Transmission maintenance question

[Rustypipes12]

My 2009 TRX4 just passed 90K miles. I've done a lot of towing and hauling with it (in addition to some hard playing). I just changed the rear end fluid (3.92) and was amazed at how clean it was. No filings or metal to be found and the oil looked and smelled about as good as rear end oil can. I'm on the fence about changing the transmission filters and fluid. I've heard a lot of horror stories about leaks and failing solenoids when new fluid is added due to the high detergency. The existing fluid looks pretty good as far as color goes but after 15 years I'm fairly certain the additives are done. I bought a filter kit and Valvoline atf+4 fluid. I know I'm only going to get 70% of the old fluid out but I want to keep this truck another 50k+ miles if possible. I wondering if I should leave it alone for now or go ahead and change the fluid like I do for the rest of my truck.

 

[62Blazer]

I would recommend changing the fluid. In my opinion, any stories about new fluid causing issues are simply old farmer's tales. Most of these stories are from people who waited until the transmission was already acting up or had signs of issues. In a desperate attempt to "fix" the issues they already have, they changed the fluid. The transmission then fails shortly afterwards. Of course they blame the failure on the fluid change and not on the fact the transmission was already on the way out.

 

[caulk04]

Do the service. I'd recommend OE filters from the dealer though, there used to be a real problem with aftermarket filters for the RFE trans. They are easy to source and reasonably priced.

 

[NCRaineman]

90k miles is a fine time to do the trans service on an RFE, especially if it is still running fine.

The old "don't bother changing trans fluid" tales are for people who wait until 100k+ miles and the thing is already slipping before doing a fluid service as a hail Mary in hopes of avoiding a full rebuild. If it's slipping the damage has been done and odds are changing the fluid won't help.

 

[Ken226]

Change it.

 

[ppine]

When in doubt, change it. That goes for all fluids all the time.
Modern vehicles last a long time, especially diesels. We have to adjust our thinking and use some inutition.

 

[Tominator223]

Put a lil blue thread locker on the spin on filter. Just to be safe. And don’t over tighten it , as the plastic nipple can crack.

 

[Burla]

Get this one found by u&a aka Kyle has been serving this forum 15 years or so. It has to be that exact one, the billet ones you buy are loose in the cavity, this one is tight, plus dirt cheap so winner winner. You need this item, when the plastic ones fail they take the transmission with it.

Change it, drop pan and filters is 8 quarts, might have plans to be able to get another quart if you let it drain over night. As said, at least for the sump filter the funny looking one, you need Mopar OEM and it is $ now, buck up and get this not the wix. If you opt for the cheap version, it is hit or miss if it works from reports on the board, not lately but more then 10 years ago. Make sure you get the o ring out with the sump filter, you don't want to accidentally have two on that spot.

 

[Burla]

For what it's worth, I like gasket maker. If you use gasket maker high temp they want you to let it dry over night before you add fluid. At least go 4 hours after you put pan back. If you put a good bead on and around screw holes, it isn't gonna leak.

 

[Gary Fields]

I had the owner of a transmission shop explain this myth / truth of changing fluid causes old transmissions to fail. Over the years the moving parts- clutches, discs, and widgets wear down a little. They also get a coating of varnish or "gunk" on them. The wear and build up of gunk usually balance out for a while. An owner will often have some slipping and hard shifts because parts are not moving the way they are supposed to. Many owners will change the fluid to see if it fixes it. The new transmission fluid has a new dose of detergents and friction reducer additives. The detergent cleans the varnish and gunk off parts and the friction reducers make it slip and slid real nice. In effect the new transmission fluid is doing exactly what it is supposed to do. I learned this after I changed a Ford's fluid and it would barely move, I made it to the shop and had it rebuilt for another 125,000 miles. Owner of shop said if you don't have any problems you probably won't have any after changing. If you have problems it will probably get worse and you'll need a rebuild.

 

[Jeepwalker]

So your tk has the RFE transmission.

If it was my truck I would change it. There is likely a lot of suspended micro metal bits in the fluid. Now would be a perfect time to do it. Your truck isn't high mileage. 300k is high mileage.

