I have the 5.7 Hemi Tick.

[EdGs]

I'd be really tempted if I were ready to replace the engine anyway to give the trans fluid a shot. Nothing to lose at this point.

Buying a rebuilt engine scares me. My luck I would get the dud. A performance build would be different

If I was prepared to spend the $$$ anyway for a stock engine, OE crate engine would be it.

 

[maillemaker]

When I took the car back after the ticking was still present after fixing the exhaust manifold and bolts, they did supposedly run some engine cleaner through the engine and then replaced the oil.

But I am going to try this with the oil they just put in it. I will drain out quart of oil and put in a quart of ATF. Then I will replace oil with the Redline you all recommended. It has already come in.

 

[Burla]

atf has no use here.

 

[EdGs]

We don't know what the failure rates are. IDK of any reliable database that has meaningful data that tracks this - except closely held internal corporate data. Tach Tech once described failure rates he saw at his one dealership (~10%?) during the period of time he was there. That's a small snapshot in time.

Can't understand why there wasn't more - seems there's lots of data on failure rates for GM's L87 V8 crank bearing. Maybe because class action lawsuit opened up GM's records during lawyer "discovery"? Seems lawsuits are the only thing that force OEM's to cough up real fixes?

It would be really be interesting to see just how many individual stock cams that all dealerships combined have ordered and used in-house/sold through the years.

You would also have to take into account the number of crate engines ordered and sold as well.

Plus, factor in all the vehicles sold that used those particlar engines/camshafts, etc.

I'll bet it's a sizeable number.

It might not be totally accurate as some might have done an ouright swap to non-MDS, but even the individual sales of MDS cams would paint a pretty good picture, then add half of the non-MDS cams to that???

 

[maillemaker]

Today I drained off a quart of oil and replaced with a quart of transmission fluid. Possibly the tick is reduced, but still there for now.

 

[EdGs]

Today I drained off a quart of oil and replaced with a quart of transmission fluid. Possibly the tick is reduced, but still there for now.

In that video I linked, he said it took a bit to work, and he worked the engine pretty hard, made me a bit nervous, but it sounded amazing afterwards compared to what it was before.

Fingers crossed and praying for the best outcome for you.

 

[maillemaker]

OK, I have run the engine for just over 300 miles, with about 200 being city driving and about 100 being highway driving.

I could not tell much difference. It's possible that the timing of the tick became slightly more irregular but I cannot be sure.

Here is what it sounded like BEFORE I put in the transmission fluid:

IMG 2577

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Here is what it sounds like with automatic transmission fluid still in the engine after about 300 miles of driving:

after TF

After 300 miles of transmission fluid.

youtu.be

I then drained the oil/tf fluid and installed the recommended Redline 5w30 and a RP 20-820 filter.

This is what it sounds like immediately after the oil change:

After RL Oil1

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youtu.be

Now, I took this in to a shop, and they supposedly replaced the exhaust manifolds and broken studs.

But I swear the tick is louder under the truck. I did not put it back up on ramps to go crawl under. I poked my automotive stethoscope at various parts of the engine I could reach from above and while I could hear the tick, it was not as pronounced as I would expect for something so mechanically loud from just standing next to it.

I'm still wondering if it is an exhaust leak or possibly broken matrix in a catalytic converter. It is definitely louder on the passenger side of the vehicle.

Here is a video from the rear:

After RL Oil2

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Here is a video of a walk-around from the underside:

After RL Oil3

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youtu.be

What do you all think?

All I can say at this point is the "cleaning" using a quart of transmission fluid and an oil change with the Redline Oil and Royal Purple filter seem to have had no effect on my situation.

 

[EdGs]

That sure does sound like an exhaust leak to me.

It doea not seem as pronounced as your very first videos.

Might be worth it to check your exhaust bolts again.

When your engine is cold, reach in through the wheel wells and see if the shields are loose.

 

[Wild one]

Might be time to pull the valve covers and see if all the rockers are moving the same amount.

 

[maillemaker]

I took it to an exhaust shop today. They said no exhaust leak; Definitely lifter tick.

So, all the "mechanic in a bottle" tricks did not pan out.

 

[EdGs]

Well, time to decide: Repair now, run til death and replace engine, or replace engine now.

Sorry you're going through this, best of luck on a good fix.

 

[maillemaker]

Well, time to decide: Repair now, run til death and replace engine, or replace engine now.

Sorry you're going through this, best of luck on a good fix.

So the question is, what is the end failure mode of this problem? When the lifter is finally destroyed, presumably that valve will stop functioning. If it's an intake valve, then I'd expect no more fuel/air going in, so you'll get a missfire on that cylinder. But if it's an exhaust valve that stops opening, what happens then?

