumers don't care about environmental impact one way or the other, and that includes EV buyers. Sure, *some* buy them because they think they are environmentally conscious...but most buy them because they think they'll be cheaper or easier to own or enjoy the performance and quiet of them. I know a lot of people with EVs and not one is an enviro-weinie.

The main thing holding EV adoption rates back is cost. Yeah, they aren't for everyone...but neither is the Rav4 or Camry and they sell a **** ton of those every year. Cheap, reliable, good enough for the appliance vehicle buyer. Influx of cheap EV options will increase adoption rates with or without incentives.

 

[RamDiver]

World wide they still have seen growth and have increased to 25% of vehicles sold. That's before the global adoption of the Chinese evs.

We can stamp our feet and scream no no no but it's happening regardless of what we personally want or think. I thought hydrogen was coming for years and years and ignored all of the signs that it's not realistic at any point in the near future. My belief didn't change the fact it isn't happening in broad scale.

I may not be looking outside of my bubble, but I understand that North America is only a tiny blip in the global auto sales stats.

I can't locate those 25% stats. Do you have a link?

The closest thing I found to current is the following article.

https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/climate-energy/global-ev-sales-growth-likely-slow-after-20-jump-rocky-2025-research-firm-says-2026-01-14/

.

 

[joesstripclub]

Note the new Grand Cherokee has a 2.0L turbo motor with 35lb of boost as an example. There's zero reason to do that if emissions and fuel economy standards aren't considered.

Those are wild boost levels. Talk about a ticking time bomb of a motor with the way things are manufactured now.

 

[Yardbird]

Who wants to drive out of the way to find a dark charging station in a bad part of town, then sit there for 45 minutes or more trying to charge, if the charger actually works.

These examples are from actual EV owners on Youtube.

One leased his, and between constant breakdowns and updates that need to be done at the dealer, he parked his until the lease runs out.

 

[KeithP]

6 months is unreal. Hopefully, the folks at Stellantis take into consideration that 'Auto Stop/Start' is no longer required or desired, and thus Stellantis would actually install Hemi's without the atrocious

 

[Fast69Mopar]

6 months, thats a joke. They shouldve taken one off another vehicle and got you back on the road. If someone ever comes up with an Etorque delete where a stanfard Alternator can be fitted I'll be all over it. So far my 23 has been good.

I wish it was that easy being a dealer tech. In my 25 plus years on the line we have never been allowed to remove parts from one vehicle to repair a customer unit. The reason we cannot do that kind of work is because if the vehicle returns for repairs of the same part Mopar cannot warranty the part with the manufacturer.

Only under certain circumstances have we ever been able to use a part from one vehicle to repair another and that was only under the direction of the Chrysler Zone Tech.

 

[KeithP]

Eliminating the eTorque will not eliminate the start/stop. They are only connected b/c Ram chose to use the MGU to restart the engine after temporary stops as opposed to the conventional flywheel starter like Ford, GM and every other vehicle with s/s on it uses. Vise/versa eliminating the eTorque won’t eliminate the S/S. They’ll just use the flywheel started and it’ll be even more annoying. I know b/c my company provided truck is a 2024 1500 Chevy. It’s twice as annoying as my 1500 Ram.

 

[Docwagon1776]

Eliminating the eTorque will not eliminate the start/stop. They are only connected b/c Ram chose to use the MGU to restart the engine after temporary stops as opposed to the conventional flywheel starter like Ford, GM and every other vehicle with s/s on it uses.

GM has used an extremely similar stop/start as well called "eAssist" but I don't think there's a current production vehicle still using it.

 

[MeatCurtains]

That i

I may not be looking outside of my bubble, but I understand that North America is only a tiny blip in the global auto sales stats.

I can't locate those 25% stats. Do you have a link?

The closest thing I found to current is the following article.

https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/climate-energy/global-ev-sales-growth-likely-slow-after-20-jump-rocky-2025-research-firm-says-2026-01-14/

That is per our internal documentation.

I trust it's accuracy more than other news sources. I'll see if it's a controlled document or not and see what I can post.

 

[MeatCurtains]

I may not be looking outside of my bubble, but I understand that North America is only a tiny blip in the global auto sales stats.

I can't locate those 25% stats. Do you have a link?

The closest thing I found to current is the following article.

https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/climate-energy/global-ev-sales-growth-likely-slow-after-20-jump-rocky-2025-research-firm-says-2026-01-14/

.

So it is a controlled doc. Our numbers include the growth 20% year over year and 25% total market penetration, up from 23% last year.

It has some various data per manufacturer but I don't know what of that is open information but Teslas falling off and because it's such a large market share it make the growth slower.

