RAM dealerships refuses to service my vehicle due to low survey score (long post)

[Bdersch]

I can't read all of O.R.T response on my phone cause of the yellow. BUT overall I am not one of those customers that can never be pleased, is only in it for free stuff or is just trying to take advantage of the dealer. If you've been following this post you'll see that initially all I wanted was my truck to be fixed and to be taken seriously. I'm 25 but have a young face and think some of that is the issue that the dealers thibk they can take advantage of me cause I don't know any better.
If anyone thinks this dealership and case specialist isn't doing something wrong or illegal then yall need a reality check.
Someone made a comment that "what can I get now" is the wrong mentality. I disagree. I have been pushed around and drug around by these dealers and now by the case specialist... it's time to let the AG take over and let them take the lead. I'm not trying to get hundreds of thousands of dollars from them... all I'm trying to do is to get them to stand by their product and if they can't do that them I do think it's fair for me to get all different vehicle on their dime. I am positive that other people in my situation would for sure go after them for the money they could get (which breaking a law I'm sure they could get quite a bit)... bUT all I want is a truck that doesn't have a ton of issues and one that won't be a money pit in the future when the warranty is gone. I don't think that's too much for me to ask. I have been extremely patient and extremely understanding with these dealerships and now case specialist.

 

[Demon-HeMi]

bullying (or worse) is exactly what happened to the tech from Texas in this thread. As a person who has a disdain for dealerships, I didn't care for anything he had to say but to make an overt attempt to put his professional reputation in jeopardy because of a spat in an internet forum is just as egregious as what the OPs dealership did to him. Especially when a "super moderator" uses his tools to assist in that endeavor. If the tech from Texas violates the TOS/Rules of the Forum by all means deal with him, but just because he says some crass or unpopular things I'm not sure that is reason to "undelete" post he chooses to delete, or allude to the fact that where he works could be found and these post could be used to harm him. Because of course we all know that everyone acts the same way in person as they do in internet forums......... In fact all he was doing is defending his profession (right or wrong) which is what anyone of us would have done if it were being trashed.

First thing, let me express a warm welcome to the board, hope you find this place as much of a home as everyone else here has...

Without question i am the supermod that undeleted the users post, and i have many reasons for doing so, one of them being i dont think its right to start a war and then try to hide from it, if you say something own it and live with whatever you said, two there are so many bad techs at dealerships with horrible attitudes that if he is this nasty on the board and has that low of an opinion of people im sure that it has full reflection on his work, maybe not, but im not gona let someone blast out and make comments like he did and then just let them vanish like it never happened, the purpose of not letting the post stay deleted is to hopefully make him aware of what his words can do, and maybe be a little bit more attentive in the future, IMO how you act online is how you act when drunk, you will say exactly what you think and feel because you feel protected, a person needs to retain their class and have tact in all instances of their life, especially with dealing with the public.

Its perfectly fine that you dont agree with his post not being deleted but i prefer to leave them there and let people build their own judgement on that individual based on his own comments, personally i wouldn't want someone who spoke like that or felt that way working on my truck, nor would i want that person working for me in my company, i have techs that work in my shop and ive let many go for having an attitude like that.

Again, welcome to the forum, this is a great community that is here to help one another and has a great track record of doing so, hopefully you and your ram stick around for a long time!

 

[mdmachiavelli]

First thing, let me express a warm welcome to the board, hope you find this place as much of a home as everyone else here has...

Without question i am the supermod that undeleted the users post, and i have many reasons for doing so, one of them being i dont think its right to start a war and then try to hide from it, if you say something own it and live with whatever you said, two there are so many bad techs at dealerships with horrible attitudes that if he is this nasty on the board and has that low of an opinion of people im sure that it has full reflection on his work, maybe not, but im not gona let someone blast out and make comments like he did and then just let them vanish like it never happened, the purpose of not letting the post stay deleted is to hopefully make him aware of what his words can do, and maybe be a little bit more attentive in the future, IMO how you act online is how you act when drunk, you will say exactly what you think and feel because you feel protected, a person needs to retain their class and have tact in all instances of their life, especially with dealing with the public.

Its perfectly fine that you dont agree with his post not being deleted but i prefer to leave them there and let people build their own judgement on that individual based on his own comments, personally i wouldn't want someone who spoke like that or felt that way working on my truck, nor would i want that person working for me in my company, i have techs that work in my shop and ive let many go for having an attitude like that.

Again, welcome to the forum, this is a great community that is here to help one another and has a great track record of doing so, hopefully you and your ram stick around for a long time!

Thanks for the warm welcome, and thank you for the ability to allow me to express a somewhat contrary opinion "right out of the gate" without any ill will or animosity.

That says VOLUMES for your character, and I see why you are the supermod.

Thank you for having me.

I feel very welcome, I think I will really enjoy it here.