I'd like to just "drive it to failure" but if it's going to leave my wife stranded on the side of the road instead of being able to limp home then maybe we'll replace the engine sooner rather than later.

It's $6500 to replace the cam and lifters. It's $11,500 for a new engine with warranty. I figure we have 143,000 miles on the engine anyway, we may as well replace the engine and hopefully be good for another 10 years / 143,000 miles.

 

[EdGs]

I dropped close to $6,000 on my repair.

However, I did the work myself, I had MOST of the tools to do it, and access to a lift.

Included in that are several tools I didn't have, a couple changes worth of conventional oil and cheap filters, one change of RedLine oil and a high-quality filter.

About $200 of that was for shipping on several separate orders when I found additional parts that needed replacing (valves, rocker arms, pushrods, etc.)

There was a couple parts I likely did not need to replace ~ $400ish.

I replaced internal parts like MDS solenoids, oil control valve, head bolts, cam and crank bolts, my timing set, etc. SOME shops may not do this.

Plus, ALL internal parts I replaced were OE, and from reputable sources. NO AMAZON OR EBAY PARTS, TOO MUCH RISK.

Find out what is included in your service, if OE parts, etc., just to be safe.

Best wishes for a smooth repair.

 

[Xsen]

But if it's an exhaust valve that stops opening, what happens then?

This is a good point. But do exhaust lifters even fail? All I've seen and heard about were intake. And no, it will not completely shut your cylinder down, just misfires under load and sometimes that cylinder would introduce spark knock, that you will hear under slight acceleration due to lean conditions, as the valve fails to open normally.

As for the sound - welp, I had a pretty similar sound, that was very audible around the truck, specifically if I stood close the passenger door, it felt as if it was amplified by the exhaust tubes.

Intake #2 roller stuck, cam lobe gone. Cylinders and pistons had wear too. Here's my post about that engine repair.

 

[Hagar1]

This is the tear down that's really scary,lol
@EdGs check it out at about the 38 minute mark,as that's the main bolt that builds up sludge if you do have a sludge buildup,which you really didn't have

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Any theories on why the sludge builds up in that front main bolt area?

 

[Wild one]

Any theories on why the sludge builds up in that front main bolt area?

About all i have is it's probably one of the coldest spots on the block,as the front of an engine is always colder then the back,due to airflow hitting it,and oil flow slows down to make the corner to the mains.
This video by Powell Machining goes into pretty good detail on the hemi's lack luster oiling system,about the 3:50 mark he shows how the oil makes a turn to feed the mains. It's worth spending the 13 minutes to watch this video.

We look into the Hemi lifter failures and the dreaded Hemi tick

We unpack the lifter oiling issue that plague the late Hemi.Powellmachineinc.comIf you want to support us financially https://cash.app/$PowellMachine

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[Hagar1]

About all i have is it's probably one of the coldest spots on the block,as the front of an engine is always colder then the back,due to airflow hitting it,and oil flow slows down to make the corner to the mains.
This video by Powell Machining goes into pretty good detail on the hemi's lack luster oiling system,about the 3:50 mark he shows how the oil makes a turn to feed the mains. It's worth spenfing the 13 minutes to watch this video.

We look into the Hemi lifter failures and the dreaded Hemi tick

We unpack the lifter oiling issue that plague the late Hemi.Powellmachineinc.comIf you want to support us financially https://cash.app/$PowellMachine

www.youtube.com

That is mostly my thoughts as well, when any fluid makes a sharp turn, some "suspended" components can not make the turn. We can see that in various situations. I suspect oil flow is no different.
That and like you say, the front of the engine will be somewhat cooler than the rear. Maybe next summer I'll hook up some thermocouples onto my engine to see what the difference might be.
But for now with winter in Northern Ontario, I am content to sit in my office, drinking coffee and playing on my computer.

 

[Wild one]

That is mostly my thoughts as well, when any fluid makes a sharp turn, some "suspended" components can not make the turn. We can see that in various situations. I suspect oil flow is no different.
That and like you say, the front of the engine will be somewhat cooler than the rear. Maybe next summer I'll hook up some thermocouples onto my engine to see what the difference might be.
But for now with winter in Northern Ontario, I am content to sit in my office, drinking coffee and playing on my computer.

You could always tell on an Canuck engine,which people ran cardboard or a winter front on their vehicles in the winter and which ones who didn't, by the wear on the front cylinders. Smallblock Chevies in a truck were the worst,as the front cylinders always had more wear then the rear cylinders,because the front of the engine always ran cooler,especially in the mid 70's trucks

 

[Burla]