But I would ONLY use Mopar fluid. Because the additive pkg is going to be 100% the same as what your truck currently has. Going with another fluid the additive pkg can vary. People will say, they're all the same, they're not. Whenever I've replaced fluids the times I've had issues is when I went with different types of fluids. And, if my tk developed 'shudder' replacing with another fluid resolved that. So, stick with the Mopar fluid is my recommendation. Plus you'll never have to worry about remembering which brand you put in which vehicle. I would use a Mopar trans kit too, incl the spin-on filter inside. Don't try to save $20.

If you do it yourself, we have two local family run dealers who will literally sell ATF+4 out of their bulk barrels (put in milk jugs!) for less than I used to be able to buy it online. They want you to buy it by the gallon (or half gallon...no qts). So maybe call some of your local (smaller) dealers' parts dept and ask if they sell it out of the bulk barrel. You might call some of your local dealers. Sometimes they offer special 'tune-up' pricing..and it might make more sense to have them do it.

It should be a straight-forward change.

When I do my vehicles, I remove the cooler line and purge ALL of the fluid out of the torque converter... but that's just me.

.

 

[Burla]

The other myth from the 60's is that transmission fluid has detergency, in fact very low detergency when compared to engine oils, see voa maxlife. Phos is for grabbing, and generally speaking boron is for friction and wear and CA are your cleaners. What happened in the 60's with the thick oils of the day is someone would put a quart transmission fluid and note how good the engine was running, at the time it made sense to say it was cleaning, and that myth lasted decades. We now know what it did was just lower the viscosity so engines had less fluid friction and ram not smoother but quicker. Placebo effect. Now that we have labs, we can put proof to the old myths.

Why flushes cause problems is they spin the fluid backwards, not through filters, and contamination gets caught in trans and there you go. This is not an issue with drain and fills, like op is asking, only flushes.

You cannot start the torque converter dry, this would be a large mistake with potential to damage transmission. Drop pan drain and fill does not leave TC dry.

 

[Jeepwalker]

How many vehicle owners put off changing the fluid ...and then change it at 150k when it starts to feel funny ...thinking it'll fix the problems? Two weeks later the tranny craps out.

"Never change your tranny fluid!!!" they write in every forum for the next 25 years!

 

[Jeepwalker]

Or this:

Single mom takes her 12y/o vehicle to XYZ-Budget-Oil-Change place in the sketchy side of town for that $29.99 trans fluid flush and change. They put in whatever unknown fluid with unknown additive package and flush with the machine where the crusty oily hoses have been dragging on the dirty (sandy) floor, by guys who've been on the job for 3 weeks.

A week later it shifts like garbage and acts up. "See!! Changing the fluid ruined my transmission." She takes it to Mr Trustworthy transmission shop, he drives it around the block, says it's toast and need a new one for $3k.

And maybe all it would have taken is a small $29 tube of anti-shudder agent ...or use another brand of fluid, or maybe the 'right' factory filter, or the bozo high-schooler didn't put in a new filter seal, or a new shift solenoid, or a cracked vacuum hose on the engine ...and if corrected inexpensively, said customer might well have gotten another 100k trouble-free miles out of that tranny. A trans shop is tickled to tell someone they need a new tranny. Many keep a handy pan of shavings and metal pieces below the counter to show customers, "Look what we found...OMG it's gonna BLOW!!!"

.

 

[Burla]

Once you do your drain and fill, a year later you can suck the fluid out pan with mighty pump, as another way to help clean the fluid. I see some places now to get 100% new fluid, they drop pan process and add 8 quarts do not spin the fluid, which is wasted because then they do a total flush voa machine, those are exchangers they need to be full. So you waste 8 quarts new fluid, or use old fluid which sends it though new filters, neither is ideal. The only people that avoid this are people who have converter that you can drain, and then only fluid left over is in lines. We all keep waiting for the perfect mouse trap on this, maybe it is out there I am just unaware of it. All can be avoided if transmission companies would use an external filter, so we really need to ask why they dont in general. The answer is they don't want transmissions lasting forever, bad for repeat sales.