 

[Demon-HeMi]

Thanks for the warm welcome, and thank you for the ability to allow me to express a somewhat contrary opinion "right out of the gate" without any ill will or animosity.

That says VOLUMES for your character, and I see why you are the supermod.

Thank you for having me.

I feel very welcome, I think I will really enjoy it here.

no animosity what so ever here man, im well aware that not everyone will always agree with me, ive been married and that word in its self means that the man is always wrong, lol, seeing that you have a 3rd gen just makes me like you even more, i look forward to pictures of your truck and wana see what you have in store for it soon!

 

[mdmachiavelli]

no animosity what so ever here man, im well aware that not everyone will always agree with me, ive been married and that word in its self means that the man is always wrong, lol, seeing that you have a 3rd gen just makes me like you even more, i look forward to pictures of your truck and wana see what you have in store for it soon!

Definitely.

 

[O.R.T.]

Fyi the yellow is hard to read

Dagnabbit, I was trying to match the yellow the header font uses. Lemme try to fix that.
[edit] OK, it's fixed now, FFR the header/font color is "orange".

 

[O.R.T.]

..I don't like to speak in absolutes but I'm not even sure I would let a HD Dealership touch one of my bikes if it had a recall. I guess it would just depend on the severity and cost of the recall.

There are indy shops that can do HD warranty and recall work, so you should be able to find an alternative if you find yourself in that scenario.

Yup, Arlen Ness handles anything myself or a friend ever need.

I can't read all of O.R.T response on my phone cause of the yellow. BUT overall I am not one of those customers that can never be pleased, is only in it for free stuff or is just trying to take advantage of the dealer. If you've been following this post you'll see that initially all I wanted was my truck to be fixed and to be taken seriously. I'm 25 but have a young face and think some of that is the issue that the dealers thibk they can take advantage of me cause I don't know any better.
If anyone thinks this dealership and case specialist isn't doing something wrong or illegal then yall need a reality check.
Someone made a comment that "what can I get now" is the wrong mentality. I disagree. I have been pushed around and drug around by these dealers and now by the case specialist... it's time to let the AG take over and let them take the lead. I'm not trying to get hundreds of thousands of dollars from them... all I'm trying to do is to get them to stand by their product and if they can't do that them I do think it's fair for me to get all different vehicle on their dime. I am positive that other people in my situation would for sure go after them for the money they could get (which breaking a law I'm sure they could get quite a bit)... bUT all I want is a truck that doesn't have a ton of issues and one that won't be a money pit in the future when the warranty is gone. I don't think that's too much for me to ask. I have been extremely patient and extremely understanding with these dealerships and now case specialist.

Yup. Oddly enough (hope it's not karma) I'm in your shoes right now over a warranty issue. A completely benign thing that was handled miserably, by of all industries one I've put a separate ton of time into. It's a recreation/bicycling/apparel/accessory company who's seamstress royally screwed up two small and simple repairs. I called b.s. on it, showed pics, etc and if all goes as I was told I'll be getting two replacement items along with being able to keep the old items and get a local seamstress to fix it instead. I wasn't in it for the money, hell I almost bought new but because the items carry some personal nostalgia I just wanted them fixed. I even refused the new items but they're insisting on sending them. I got lucky, honestly. Not many managers these days take the type of accountability some of us do and he's earned all my future business back because he did what was fair/right. He stood up and said basically "Yes, We f'd up, let me fix this now." That's all it takes.

 

[Bdersch]

TL;DR WARNING, CliffNote(s): Don't Skip Over The Pretty Yellow Wording



Wise choice. OK, so at this point I'll offer you a couple more tidbits.

*Magnuson-Moss Act.

A. Prove to me, as a customer, that beyond a shadow of a doubt that these tires are the true cause of the tire winch failure.

B. That if these tires are indeed the cause of the failure, that they EXCEED the engineering multiplier standards of NHSTA and DOT.

ie: Engineering Multiplier Standards dictate that the failure point of any engineered item needs to EXCEED a standard rating. For example, it takes 1-1/2 times the amount of combined force and weight of a given item for the attached item to fail. So let's say that your OE Wheel/Tire Combination weighs 70lbs, therefore under whatever the NHSTA and DOT have as regulation, it take's an actual weight of "X-lbs" to fail. So using the 1-1/2 multiplier (that number is just an example, I cannot recall, nor do I have the time to bother trying to look up the true number), this winch should hold with a combined force of 105lbs before it reached a failure point. Does it meet that specific engineering multiplier standard as a regularly manufactured product? When was the last time this product/part was tested (or re-tested) and subsequently certified? Show me that and then test my problem part to the same requirements. Did it pass that requirement or is it a defective part like I feel it is? Well, if it's defective, HOW MANY OTHERS ON THE MARKET ARE ALSO DEFECTIVE?

