Lifter failure, found 75% of pieces. Chances that pieces not found cause a problem after new cam/lifters?

[mike_1234]

2014 Ram 1500 5.7 (149,000) miles on it. Had the check engine light come on 6 months ago. Also noticed engine shaking when going up hill. Once I dug into diagnosing everything. I determined I had the lifter tick issue. I drove the truck on very light small trips since , maybe 100-200 miles or so (as it could handle light acceleration. for a while . Seems to idle pretty normal and operate normally, except for (hearing the tick) and or harder acceleration.) until I was able to line up a time for me to attempt the repair myself. I intend on replacing camshaft, lifters, and go to a HV oil pump. (will probably also replace mds lifers with new ones as well, while I'm in there)

My question is I took out the #3 cylinder lifters and yes it was destroyed. (see pics). I did find the 75% of the pieces in the oil pan ( in pics). along with your stereotypical amount of glitter at the bottom of the oil pan.

it got me thinking though. Where is the rest of it? Did the rest of the roller bearings get crushed or worn. Did the missing pieces of the actual roller, get worn into the glitter?

Or is there some metal pieces sitting in some crevice of the engine waiting to dislodge from its resting place and try to cause internal damage?

I know nobody can say for sure that it will be fine or not if I replace the cam, lifters, oil pump and try to get as many miles as I can out of it. But I was curious of opinions.

Should I assume this is not a good engine to replace parts because of the "metal shavings " or "pieces of metal" possibly stuck somewhere in the engine?

Or are chances in my favor, and other pieces probably won't cause problems?


I appreciate any opinions, Thank You

 

[Burla]

Pop oil control valve, that is what OEM uses to predict metal in engine.

That is interesting though, big chunk. No way that would have grinded into glitter, that missing piece would have tanked your engine.

 

[EdGs]

Man, that sucks.

Looks like there's still a piece (or pieces) of the roller and 1 needle still MIA. Pretty big to have been ground up.

Your lifter needles ground the roller pin down exactly the same way mine did, except my roller did not break. Makes me wonder even more if those lifter pins may not have been properly hardened at manufacture?


I have no clue where the missing pieces would have ended up. I'd be trying to find those pieces.

Have you pulled the cam yet? As @Burla suggested, pull the VVT solenoid, and see how much metal is on the screens, I'd be surprised if it isn't heavy with shavings.

I am not experieced enough to recommend repair in your situation, but there are plenty of members here who have done many of these repairs that can better advise you.

Wish you the best fix for your situation.

P.S., on a side note, this '14 also has the "upgraded" lifters. More proof this upgrade was done much eariler than 2016, as some have said.

 

[Randy Grant]

2014 Ram 1500 5.7 (149,000) miles on it. Had the check engine light come on 6 months ago. Also noticed engine shaking when going up hill. Once I dug into diagnosing everything. I determined I had the lifter tick issue. I drove the truck on very light small trips since , maybe 100-200 miles or so (as it could handle light acceleration. for a while . Seems to idle pretty normal and operate normally, except for (hearing the tick) and or harder acceleration.) until I was able to line up a time for me to attempt the repair myself. I intend on replacing camshaft, lifters, and go to a HV oil pump. (will probably also replace mds lifers with new ones as well, while I'm in there)

My question is I took out the #3 cylinder lifters and yes it was destroyed. (see pics). I did find the 75% of the pieces in the oil pan ( in pics). along with your stereotypical amount of glitter at the bottom of the oil pan.

it got me thinking though. Where is the rest of it? Did the rest of the roller bearings get crushed or worn. Did the missing pieces of the actual roller, get worn into the glitter?

Or is there some metal pieces sitting in some crevice of the engine waiting to dislodge from its resting place and try to cause internal damage?

I know nobody can say for sure that it will be fine or not if I replace the cam, lifters, oil pump and try to get as many miles as I can out of it. But I was curious of opinions.

Should I assume this is not a good engine to replace parts because of the "metal shavings " or "pieces of metal" possibly stuck somewhere in the engine?

Or are chances in my favor, and other pieces probably won't cause problems?


I appreciate any opinions, Thank You

Have you dropped the pan and cut open the oil filter yet?

 

[mike_1234]

I have dropped the oil pan, that is where the I found the roller bearings and pieces of the lifter roller. I have not yet opened up the oil filter. But will now (never done that before , and report back

 

[Grams]

The oil pump (protected by gravity and a screen) picks up oil and First sends it thru the filter before oil passes-on to the engine.

So, for planning purposes, any parts not yet discovered that end up down in the pan should never be a problem.

If you are pulling the cam anyway for replacement…you’ll likely find any hazardous missing-parts at that time.

So, If it were mine…. I’d press-ahead with your plans to replace the cam and lifters….but I’d also consider modifying to OEM non-mds lifters as another option.

 

[mike_1234]

Update to any who may still be interested..

I removed the oil filter and cut it open. Did not find anything noteworthy just old dirty oil. Did not seem to me to be rich with metal (as far as I could tell).

I removed the camshaft and well of course saw the cam lob that that was worn. (see pics)...

I took a little camera stethoscope thing and started searching inside where the camshaft goes, (just taking a wild shot at maybe locating the missing piece

(side note. I found an extra roller. bearing. and I have 13 in total which I think is all of them.. The only thing I have not found is the (under a quarter) piece of the actual roller).

I did not find the missing piece.. but as I was struggling to operate this wire camera thing. I did end up seeing this on the cam journal closest to the failing cam/lifter... (see pics).. as far as I can tell it looks like clear damage marks. I assume from the failed lifter?

I know this is clearly not a good thing.. But how bad is it? is it enough to say "don't even bother to put a new cam and lifters (and oil pump) in, ... this thing is going to fail"

I have 0 experience with building engines other than watching other peoples youtube channels. My general sense at the moment is that it is still a good chance that if i can put everything back correclty. I have a good shot at having many more years and miles off this engine.

But I could be convinced otherwise. I appreciate any opinions, or insight. thank you

 

[EdGs]

Have you pulled the VVT solenoid yet?

It's under the intake manifold at the front of the engine. I bet its loaded with shavings.

As bad as your cam is ground down, there has to be metal in your oil filter. The shavings have to go somewhere.

I'm leaning toward the replace engine side, esp. with the cam bearing wear. JMO, others with way more experience than me will give their views.

 

[jws123]

Usually I would say no big deal I have replaced over 100 cams in these things with a good flush they never have issues HOWEVER that cam bearing is NG kind of suprised not usually issues with the bearings. Unelss your able to swap them out by yourself just go find a used engine and put it in its not that big of a deal. Hunt around on fb marketplace you can often hear one out of a wreck run ect and get good deals.

 

[Gary Fields]

The odds of it causing a problem is just over 106%.

 

[Randy Grant]

A 100k plus on e-bay runs around 2.5k. A 50/60/k will run around 5k. A reman will run around 6/7k. This is on a long block+. If the truck is worth keeping, I would do a reman and keep it.