 

[HEMIMANN]

How many vehicle owners put off changing the fluid ...and then change it at 150k when it starts to feel funny ...thinking it'll fix the problems? Two weeks later the tranny craps out.

"Never change your tranny fluid!!!" they write in every forum for the next 25 years!

That'd be my dad, btw.

He only kept one vehicle more than 3 years and of course, it started slipping and jerking. With a THM-400, no less. He was so GD cheap (a great depression guy) he wouldn't even sell it to me so I could fix it.

 

[truck2569]

My 2009 TRX4 just passed 90K miles. I've done a lot of towing and hauling with it (in addition to some hard playing). I just changed the rear end fluid (3.92) and was amazed at how clean it was. No filings or metal to be found and the oil looked and smelled about as good as rear end oil can. I'm on the fence about changing the transmission filters and fluid. I've heard a lot of horror stories about leaks and failing solenoids when new fluid is added due to the high detergency. The existing fluid looks pretty good as far as color goes but after 15 years I'm fairly certain the additives are done. I bought a filter kit and Valvoline atf+4 fluid. I know I'm only going to get 70% of the old fluid out but I want to keep this truck another 50k+ miles if possible. I wondering if I should leave it alone for now or go ahead and change the fluid like I do for the rest of my truck.

What does your truck maintenance service sheet tell you on mileage when to change? I change mine in my Ram every 75,000 to 100,000 miles. I change the filters and trans oil. I have 600,000 miles on my truck now by doing a maintenance schedule on my truck.

 

[Dusty]

So your tk has the RFE transmission.

If it was my truck I would change it. There is likely a lot of suspended micro metal bits in the fluid. Now would be a perfect time to do it. Your truck isn't high mileage. 300k is high mileage.

But I would ONLY use Mopar fluid. Because the additive pkg is going to be 100% the same as what your truck currently has. Going with another fluid the additive pkg can vary. People will say, they're all the same, they're not. Whenever I've replaced fluids the times I've had issues is when I went with different types of fluids. And, if my tk developed 'shudder' replacing with another fluid resolved that. So, stick with the Mopar fluid is my recommendation. Plus you'll never have to worry about remembering which brand you put in which vehicle. I would use a Mopar trans kit too, incl the spin-on filter inside. Don't try to save $20.

If you do it yourself, we have two local family run dealers who will literally sell ATF+4 out of their bulk barrels (put in milk jugs!) for less than I used to be able to buy it online. They want you to buy it by the gallon (or half gallon...no qts). So maybe call some of your local (smaller) dealers' parts dept and ask if they sell it out of the bulk barrel. You might call some of your local dealers. Sometimes they offer special 'tune-up' pricing..and it might make more sense to have them do it.

It should be a straight-forward change.

When I do my vehicles, I remove the cooler line and purge ALL of the fluid out of the torque converter... but that's just me.

.

"But I would ONLY use Mopar fluid. Because the additive pkg is going to be 100% the same as what your truck currently has. Going with another fluid the additive pkg can vary."

You're in trouble now.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 126666 miles.

 

[Burla]

"But I would ONLY use Mopar fluid. Because the additive pkg is going to be 100% the same as what your truck currently has. Going with another fluid the additive pkg can vary."

You're in trouble now.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 126666 miles.

Of course the 8 speed is not a Mopar product but it's own product, so their transmission fluid is lifeguard 8, and it is basic fluid boron, CA, and phos and low visc.

maxlife voa.

 

[Dusty]

Of course the 8 speed is not a Mopar product but it's own product, so their transmission fluid is lifeguard 8, and it is basic fluid boron, CA, and phos and low visc.

maxlife voa.

Of course, looking at the spec sheet links you included it looks like Jeepwalker's claim is valid. So there's a difference somewhere in the additive package, especially with calcium. Now maybe folks look at this as "close enough," but who has determined and betting that changes in the recipe will have no effect? This is no criticism of the Maxlife product itself, but correct me if I'm wrong, Maxlife appears to be sold as a universal fluid. If true, I'd find no comfort in that.

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33-gallon fuel tank, 18” wheels. Build Date: 3 June 2018. Now at 126666 miles.