C. Beyond just that, why the holdup, push-back, failure of business standards to remedy the other concerns?


There's some more I could give you but at this point it seems to not just be the dealership giving pushback and likely it's at the point where yeah, I'd want a reasonable solution too. Let the AG take the lead. Whoever you consult with there should be able to provide you with tips similar to the two above that they can then lead with.

Maybe someone here can post up what the tire winch looks like for the 2500/3500 trucks compared to the 1500 one. I'd try but it's almost 8am and I gotta get rolling. (Where I am going here is like I did for another application, bought the part myself and then demanded a second time an equivalent warranty replacement part or a credit. When I broke the person doing the push-back the fact I am a retired MasterTech and a PartsGuru now, then added in the two tips above the dealership's push-back crumbled and they gave me the part on a $0.00 invoice. I walked outside, grabbed the receipt from the competing Toyota dealership, and demanded they then take the free warranty part back and issue me the full value of the other part plus some time reimbursement. They laughed, so I walked over to the GM's Office, since I knew him, and asked "Hey, it's been what, like 7 months? Do you know about the **** show your Service Department Manager and New Part Manager are causing, and it's with of all people, me? Someone who knows the ropes? REALLY?" Reimbursement of better quality part, and coupons for dinner followed.

Keep your head held high. I hope we all aren't supporting a Problem Customer, but I also know from our interactions here you don't seem that way. You just want what's fair/right to be just that, fair/right.

Now that I can read this haha I'll respond.

I honestly tried that approach on the phone with the dealer. I asked him what the tire winch was rated for lbs Wise and he couldn't tell me. I told him that my spare tire weighed 2 lbs more then stock therefore it's not my tires it's the winch. He couldn't give me an answer to the weight rating all he said was if the tire is not stock the winch is not rated for it. That was his response which is BS cause obviously on a vehicle throughout it's life span people will have to replace the tires and some weight slightly more than others.

 

[nwelshdsc1]

The good thing to take away from this is that the survey is doing what corporate intended (well, sort of). Dealerships are worried about getting bad ratings. That tells you that there are real ramifications to doing so.

Of course the way it's supposed to go is that they give you better service you never give them a bad rating in the first place.

"ramifications"

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

 

[Pull Ya]

Maybe the people at corporate that require these forms to be filled out because they think it might be a true indication of what goes on in the local dealership service departments, should somehow be notified of what the "ramification" are for a Ram owner that actually tells the truth. I wonder who these people are and how you get ahold of them directly????????
Jay

 

[Bdersch]

I need to talk to the AG on monday hopefully but im considering emailing the presdient now of RAM

 

[huntergreen]

I would talk with the AG before I did anything else.

 

[ExpressRules]

Keep in mind that while the dealership is making an unfortunate business decision they have broken no law. In some ways they are actually doing a great favor to all RAM owners by telling us they have no interest in taking that extra effort to satisfy the owner, so we know to take our vehicles elsewhere.

 

[Bdersch]

Keep in mind that while the dealership is making an unfortunate business decision they have broken no law. In some ways they are actually doing a great favor to all RAM owners by telling us they have no interest in taking that extra effort to satisfy the owner, so we know to take our vehicles elsewhere.

by refusing to work on a vehicle that is covered under warranty they are breaking the Magnuson-Moss Act as far as i am aware.... and if they didnt break a law or werent doing something shady they AG would have dismissed my complaint.

 

[bookemdanno]

by refusing to work on a vehicle that is covered under warranty they are breaking the Magnuson-Moss Act as far as i am aware.... and if they didnt break a law or werent doing something shady they AG would have dismissed my complaint.

I'm glad you took my advice and contacted the AG's Ofc! I've been VERY interested to see what your outcome is. Hoping for the best for you and all others to come!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ExpressRules]

by refusing to work on a vehicle that is covered under warranty they are breaking the Magnuson-Moss Act as far as i am aware.... and if they didnt break a law or werent doing something shady they AG would have dismissed my complaint.

The AG will investigate many complaints over the course of time in many fields and while I hope the ignorant dealer in your matter gets punished in one way or another. no law is broken until the AG makes that decision.

To be honest. personally i would rather see their business suffer in both auto sales and repair work because word gets out that they can't be trusted. Your posting of your experience is a good start to that happening.

 

[Pull Ya]

I would guess that this is a civil complaint instead of a criminal action. Most AG Consumer Affairs Bureaus deal with civil complaints, especially if part of the resolution process includes arbitration. I am not an expert regarding the Magnuson-Moss Act, but I have never seen criminal penalties that attach for violations. This is just my experience, I'm sure there are some experts in this area that are members here who can/will chime in.
Jay

 

[Bdersch]

UPDATE- finally had time to make a complete and through narrative about ALL of my experience with RAM. Thank you to the member who sent me the email addresses.

Also, I updated the AG with some information. She said we still have to wait for their response before doing anything.

 

[Rado]

Best of luck to you! I will be following this thread

 

[O.R.T.]

UPDATE...

#HadToBro