I don't know where else to verify against this data besides what you have there.

 

[DanAR]

They put in a Tesla charging system at our nearby Crackers Barrel last year - about 15 units I think. There are usually a few Teslas backed in hooked up to chargers when we go there, usually with a driver sitting in them. It looks like a measurable way to spend a cold, wet, winter evening - sitting in a car for 45 minutes or so in the cold. I wonder if you can run the heater while charging? And the chargers are all out in the open and the pavement is always wet either from rain/snow or springs running up through pavement joints. Does anyone else kind of get the uncomfortable with the thought of standing in water and plugging a 500 V plug into your wet car???

And I didn’t know until recently that the charges bill you at a high rate if your car finishes charging and you are elsewhere and it just sits there hooked up. They are called idle or blocking fees and they accumulate by the minute if you don’t move the car. So leaving the car to go inside and eat a meal could rack up a pretty good bill for blocking the charger if you don’t go out and move the car when it’s charged.

EV - no thanks

 

[TradesmanGuy]

They put in a Tesla charging system at our nearby Crackers Barrel last year - about 15 units I think. There are usually a few Teslas backed in hooked up to chargers when we go there, usually with a driver sitting in them. It looks like a measurable way to spend a cold, wet, winter evening - sitting in a car for 45 minutes or so in the cold. I wonder if you can run the heater while charging? And the chargers are all out in the open and the pavement is always wet either from rain/snow or springs running up through pavement joints. Does anyone else kind of get the uncomfortable with the thought of standing in water and plugging a 500 V plug into your wet car???

And I didn’t know until recently that the charges bill you at a high rate if your car finishes charging and you are elsewhere and it just sits there hooked up. They are called idle or blocking fees and they accumulate by the minute if you don’t move the car. So leaving the car to go inside and eat a meal could rack up a pretty good bill for blocking the charger if you don’t go out and move the car when it’s charged.

EV - no thanks

I met a guy a few years ago, who told me that the Tesla Engineers are idiots. How so? To fix the charging problem all they need to do was hook up an alternator to the engine and charge the batteries while driving. I said the Laws of Thermodynamics and Entropy might be a problem. Now I was the idiot.

 

[Docwagon1776]

They put in a Tesla charging system at our nearby Crackers Barrel last year - about 15 units I think. There are usually a few Teslas backed in hooked up to chargers when we go there, usually with a driver sitting in them. It looks like a measurable way to spend a cold, wet, winter evening - sitting in a car for 45 minutes or so in the cold. I wonder if you can run the heater while charging? And the chargers are all out in the open and the pavement is always wet either from rain/snow or springs running up through pavement joints. Does anyone else kind of get the uncomfortable with the thought of standing in water and plugging a 500 V plug into your wet car???

And I didn’t know until recently that the charges bill you at a high rate if your car finishes charging and you are elsewhere and it just sits there hooked up. They are called idle or blocking fees and they accumulate by the minute if you don’t move the car. So leaving the car to go inside and eat a meal could rack up a pretty good bill for blocking the charger if you don’t go out and move the car when it’s charged.

EV - no thanks

You can run the heat at any time. There's nothing to "idle" so it's a pretty low draw. IIRC, you can pre-condition the passenger compartment remotely before you drive as well, but I don't know if it requires a subscription or anything.

I'm not really worried about the charger being wet any more than I'm worried about static electricity at a gas pump. I can count on zero fingers the fatalities resulting from charger accidents in my county ever, and any sort of accidental death comes through my office (with the exception of medical malpractice in hospital sorts of deaths, like if the surgeon nicks something important on the table in a routine surgery).

 

[Docwagon1776]

Those are wild boost levels. Talk about a ticking time bomb of a motor with the way things are manufactured now.

Yeah, it's crazy. What informed consumer wants this in a heavy ass SUV?

I honestly don't know that long term ownership is going to be viable with a lot of the newest offerings from Stellantis. How many of their bright new ideas are going to be the Hornet or equivalent?

 

[utley]

I have a feeling none of the supposedly green junk on new vehicles is going away.. California is still going wide open on their iron ****** control of all things green.

Since California, and the states that follow them, are the biggest auto markets, the auto makers are still lining up to do California's bidding.

I've read several articles, watched videos, and seen on newscast, that the automakers are not backing off from their green folly.

Plus, they know another administration could put all the old laws back in effect, and also add more.

We can hope, but I don't think any western state is going to back off.

I dunno, california just lost a bunch of oil production plants, fixing to lose a bunch more, and AZ is going under with them because they're so reliant on CA. The country's had enough of CA.